zayda_asher

Is there a breed where the standard crop is whole ear leather off to the skull? Genuine question, I'm not baiting or anything

Excepting that, just for the record, you point about them taking off the whole ear for the pit is incorrect. The crop you see on show Amstaffs IS actually the crop that was used on old pit dogs, when they were cropped, not all were... The hack the whole ear off thing is done by people that don't actually know how to crop, I.e. Backyarders. You are right in that they are normally done by twits with scissors and what they don't realize is how the head changes and grows as the dog grows. Most of the idiots were not going for whole ear off as the "look", they just did a botch job. They hack off too much ear, so there is nothing left when the dog has grown. Here are some photos of old Colby pit bulls. You can see the ones that are cropped have a crop that is the same as what is seen in the show ring, not the ear off down to the head. ETA: obviously I'm talking show dogs in the States, as cropping is illegal in Aus.

Is "Us" the MDBA? I don't ask for any political reason, just clarity on who is doing what I'm happy to help out, as you will remember I was heavily involved in the EDBA and was even on the committee for a while when some of the others had to step out. The crew here in WA is still going with a lot of the old members (remember Ricey?) and some newies as well. We're working on some stuff, but it would be good to have a concerted effort that was also consistent in approach. Let me know what's happening.

http://www.news.com.au/top-stories/federal-government-to-unify-dangerous-dog-laws/story-e6frfkp9-1226132051447

Antihistamines are on of the safest drugs you can use, side effects limited and not compromising usually. They are a life saver for many allergic dogs (although there are some who they are not effective for). Desensitization injections are also a life saver for those that they work for - one of my dogs would be an absolute mess with out hers. They also have very limited side effects, some dogs do become sensitized (my other dog cannot have immunotherapy, but is thankfully surviving with out) - it's not that common though and well worth trying them to see if they make a difference. The biggest problem with them working is that owners do not follow instructions and give them on time, at the right dose, etc, so some of the people who told you it was a waste may actually have been noncompliant in their usage of them. There is a small percentage of dogs for whom they do not work, but you don't know if you don't try. Going to the derm is definitely a good start. An allergy dog requires a management plan and that may include a variety of things: omega 3 & 6 oils, regular baths, limiting allergens in the immediate living environments, antihistamines, eye drops, ear cleaners, other topical treatments, special diet, probiotics, enzymes, psyllium, wiping dogs down after walks, jackets to limit contact with allergens, steroids, atopica, etc. It's hard work and takes a lot of money and dedication. A derm can help you put an appropriate testing, management and treatment plan in place.

Interesting comment on the story:

Hey, with a few exceptions, greyhound owners have been forced to walk their dogs with a muzzle for years (and they know the dangers of letting them off leash). You don't hear them complaining ... They are allowed to have their dogs in the house off lead with them... I believe Vic will be following the model for restricted breeds that means they can NEVER be off lead, even in your dwelling. They can only be off lead in their secure enclosure. Can't have your dog in with you at night, has to be in enclosure... Actually I do hear grey owners complain, and rightly so... Two wrongs certainly don't make a right.

Where does it say that?? From http://new.dpi.vic.gov.au/pets/dog-care/restricted-breed-dogs/frequently-asked-questions-restricted-breed-dogs "Dogs that were in Victoria prior to 1 September 2010 that are registered prior to 30 September 2011 will be able to be registered and so you should ensure your dog is registered as soon as possible. After, the registration amnesty ends on 30 September 2011, if your dog is a restricted breed and is not registered and was not in Victoria prior to 1 September 2010 then it is not able to be registered and council will be entitled to seize and destroy the dog." It's quite simple really - if you have a restricted breed dog or even suspect you do, REGISTER IT NOW and register it honestly as the breed/mixed breed you suspect it is, and it will be safe from complaining neighbours. Remember that it's the law that ALL dogs should be registered. People who are complaining about the fact that bully breeds must be registered or risk being seized and and destroyed have forgotten this basic fact. No, still not automatically safe... They can still be dobbed in or picked up by the council as a "pit bull type". You MAY be ok, but it is no guarentee. And even then, even if you don't think your dog is a restricted breed, you can still be forced to follow the restricted breed measurements, which no sane owner would want for their dog if they had done nothing to warrant it.

Here is a flow chart of the process... I don't think that's included with the FAQ, although it may be on the site:

I agree with you that there are a bunch of reasons people have their dogs off lead and don't act responsibly for them... but the "safe breeds" attitude is becoming very prevalent and it is a part of why people don't do the right thing with their dogs - I hear it a lot - "its ok, my dog is safe / fine / wont do that..." It is certainly one of a number of contributing factors.

I also assumed Steve meant to register as a restricted breed, which does normally cost more and also includes the costs of a suitable enclosure, which is around the $500 mark, a muzzle (getting a good fitting one can be expensive) and restricted breed collar (about $80 and they wear out and need replacing quite regularly)... so its not a cheap prospect.

Because it doesn't apply to *them*... they don't have a "dangerous breed" and their "safe breed" dog is ok... that's the natural fall out of BSL, it actually contributes to the compromise of community safety

Well done, you both did great!

Be aware also that they (gtg at any rate, don't know about the other one) will keep your dog's results on file for their use... I have problems with that personally... That in is on their FAQ I believe

If they were at all worried about it Aus never would've had BSL in the first place - it was already proving ineffective in other places when it was brought in here... We've had pollies say to us in personal conversation "we know this, but it looks good to the masses... what else would we do?" ETA: any sensible alternatives presented to them were not seen as making them look as good in the eyes of the masses, so were rejected.

The same reason they are persisting in using a system that has failed and been repealed in other countries... it makes the Govt look like they are doing something and it wins votes. Some ingnorant pollies may even believe that it will work (ignorant in this case becasue there is plenty out there to show that it doesn't - they only need educate themsevels on the issue to see that).

I was going to ask if any of you felt like you were stuck on a deja vu merry-go-round

And if you haven't, because you didn't think you needed to, then too bad for you if they disagree... that's how I read it too, same as what Qld did.

Those that have them need to register them (as should already have occured). Anything coming out of a shelter will have a breed attribution as they do now. No amount of draconian law is going to have any impact on the irresponsible.. that's the real tragedy here. Because that's where the problem lies. They don't just mean registered with the council though PF, they mean registered as a PB. My understanding that this means no off leash and wearing a muzzle outside of their property. Well if they're not APBTs and already have council rego, as I read it their owners have nothing to worry about. If they are using a visual ID to get "Pit Bull Types", then it wont matter if the dog is registered as what the owner believes them to be, it will be on what the dog looks like... I'd say that potentially gives people a fair bit to worry about. I suppose we wont know until we see the actual legisltion But it does sound to me like they are planning on doing similar to what Qld did. which is a horrifying thought

Worked on mine ;) Huh. Weird. Maybe it's just my browser then (icab) Could be - I just have crappy old safari on mine Some survey stuff just doesn't work well with mac either

Worked on mine ;)

Exactly. Plus no great value in agreeing with each other about how hopeless he is, and that you've won the argument QED. The problem is that from the community persective something must be done following such an horrific attack. Yet from this thread: - BSL does not work - It is impossible to determine what sort of dogs attack Education will not work with irresponsible owners. So then what? Actually there was information posted on models that have proven effective in other parts of the world but, as usual, people have ignored them.

Aww! Good to hear she is back on form!

It often only happens if someone has an interest in it and brings the topic into those venues, its certainly not across the board as a standard.

Indeed, they are the ones who lost out on a loving home for their pup because of their ignorance! Congrats on Alwyn coming home... what a cutie!