Tassie

How nice to see you over here, Fran - and with such a good news story!

They don;t call it Futility Dog for nothing. And had to laugh at the boys 'copying' each other. When I had my first BC in UD, there was a lovely em Corgi competing at the same time. He and his handler lived up the other end of the state, so we only saw each other at trials. Bt every now and again, the boys would do the same weird thing - "he's never done taht before" - and it can't have been texting - this was in the days before mobile phones - we reckoned it was telepathy. And if it makes people feel any better, the Corgi, who was a beautiful worker, once ended up owing the judge points - had no scores on the board, and then peed in the ring (which was another thing he never did) . My Sam's best effort was to have nothing on the board going into stays - but he did manage those that day. I always reckon UD is character building.

Great weekend, ness - give the girls a big scritch from me - and Rory sends Kenzie his best sloppy kisses.

Go team Winpara. Gotta be happy with her, ness - especially that morning run - that was a cracker. And you and she are really coming together as a team.

Have PMd you with a suggestion, luvsdogs.

Way to go Allerzeit and Enya. Great good news story. And you know you want to go on, don't you - and seems like Enya is happy to as well. And while we're talking Rotties - I forgot to say congratulations to Dyzney - that's a big achievement.\

C'mon ness - have you gone shy or something - or are you off sharing your 'health food' with the girls?

Nice explanation of the difference BC4ME.

Baiting is what they are doing. They say not a problem for Devils, who are carrion feeders, but there's some concern that there may be a connection between the baiting and the reduction in numbers of Quolls.

You just had to do that didn't you RS (and you're no better, Amypie :D ) - you knew we would go there (2 slip leads and a Get Wet Duck toy later .......!) ET fic typo, and inlude Amypie in the blame list LOL

I would worry about her coming back through the poles. Susan G is very clear about avoiding that. Her trick for a dog that doesn't retreive the toy back to you for a game is to put a long light line on it. The other really important thing she emphasises is that as soon as you've thrown the toy you need to move away from the poles - probably throwing in a front cross move, to get your dog to come back without going through the poles. The movement needs to be pretty dramatic at first, and exciting, to get the dog to chase you, but they get it fairly soon. If your dog can hand target, that helps to get them back to you without going back through the poles - so move away, front cross, appropriate hand held out to get the dog to the appropriate side, excitement .. you get the picture

Hi TSD - take care on the road - oh a bit late - you'll be there now. Anyway - not sure what you're meaning about teaching decel on the weave poles. I'd prefer to just concentrate on independent weaving - you want the dog to know by himself that he has to collect to get his entry, and then keep weaving through, blasting to the correct exit, regardless of where you are or what you're doing. The challenges to put into weaving are things like entry angles, lateral distance, handler position and motion (to be ignored LOL), and toys etc scattered around. Once the weavers are totally solid, you can start putting them into challenging sequences - as in Disc 2 of the 2x2 weaves DVD. Know what you mean about not enough room to do reallly hard entries - my flat space at home is pretty limited.

LOL @ Amypie

Sounds like you guys might be teaching it with the 2x2 method - in this case, definitely avoid him coming back the way he went. You need a reward line - this is the direction he heads through the poles and the direction the reward is thrown. Helps to teach entries from all angles. Edit: you should also be shaping him to go through the poles on his own, and then throw the reward once he's heading through. Do not throw the food to lure him through. It's a frustrating process at first if your dog isn't good with shaping (Ruby is, Millie isn't so I am going to have trouble with her!) but once they "get it", you'll progress in no time. Yes the lady mentioned last night to try and get them to think for themselves and let them work it out and then throw the food, my mistake was letting him walk through and then clicking, he then came me for the reward, I must throw the food for him and not expect him to come and get it from me!! You can avoid him coming back through the poles to get his reward if you move yourself sideways after you click, so he comes back to you round the poles. (If that made any sense.) But the method really works better with throwing the food/tug. So you click for the movement through the poles and instnatly throw the food. On grass, the food needs to be quite large so it's easily visible. The idea is to promote and reward forward motion all the time - along the reward line. This is the line the dog will be driving towards as he starts getting the idea - and is what makes them independent weavers. If you get the chance, see if you can watch the 2x2 dvd - a few times - makes it much easier to see what you're doing and why. Yes I must try get hold of that video as I dont know where the reward line is... The reward line is absolutely critical to the program, Mas. It is an imaginary line going through the middle of the two poles, at right angles to them (it eventually becomes the line of the weave poles themselves.). If like me, you're rubbish at throwing , you can mark a line on the ground at home - or you can do what Susan does, and make sure you've got a tree or something to mark the line. You're always aiming to have the dog get the reward on that line, so that they will always be driving straight down that line. You can have a look at Sue H's vids of Dennis doing 2x2s on Facebook - I think she was using a bait plate once the numbers of poles got too great for throwing food. I used a tuggy with Rory, so I didn't have that problem. But yes - do see if you can get the dvd to have a look at.

Thought it might be useful to put in a link to the Karen Overall Relaxation Protocol. Protocol for Relaxation

Sounds like you guys might be teaching it with the 2x2 method - in this case, definitely avoid him coming back the way he went. You need a reward line - this is the direction he heads through the poles and the direction the reward is thrown. Helps to teach entries from all angles. Edit: you should also be shaping him to go through the poles on his own, and then throw the reward once he's heading through. Do not throw the food to lure him through. It's a frustrating process at first if your dog isn't good with shaping (Ruby is, Millie isn't so I am going to have trouble with her!) but once they "get it", you'll progress in no time. Yes the lady mentioned last night to try and get them to think for themselves and let them work it out and then throw the food, my mistake was letting him walk through and then clicking, he then came me for the reward, I must throw the food for him and not expect him to come and get it from me!! You can avoid him coming back through the poles to get his reward if you move yourself sideways after you click, so he comes back to you round the poles. (If that made any sense.) But the method really works better with throwing the food/tug. So you click for the movement through the poles and instnatly throw the food. On grass, the food needs to be quite large so it's easily visible. The idea is to promote and reward forward motion all the time - along the reward line. This is the line the dog will be driving towards as he starts getting the idea - and is what makes them independent weavers. If you get the chance, see if you can watch the 2x2 dvd - a few times - makes it much easier to see what you're doing and why.

Go Tango! Sounds promising.

Just wanted to say that my hypothyroid dog (Kelpie x BC) only ever showed hair-loss as a symptom - no other symptoms at all. Back in her day there was no blood test for hypothyroid dogs - or at least not down here - so after trying all sorts of things, vet put her on Oroxine as a kind of 'try it and see if it makes a difference" - thankfully it did. With Jessie, the key sign was that the hair-loss was bilaterally symmetrical. Having said that, do listen to Rappie.

Very sensitive to cues can be really good - but when you're a klutz like me, can also be a nightmare :D . Seriously, though, it's great - and it does put the onus on the handler to always try to be timely and clear. Yep - lots of flat work in the park is good. I'm like you - very little flat ground at home - can just about get 12 weavers in with a little bit of space at either end and at the side. I made some stick in the ground jumps from ness's instructions - pieces of dowel with long nails in the end, and jump cups from Clean Run, and bars only 1 m long. So easy to transport to parks and so on. You can do a lot of work with one or two jumps - dvds by Susan Garrett (One Jump) and Sandy Rogers (One and two jumps) have got lots of exercises. Now please can someone find me some time ...!!! I have to drive 100 minutes (140 km) and back to a meeting tonight after work .

Probably time to go buy a lotto ticket! I think places are scarce. No personal knowledge, but I know several of the instructors and people who train there - there are some awesome people, so I think it will be great for you.

I was lucky enough to go to the Greg and Laura Derrett seminar in Melbourne last year (in the 45 degree heat ). It was great. One of Greg's simple rules that the dog learns in foundation work is "I run, you run. I stop, you dig in and turn to me." Of course, it's not quite that simple, as the timing of the 'dig in' message is critical - to be really tight, the dog needs the information at commitment point to the jump - too early, they'll turn inside the jump (Good dog!), too late, the turn will be wide. You can practise this in flat work too. Running with the dog, and throwing the tuggy ahead as the dog blast past you - for the accel bit - also good as part of rear cross training; and running with the dog, dog ahead, and then stopping - as the dog turns back to you, the game of tuggy happens with you. Sounds like Zig is doing great. And it's never too late to plug foundation holes - foundation work is something we all really need to maintain (note to self ... :D )

Not quite sure if I've read the picture correctly - but the decel cue in Derrett handling means to the dog, dig in and turn tightly round the jump and come back to me - they would only back jump if you had gone too far up and were in the way of their path around the upright (and that can happen in a trial ). Usually the dog will have been trained to make the tight wrap before you put it in a sequence - like the one jump stuff that SG does.

I think it depends a great deal on the puppy class - wheter it's a puppy pre-school (prior to second vacc) or a class for puppies about 12-14 weeks and up. It also depends very much on the skill and experience of the person taking the class. I have to say I'm not a fan of any classes involving uncontrolled free for alls - way too much potential for setting up problems. Our puppy class at dog club is on lead (we don't have a fenced off puppy area), so the interactions between the puppies are a little more controlled - we try to do one at a time, and have puppies meet as many other breeds and sizes as possible. We also have a bomb-proof adult dog for puppies to greet nicely, whenever we can. Most of the class time is spent teaching people to teach foundation skills to their pups - focus skills, targeting, loose leash walking, positions, 'leave it' etc. We also have times in the classes for relaxing with pups and practising handling, grooming etc. I always find it a real blast to see how well people and puppies do, especially with the focus exercises. My young BC man went to a puppy class (again, post second vacc) at a different dog club where they do have a smallish fenced off area so some off lead interaction between pups - but not all pups off at the same time, and careful watching and coaching going on. He also went to some puppy show training classes. And it is fun to see them continue on the friendships they formed at puppy class.

+1

Yep - in a way it doesn't really matter - for any involuntary wee like that, you would do what you have been doing - keeping everything calm until pup settles down. (And then clean it unobtrusively with an enzymatic cleaner.) I guess you might see a slight difference in body posture if it was a truly submissive wee - pup would likely have a lower, less certain body posture. If you didn't see that, then I'm guessing it was just the normal "so happy to see you" that you've been working on phasing out. It's also possible that the pup might have been picking up on a bit of stress from you. Just my 2c worth - reading your other thread as well, I'd say you've been doing well - and now that you have a more structured plan, that might give even more consistency - and it's consistency, and a great relationship between you and the pup, that is the key to successful dog training, and a great life with your dog. JMHO