dar1stheory Posted October 8, 2009 Share Posted October 8, 2009 Hey guys, So we've had some great success with encouraging positive behaviours with treats and praise etc, and found that there are effective ways to "shape" a desired behaviour for tricks... But I'm interested in hearing feedback about how to most effectively stop undesired behaviour, such as: 1. Thanks to a quick lesson from the playmate next door, our boxer has learned the joys of digging... Came home after the storm last night, and he was covered in mud (white boxer), having an awesome time with a few newly created holes in the back yard... Our neighbour came over and apologised, (she takes him over for playtime in her yard during the day regularly) that her jack russell had regrettably showed off his digging talents earlier in the afternoon... 2. Taking things that aren't his, such as, shoes, paint brushes, tearing up boxes, and well, just about anything that is left in reach... Now I know that some are thinking, "put it where he can't reach", but that's just painful... It's not terrible yet, he hasn't damaged anything at this stage, (except for the cardboard boxes left out from moving house which he loved tearing in to small pieces...) But I'm just noticing the beginning of a trend where he seems to be actively seeking out things that aren't his from on top of tables, or from just inside our back door... He has quite a few different toys of his own, a kong ball, wubba, knotted rope, squeaky fish, tennis balls, treat ball, holey rubber football thingy etc... as well as usually having a bone or shmacko to chew on... We try and change up the toys that he has available, so that they aren't so boring being there all the time... Any ideas much appreciated! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nekhbet Posted October 8, 2009 Share Posted October 8, 2009 Taking things that aren't his, such as, shoes, paint brushes, tearing up boxes, and well, just about anything that is left in reach... Now I know that some are thinking, "put it where he can't reach", but that's just painful... if you cannot supervise then you either contain puppy or put chewables out of reach make sure you provide rotation and engaging toys to take his mind off actively seeking things to chew. As for the digging, you have a boxer and most will discover this on their own again either fence away diggable areas, put fresh poo just under the surface of buried holes and even supply a kiddy plastic shell pool with holes drilled in the bottom and sand in it for digging time and teach him to dig in there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
corvus Posted October 8, 2009 Share Posted October 8, 2009 Management. The best way to stop a bad habit from forming is to physically prevent your dog from doing it in the first place. If I don't want it chewed or stolen, it's got to be out of puppy's reach. We have loose bits of carpet in some rooms that our puppy loves ripping up. It's coming up anyway, but no need to let him learn how fun it is to rip up carpet. We put things on the loose patches so he can't get at them. If he keeps ripping up other bits I figure he needs something legal to rip up, so he gets a cardboard box or some junk mail to turn into confetti. You could try putting dog droppings in the holes your dog digs. Our yard is just full of holes. Kivi had a sand pit for a while as a puppy, but he preferred digging up the lawn. He's a northern breed and tends to like to dig depressions to sleep in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paganman Posted October 8, 2009 Share Posted October 8, 2009 Most dogs dig its part of their nature Ive found the best way is to put poo in the holes this usually stops them digging but then they go on to somewhere else With the stealing stuff the only way to stop it is to put things away so he carnt get them I guess if you leave it out then its fair game as far as hes concerned.Most people when they get a pup soon learn to be tidy and put things away Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dar1stheory Posted October 8, 2009 Author Share Posted October 8, 2009 You could try putting dog droppings in the holes your dog digs. That should be enough to ward him off, my brother in law has a bull arab/mastiff giant, and one day investigated why his monster dog wouldn't go behind the house down the path, he took him by the collar and tried to lead him through, and found that he was seriously petrified of our pups poo! Thanks guys, good advice, and like I said, I expected people to suggest putting things out of reach, but I was really looking for any suggestions on a specific (and positive) "shaping" method of discouraging behaviour, whilst I will most certainly try and be more preventative in the meantime! I guess I was wondering if anyone has had success in introducing specific items like toys, which the dog can recognise as a gift to do whatever with, and learn that unless it has been "gifted" to them, that it is out of bounds? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
W Sibs Posted October 8, 2009 Share Posted October 8, 2009 I do what Cesar (Dog Whisperer) does. Claim the object. Make sure the pup knows it yours and you don't want to share it. Stand in front of it, and wait till the pup backs off. Everytime he goes near it or touches it, I gets a 'UH AH' (Cesar usually does the Tsk noise). Don't leave till he gives up and surrenders. This actually works for me. Teach your pup the command "Leave It". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jigsaw Posted October 8, 2009 Share Posted October 8, 2009 With the stealing a lot of it is unintentionally rewarded because the dog has learnt that if he takes something you will usually chase him and that's fun! Management is the best solution. You can choose not to chase him if he steals something. Or you can "shape" this behaviour by marking it (clicking) and rewarding him. I have a dog that absolutely loves the chase, more than anything, it was unfortunately rewarded as a pup by various family members when she stole items. She mostly just steals socks now which I ignore if she's got past me unseen and I just pick them up when she's finished with them or if I see her do it and I am close to her I mark the behaviour and reward her - she's like "what??", there's no fun in stealing then! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Staranais Posted October 8, 2009 Share Posted October 8, 2009 With the stealing a lot of it is unintentionally rewarded because the dog has learnt that if he takes something you will usually chase him and that's fun! Management is the best solution. You can choose not to chase him if he steals something. Or you can "shape" this behaviour by marking it (clicking) and rewarding him. I have a dog that absolutely loves the chase, more than anything, it was unfortunately rewarded as a pup by various family members when she stole items. She mostly just steals socks now which I ignore if she's got past me unseen and I just pick them up when she's finished with them or if I see her do it and I am close to her I mark the behaviour and reward her - she's like "what??", there's no fun in stealing then! Or teach her to swap on command! My pup is gradually learning that "ta" means come over and I'll swap what you've got for something that might be even better (if I have nothing on hand then we usually trot off to the kitchen and have a poke in the fridge for something she might like to swap for). She gives me the item, if she hasn't already dropped it, and I give her the treat. Then I put the item out of reach. Getting her to swap things voluntarily was was a pretty essential thing for us to teach, given that a) my pup is already far faster than I am, and b) she is uncannily good at stealing cell phones... :p If she's insisting on chewing on something that I can't put out of reach, she gets a few warnings to "leave it", and I will offer her her own toys to chew on, then if she goes for it again she is put outside by herself for a while. She's 5 months old right now though, so I don't think that's unreasonable - whereas if your pup is much younger than this, I wouldn't expect her to develop much self control about chewing things yet. If your pup is only tiny, it's pretty much your job to supervise her whenever she's in the house, and immediately interrupt any naughty chewing by stuffing a more appropriate toy in her gob. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dar1stheory Posted October 9, 2009 Author Share Posted October 9, 2009 I do what Cesar (Dog Whisperer) does. Claim the object. Make sure the pup knows it yours and you don't want to share it. Stand in front of it, and wait till the pup backs off. Everytime he goes near it or touches it, I gets a 'UH AH' (Cesar usually does the Tsk noise). Don't leave till he gives up and surrenders. This actually works for me.Teach your pup the command "Leave It". Thanks guys, another lot of great advice and funny stories! charleswentworth, this was the sort of thing I was interested in, whether there was a tried and tested way of showing that something is mine and therefore off limits... Thanks heaps, I'll give this a try! Here's the photo of his face when we came home to find him digging... How could we be mad at this face...? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aidan Posted October 9, 2009 Share Posted October 9, 2009 Love your avatar! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vickie Posted October 9, 2009 Share Posted October 9, 2009 (edited) How old is your pup & how much time are you spending exercising his mind? The first thing I think of when I hear "destructive" is "bored". You have a very high energy breed & he will need quite a bit of mental & physical stimulation. BTW He is GORGEOUS!!! Edited October 9, 2009 by Vickie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monah Posted October 9, 2009 Share Posted October 9, 2009 Gorgeous gorgeous pup!!!! Great advice on here. I have tried everything with digging, and with mine (spinone) it really did not stop until she was about 18 months old. So, I just washed her face and paws each time, yelled out if I SAW her doing it, fenced off parts of the garden I wanted to save. With that orange plastic fence stuff used around building sites. Poo in the hole did not work for us at all. As far as stealing/chewing, it's up to the human to make sure there is nothing around for the dog to get hold of. Only things the dog is allowed to have (and that are SAFE) Leave it, is a great tool, but will only work if you are there, at least until the dog is mature. We have many green froggies here, and the dogs know to leave them as they have been taught, even if they land on their face I would definately teach a leave command, but would not rely on this at the pup's age. The ARGGH!! thing is great and a beginning. Just remember that he is a pup, and digging is a lot of fun, so don't expect it to stop or him to remember when you are not there to ARGGH! at him. ;) xx Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
W Sibs Posted October 9, 2009 Share Posted October 9, 2009 (edited) OMG... I could not be mad with that face. I will have to close my eyes while lecturing him... Edited October 9, 2009 by charleswentworth Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dar1stheory Posted October 9, 2009 Author Share Posted October 9, 2009 How old is your pup & how much time are you spending exercising his mind? The first thing I think of when I hear "destructive" is "bored". You have a very high energy breed & he will need quite a bit of mental & physical stimulation. BTW He is GORGEOUS!!! Thanks, he is huh! Well I'd like to think we give him enough stimulation... He's studying nursing at the moment... lmao Like I said earlier, we have given him HEAPS of toys, and our neighbour is home most days and will come get him and give him a couple of hours play with her Jack Russell (which really takes it out of him!) we walk him nearly every day, come out throughout the night while we're up and play with him, or work on tricks and obedience... I think he'll pick up pretty well on the "leave it" command, he learned not to go inside by just verbally giving the "uh-uh" cue, and standing there refusing entry... It's quite hilarious actually, the neighbours JackR used to be allowed in our house before we bought it, and Cassius loves to chase him around, and seems completely oblivious to anything else happening around him when in the middle of a chase, but when the JR runs in to our house through an open door, Cassius hits the brakes hard, and then turns to look at us like he's dobbing! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dar1stheory Posted October 9, 2009 Author Share Posted October 9, 2009 Oh, and he's 5 months old... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
corvus Posted October 9, 2009 Share Posted October 9, 2009 charleswentworth, this was the sort of thing I was interested in, whether there was a tried and tested way of showing that something is mine and therefore off limits... Sure, pee on it. I don't buy the whole "this is mine" deal. It's never worked with any of my dogs, and is usually pretty dependent on you actually being there to enforce it. Better to remove temptation all together. To a dog, if no one has it in their mouth or under their paw, it's up for grabs. The only exception is when you have a tyrant running the pack who will come down on the other dogs like a tonne of bricks if they so much as look sideways at something that isn't theirs. My mother has a dog that is a couple of steps down from a tyrant, but if he's left a bone unattended, it goes to whoever is quick enough to get it and sneaky enough to hide away with it where he won't find them when he comes out looking for it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
W Sibs Posted October 9, 2009 Share Posted October 9, 2009 charleswentworth, this was the sort of thing I was interested in, whether there was a tried and tested way of showing that something is mine and therefore off limits... Sure, pee on it. I don't buy the whole "this is mine" deal. It's never worked with any of my dogs, and is usually pretty dependent on you actually being there to enforce it. Better to remove temptation all together. To a dog, if no one has it in their mouth or under their paw, it's up for grabs. The only exception is when you have a tyrant running the pack who will come down on the other dogs like a tonne of bricks if they so much as look sideways at something that isn't theirs. My mother has a dog that is a couple of steps down from a tyrant, but if he's left a bone unattended, it goes to whoever is quick enough to get it and sneaky enough to hide away with it where he won't find them when he comes out looking for it. it works on charlie... truthfully, i didn't think it would work either, but when i tired on him. it worked. he use to love my pink fuzzy slippers... whenever he sees it, he would go crazy and try to take it off my feet. i had enough, after watch Cesar, i tried it on him. i "claim" my slippers by standing by it and whenever Charlie would try to go near it, i will say 'Uh ah' and gently nudge him away from it. he will carry on with the barking, and would try to get it... i didn't move and barely said anything (this took about 20 minutes). eventually he laid down and gave up. since then, i can leave it on the floor in the bedroom floor and he won't touch it. but, he isn't a hard puppy. i have it really really easy with this guy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
corvus Posted October 9, 2009 Share Posted October 9, 2009 whenever Charlie would try to go near it, i will say 'Uh ah' and gently nudge him away from it. he will carry on with the barking, and would try to get it... i didn't move and barely said anything (this took about 20 minutes). eventually he laid down and gave up. since then, i can leave it on the floor in the bedroom floor and he won't touch it. Uh huh, same thing worked with my hare. It worked with my hare because he's good at picking up patterns. He learnt that every time he went near certain objects I'd say "Oi!" and get up and shoo him away. In time he developed new habits that did not involve eating my things. It didn't work with Kivi, though. Kivi doesn't care if I told him to leave it alone. If he likes it enough, he'll be back again and again and sooner or later he'll get access when I'm not around or not paying attention and then that tiny bit of reward is all he needs! I haven't bothered to try with Erik. It seems quicker, easier, and more reliable to me to just put things up and if he gets something he's not meant to have, trade it with something else he can have. If he can't be supervised EVERYTHING is up that we don't want him to chew. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bubitty Posted October 9, 2009 Share Posted October 9, 2009 First time my dog tried to take something that wasn't hers I marched up to her, took it off her and said NO very loudly. I have probably repeated this a few times and she now does not touch anything that does not belong to her! I am a messy person and have my stuff strewn everywhere so there is no way I can put stuff away! She is 5 months old, all my shoes are laid out and she has never touched a pair! Doesn't steal baked goods left at nose height either! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alexis Posted November 7, 2009 Share Posted November 7, 2009 What great advice, i will have to try the poop in the hole thing on my girl.. shes just started to dig little holes in a few places.. I had never thought to use poop.. The whole "mine" is interesting too.. Lexi knows what is mine.. i know it wont last forever as she will get more and more curious as to whats hers and whats mine and try to test the boundaries a bit with what is "hers".. I think i might try to teach her that as well as we do have quite a few things that can be destroyed but cant be put out of reach, such as the bbq cover on the bbq, which she has not yet even thought of destroying and touch wood she doesnt even think about it.. By the way your boy is gorgeous.. I can see how you couldnt be angry with him.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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