MonElite

To describe the situation better. We were inside the house, people and dogs (Rex and Diva) Bear was outside. Rex went to one solid door smelled the other dog and started barking, knowing the layout of the house he run to another room thinking of having a chance of going through the glass door. While he was barking Diva observed, while he run towards the glass door she somewhat followed him. Bear must have also changed the position from being behind the solid door to being behind glass door. By the time I got to the glass door Rex was going off his head Diva behind him watching. I pulled Rex away by his collar, put him in a bedroom where he carried on for a bit, I think Bear barked as well while he was outside. I dont think that Diva would have seen Bear being driven away, as outside was dark, and from inside you couldnt see anything apart from your own reflection. As to dogs and emotions - my dog freaks out when I cry, he doesnt know what to do with himslef. Once or twice when I was in serious depression really crying hard he came and licked my face and snuggled up to me. Otherwise he doesnt want to know my problems typical male He is very happy when Im happy I jump around he jumps around

Apart from what everyone has said I think its important for an istructor to admit that something is out of their league and they dont know how to deal with it. They should be able to direct the person to someone that can help the person.

Im also interested in the perception of the "other" dog of some events. Giving an example. My puppy had witnessed my dog being extremly unhappy and agro towards other dog (nothing happened apart from some spit and dribble on the window - as the other dog was on the other side of the glass door) but would she learn from that? what would she learn? She was only a witness of an incident.

I think she is doing OK, sits nicely, looks at me etc but I cant seem to progress with the time even by 1 second. K9 meant to show me what to do at the info night and I guess we forgot. Oh well, I'll will have to use my imagination and improvise myself. I mean Rex can do all sorts of thing and I can leave him near the food for several minutes while Im inside etc so I think somewhere along the lines I have done it right with him, hopefully Ill manage with her as well. FD and jbbb seen me do it at their place, not that they are experts but maybe they can tell us what they thougth.

I meant that type of a delivery, not from a peg, or the hand from behind you or otherwise, from under your chin? I mean of course amongst 99 other types of delivery..... you might choose to do on the day...

Since our pupps are more or less the same age I like exchanging experiences with you I do a chase the ball on the short leash - the ball is on leash (its more for me not to band down really than for her) she is on lead, goes bananas for it chasing it, makes me dizzy, grabs it and I walk and walk and walk in a cirlcle, she does drop it eventually. I can do lets say 5 of those as the drive drops with her getting walked so much she gets tired. I can also go down the lead, hold the toy and tug her with it, while I "kick" her with my feet, or when I run my hands all over her, under the chin, under her belly, covering her eyes etc. I sort of started having a rag over her as a distraction but she thinks its an toy exchange and wants the rag ;) And I can almost lift her on the tug, but try not to as Im worried Ill damage the bite. She has a leather fetish, she preffers the lead more than the toy I think. Anything leather is fab in her opinion. As to photos - check any photos Ive posted... Crop the photos so noone can pick on you, myslef included! Otherwise my mailbox is waiting!!!

is this something you do LL? just out of interest?

I demand an update on the pupps progress!!! with photos pls!!!

sorry what I meant was the handler was standing still, hands along the body the ball that he was rewarding the dog with he held sort of on his neck, his chin was holding it, head down slightly ball was between his chin and bottom of the neck/top of torso where the two collar bones meet. When the dog arrived he took the dumbell with both hands and all he did was lift the chin and the ball dropped straight into the dogs mouth. Did I described it clearly? Otherwise I might have to spend a day looking for that video.....

OK I know nothing about retrieving apart from what I have seen here or there. Ive seen PAXs dog way before last Xmas, in her yard doing the retrieve and he did one or two chomps on return. That was a big improvement since the workshop they attended. And his attitude was also better than at the workshop, so I can only imagine that he has improved since than again. Lisa is just a perfectionist with high expectations for him. But I have seen videos with different styles of delivery of the reward, not that I know the difference, but it must make some. How do you deliver the toy PAX? The one I have seen on a the video was released from being held by a chin on the top of the torso, is thsi of any help to you? or am I making more confusion here for everyone?

Kavik dont you understand? she should be sitting, droping, coming and chasing the toy like crazy. All under distractions. After all she is 3 and a bit months old and I have her for 3 weeks! ;) Ill be bragging tomorrow if I do it right tonight.

uppsss double post

Those high expectations of mine are letting me down every time. But after I read this Reading the above makes me think I should have the dog sitting nicely and be ready for extention of time in lets say a week, I have been doing this for 3 weeks and Im failing my dog badly.

In another thread there was a short mention about how dogs observe other dogs (higher in the pack) and learn by observation. Im somewhat familiar with the concept, but would love to learn more, so pls you gurus and non gurus exchange some info here. I have seen one dog being trained in drive and another dog not being trained willing to go for the toy. I have seen one dog go into guard drive and another to follow and learn from it. One dog wants a stick the other dog wants it as well, one runs to the gate the other one follows etc. How do they learn Im interested aobut the positive as well as negative learnings. As an example of a negative learning. A young dog sees other dogs have a fight. The young dog isnt in any danger its just a witness, do they assosicate the dog fight with something thay will want to do or something that they want to avoid? As another example - lets hope a positive this time - I give my older dog a COME command the pupp observes and learns the command?

Im vaguely familiar with dogs watching other dogs and learning from it (will do new subject on that as its interesting) but what do you mean? When I train/play with her Rex isnt around. And I ahvent trained/done anything with him since I got her. Well apart from few walks on lead, where OH takes him I take her. Than yes she just does what he does. Can I do a sit in the helicopters? well ok I have done this already and she is very good and now shows me the only trick she knows all the time , but I have stoped doing it few days ago and only been doing chasing of the toy with her, or fetch and exchange the balls.

Thanks, Ill try tonight.

The drive drops on the tie out extremly quickly, it doesnt on the helicopters. I will say it again. Not once from the moment I got her that my dogs stayed together when I wasnt around. Rex was inside the house she was out when I went to work. The saparate yard was more for him so that he could also be outside and have free use of the toilet facilities instead of being locked up for 10-11 hours inside. I always have something for her, either toy/play or food/treat or good word/pets. but she might choose to listen to a ambulance siren, or checking out whats behind the bushes over my offer. That is when she is just hanging around not on lead etc. She just doesnt know the word. so can I teach her that? In a formal way, lead etc. or do I not and just do the drive building for now?

Unless I starve her thats how it is. She had food available all the time when she was at the breeders. She is left with a small amount of food when I go to work - usually a bone. She often eats it. She is too young to be only fed twice a day imo. We have gone pass this, Im building the time. She is good for 5-10 seconds no problems at all, I just cant seem to progress from there. I guess this was my mistake I wasnt talking to her. She will eat it eventually if I just let her have it inside the house and/or Im around, or better still if she can show Rex how she can have it and he cant... I dont want that at all.

it doesnt seem to extend, this is what Im saying. should I be speaking to her or not while she is looking at me? 10 minutes? it makes no difference, she wont go back to it even if its there for an hour. Dont forget I feed all natural, very often its a big bone or a chicken carcass etc. it takes her time to go through the food. Maybe the biting through tough bones is tiring and she needs a rest??? In reality Im finding excuses for her

One more prob.... After I release her and lets say I feed her outside she will grab a mouthfull of food and follow me home. I go inside she stands at the door. She might go back for some more food but will not finish her food at all, will eat way less than half of what she should. Now - I assumed she isnt hungry enough - she is hungry there is no way she isnt. I dont want her starving every second day to raise her food drive, she is a small pupp and is skinny already, too skinny.

I have to admit that I have done that, if she got up I sat her if she droped I resited her, but how does this make her look at me for longer periods of time? If I resit her she will sit there that isnt a problem, she sits for everything now, for food, before I open the door/gate, before I play with her etc. The prob is the attention on me. Maybe she does have a very short attention span... This morning I shortened the sitting to make her win/succeed at the excercise, I also spoke to her when she was sitting and looking at me. But is this correct?

She is on the tie out, Im by her side or on an angle, she goes towards the food, cant get it, sits, looks at me than drops puts head on the paws not looking. I can say her name she will look momentarily than not look again. If I leave her not doing anything she will get up and find anything to occupy herself with, there is nothing around, so she bites the leash and plays with it. I can pull her up and resit her but dont think that the aim of the excercise is to correct the dogs position, by hands. Please correct me if Im wrong.

Ok so she kidna got the idea, only took us two weeks But.... I place the food, she sits automatically before I place the food or at my sit command while Im putting the food down. She gives me great eye contact for lets say 10-15 seconds. If I dont release her she goes into a drop puts her head on her front paws and doesnt look at me any more, nor at the food. I have a feeling that if I keep her like that she will fall asleep as she knows she cant go anywhere. Food is right in front of her 1cm out of reach.

Im not sure if this is the right place but Ill do it here anyway :D A bit of a brag for my little girl. Its been three days since she finally got the idea of the TOT - well more or less, and Ill be asking questions, as I dont think its ideal, far from it actually, but she stopped being interested in the leash more than in the food, although the food was always right there 2cm from her :rolleyes: She also got the idea of the "get it get it get it" command which basically is - grab the damn toy you fruitloop And today for the first time she was tied up to a fence and yanking herself repeatedly in order to get the octopuss we have been training with. Only for a minute or so, but before she would yank herself once or twice sit and look at me with a face - what do you want - why do you do this to me, I cant get it Im tied up up fool and I know I cant get it, so what the hell do you expect? She also repeatedly for the last 4 days will fetch bring back and exchange a ball with me easy 10-15 times time after time. Helicopters have been great and are great, and Im loving every little bit of it. She loves it more I think So Im guessing this will be start of the 3x3x3x7 K9? Am I allowed to teach her any words, it starts to p*ss me off that she wont come when I want her to, as she doesnt know the word yet. Can I teach her that? Anyway - my baby is doing OK only my wonderfull bougenvillea is completly gone, as she picked every leaf of it......... oh well its only a plant and can be replaced, it will take 5-6 years for it to grow, but hey if the dog is happy Im happy too

I dont think its exacty what you said, as they might get a positive value assigned to the dog right from the beginning and you dont want that. I think you are supposed to introduce and show that the other dog brings no safisfaction, hence it neutral. Any dog, cat, park bench or a tree - they bring the same zero satisfaction hence value = none. But hey Im a pet owner not a working dog owner. I want my dog to have a possitive value assigned to my whole family (not that its large ) and to some of my friends. Dogs I couldnt care less if she played with any or not, as long as she isnt dog agro towards any.