angelsun Posted July 20, 2011 Author Share Posted July 20, 2011 nor will any ring steward working, be permitted to exhibit at the show under any of the other judges. You will be the only club in Victoria that I know of to implement such a harsh and unnecessary policy, and you will also be a club that can least afford to do that. Don't you realise that when you come up with arbitrary notions like this one you're effectively saying to everyone "We don't trust the judges we've selected to base their decisions only on the dogs they see in the ring"? CC I for one (and have club agreement) believe that it is not a harsh action. Our ultimate goal is to provide EVERYONE with a level playing field in a sport renowned for not being so in some areas and circumstances. Our goal is to raise the bar in regards to curbing the chatter so often heard at shows. Truth speak or not, the chatter is there and as such, puts a lot of people and clubs in the centre of disapproval because of it. There is no reason, why any steward would need to dash out of one ring, and into another to exhibit. The MAJORITY of stewards do not do this, and we will ask them if they are intersted in working the show. Although it may be a new concept here, these are rules I"m very used to abiding by and as such, I strongly beleive that they will benefit the club and more importantly, those that choose to enter, in the long run. As for Ozentries, we will take it into consideration. I"m all for keeping up with the new technology and encouraging entry numbers and lets face it, show secretary work is not appreciated by many! I will be (if the club agrees to use this service) trying to work out an entry fee to allow for their service charges so that it does not become too costly and as such, defeats the purpose of using the service. Thanks for the good questions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bisart Dobes Posted July 20, 2011 Share Posted July 20, 2011 You mentioned obedience trial/s - I love / prefer going to the country trials - just a nicer atmosphere & I have my favorites . Look forward to seeing when this comes up on the schedule. Just a question / suggestion but I think that Victoria is in need of another Endurance Test as well - any chance this club would look at running one of these as well, there are certainly the numbers to support it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blakbelgian Posted July 20, 2011 Share Posted July 20, 2011 Just a question re stewards: Our dogs our in OH's name only, he stewards and I handle the dogs while he stewards a different group. Will this be allowed at your club? BB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mandalay Posted July 21, 2011 Share Posted July 21, 2011 I like your idea of your stewards not exhibiting, but you will need alot of workers... Depending on show rings say 4....thats 4 stewards Obedience rings say 3......thats 6 stewards I do not know about Rally O ..... Good Luck with your shows, but from past experience you only have a hand full of workers... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
angelsun Posted July 21, 2011 Author Share Posted July 21, 2011 You mentioned obedience trial/s - I love / prefer going to the country trials - just a nicer atmosphere & I have my favorites . Look forward to seeing when this comes up on the schedule. Just a question / suggestion but I think that Victoria is in need of another Endurance Test as well - any chance this club would look at running one of these as well, there are certainly the numbers to support it. To be honest, I (we) haven't given a thought to an endurance trial! I really don't know much about them and what would be involved. Any info or direction to educate me is appreciated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
angelsun Posted July 21, 2011 Author Share Posted July 21, 2011 Just a question re stewards: Our dogs our in OH's name only, he stewards and I handle the dogs while he stewards a different group. Will this be allowed at your club? BB To clarify and put to bed any misconceptions on this and I"ll use my OH as an example: He stewards in toys and terriers but is done by mid afternoon....working is last on and just getting going, he would not be permitted to take a dog into the ring. The key here is physical presence in one ring, and then exhibiting in another. It has nothing to do with the belief that judges are less than ethical. It's simply raising the bar and removing ANY interpretation of same. Preventative medicine if you will. Now to address your direct question. You are not physically ring stewarding, nor have had any direct contact with judges/show committee etc, therefore you can enter and exhibit however it would not be in good taste to do so, if you entered the ring while your spouse was stewarding that same ring. There are many unwritten rules or proceedures and we are only attempting to work on a small portion of them. We realize the show world is small, and country shows are smaller, and do not want to cut noses off, however we recognize a need for this sort of thing to be dealt with directly to allow ALL others that are in no way associated with the show on any level other than having paid their same amount of money for entry, to get an unbiased (or allegedly unbiased) fair look/judgement. We will be offering Rally before traditional obedience and will be using one ring for all three classes. (as often is the normal proceedure) Workers in obedience will not be under the same strict rules as this side of dog sport is pretty cut and dried...dog sits...probably a pass...dog doesn't sit...doesn't pass..there isn't the room for interpretation or personal judgement as there is in the conformation rings. However, based on my homework, we won't be having problems getting workers for the Rally ring, as it will be required for any new judges wishing to get a licence so any chance to steward/work a real trial will be snapped up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wuffles Posted July 21, 2011 Share Posted July 21, 2011 I love love love that part of Australia so we might make the trek from Canberra for Rally O at least! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fraggy Posted July 21, 2011 Share Posted July 21, 2011 cant wait and support your rules Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ceilidh Posted July 22, 2011 Share Posted July 22, 2011 therefore you can enter and exhibit however it would not be in good taste to do so, if you entered the ring while your spouse was stewarding that same ring. There are many unwritten rules I would check up on this one. It IS a rule in NSW that you CANNOT show in a ring that your spouse, sibling, offspring etc is stewarding. I would hope that Vic is the same. :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest CaptainCourageous Posted July 22, 2011 Share Posted July 22, 2011 Here's the separate rules we're subject to: CONFORMATION 7.5.2 At an exhibition a Ring Steward will not exhibit or handle any exhibit under a Judge for whom they have stewarded at that exhibition. OBEDIENCE, TRACKING, ENDURANCE 9.1.1 Stewarding A judge or Steward is not permitted to officiate whilst a member of their family is exhibiting in that ring. They're the rules. There are no other rules. You should not make any up. I steward at All Breeds at least once a fortnight on average. Usually my wife will handle my dogs while I steward in a different ring for a different judge. Your new club would benefit from my stewarding and my entry, but for your own reasons as far as I can tell you see the two as incompatable, whilst no other club in Victoria does. Do we need to move to a South Australian system where stewarding contracts are issued and stewards are paid, entertained and lodged in the same way as judges? It'd have to add to show costs. To be honest, I (we) haven't given a thought to an endurance trial! I really don't know much about them and what would be involved. Any info or direction to educate me is appreciated. Here on DoL forums: http://www.dolforums.com.au/topic/212118-endurance-test-2011-thread/page__st__1065 They're a good mob there! CC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sayreovi Posted July 22, 2011 Share Posted July 22, 2011 Better be neuter classes. ;) ;) ;) ;) ;) ;) ;) ;) ;) ;) ;) Yup - I'll be there with our neuter + our other showdogs if there is . Same here, yay for another club offering neuter! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
~*Shell*~ Posted July 22, 2011 Share Posted July 22, 2011 We are VERY excited about the Rally trials that will be up for offer! Trip to victoria anyone? :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kezzzza Posted July 22, 2011 Share Posted July 22, 2011 We are VERY excited about the Rally trials that will be up for offer! Trip to victoria anyone? :D yes you should come down. Then there will be at least 3 Siberians entered in Rally Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ceilidh Posted July 25, 2011 Share Posted July 25, 2011 Here's the separate rules we're subject to: CONFORMATION 7.5.2 At an exhibition a Ring Steward will not exhibit or handle any exhibit under a Judge for whom they have stewarded at that exhibition. OBEDIENCE, TRACKING, ENDURANCE 9.1.1 Stewarding A judge or Steward is not permitted to officiate whilst a member of their family is exhibiting in that ring. They're the rules. There are no other rules. You should not make any up. SECTION 4 Show Stewards Appointments at Recognised Shows 4.1 A steward must not exhibit or act as a handler in the same ring in which the steward is officiating, nor must they act as a steward in a ring in which his spouse, his children, parents, brothers, sisters, their children, the parents of his spouse, their children, or grandchildren, or members who are members of his household, or in any case one or more of them, are exhibiting. 8/06 Made up? Not by me but by DogsNSW!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest CaptainCourageous Posted July 25, 2011 Share Posted July 25, 2011 SECTION 4 Show Stewards Appointments at Recognised Shows 4.1 A steward must not exhibit or act as a handler in the same ring in which the steward is officiating, nor must they act as a steward in a ring in which his spouse, his children, parents, brothers, sisters, their children, the parents of his spouse, their children, or grandchildren, or members who are members of his household, or in any case one or more of them, are exhibiting. 8/06 Made up? Not by me but by DogsNSW!! King Valley is not in NSW. I have no objection to the NSW rule. The issue in contention is one of different rings, same show, no judge(s) in common. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ceilidh Posted July 25, 2011 Share Posted July 25, 2011 SECTION 4 Show Stewards Appointments at Recognised Shows 4.1 A steward must not exhibit or act as a handler in the same ring in which the steward is officiating, nor must they act as a steward in a ring in which his spouse, his children, parents, brothers, sisters, their children, the parents of his spouse, their children, or grandchildren, or members who are members of his household, or in any case one or more of them, are exhibiting. 8/06 Made up? Not by me but by DogsNSW!! King Valley is not in NSW. I have no objection to the NSW rule. The issue in contention is one of different rings, same show, no judge(s) in common. No shit Sherlock! This is what I posted "I would check up on this one. It IS a rule in NSW that you CANNOT show in a ring that your spouse, sibling, offspring etc is stewarding. I would hope that Vic is the same." and you said not to make rules up! I merely posted the info that I gadn't made the ruling up sheesh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest CaptainCourageous Posted July 26, 2011 Share Posted July 26, 2011 you said not to make rules up! That wasn't directed at you. Thank you for sharing the NSW rules with us. I sometimes steward there. CC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ceilidh Posted July 26, 2011 Share Posted July 26, 2011 Thanks CC. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
angelsun Posted July 26, 2011 Author Share Posted July 26, 2011 SECTION 4 Show Stewards Appointments at Recognised Shows 4.1 A steward must not exhibit or act as a handler in the same ring in which the steward is officiating, nor must they act as a steward in a ring in which his spouse, his children, parents, brothers, sisters, their children, the parents of his spouse, their children, or grandchildren, or members who are members of his household, or in any case one or more of them, are exhibiting. 8/06 Made up? Not by me but by DogsNSW!! King Valley is not in NSW. I have no objection to the NSW rule. The issue in contention is one of different rings, same show, no judge(s) in common. No shit Sherlock! This is what I posted "I would check up on this one. It IS a rule in NSW that you CANNOT show in a ring that your spouse, sibling, offspring etc is stewarding. I would hope that Vic is the same." and you said not to make rules up! I merely posted the info that I gadn't made the ruling up sheesh. All affiliated clubs are bound by the rules of their state controlling body, however each club is permitted to bring forward policy that the club abides by, as long as it is not in contradition to the state controlling body rules. Our club believes that this SIMPLE rule will benefit more than it would inconvenience. We also believe that the majority (and this thread is prime proof) of the people, encourage such a policy and will feel very comfortable attending shows with this simple rule. We will (as mentioned above per NSW rules) be making sure that any allowances that we as a club, may have, do comply with VCA rules which of course is the final say. VCA however does not block club policies such as we are suggesting as they have no jurisdiction to state that any club must permit anyone/everyone from exhibiting. In the end, the club (all clubs) have the right to refuse entry of anyone. Overall, this policy we will adopt, has been happily accepted and we are pleased at the response regarding it. As for our Rally events...I"m simply doing the happy dance (on a personal level) because of the over two years its taken and the many plane trips and seminars I've been a part of, to help bring this sport to recognition. This event for me, in our club, will be more satisfying than any Best in Show I might have won in the past and I can't wait to see the exhibitors and their dogs enjoying it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest CaptainCourageous Posted July 26, 2011 Share Posted July 26, 2011 As for our Rally events...I"m simply doing the happy dance (on a personal level) because of the over two years its taken and the many plane trips and seminars I've been a part of, to help bring this sport to recognition. This event for me, in our club, will be more satisfying than any Best in Show I might have won in the past and I can't wait to see the exhibitors and their dogs enjoying it! How did the seminar that you put on go? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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