Lab Pup Prices

[GoldenGirl85]

Don't worry, there is a similar set of genes in horses controlling chestnut, bay and black and I was trying to explain it to someone on Saturday and managed to get myself confused let alone her! In my defence it was very hot and I was melting

I thought those three genes were easy, its the greying and dilute genes that get confusing...but after looking at horse colour genes for a few years now I have a fair understanding of it...I just need to get my book out to reference to sometimes lol

[SparkyTansy]

the confusing part is as mirawee said, that it is on two genes... yellow (which can mask black/choc) and the black/choc gene. If the yellow gene didnt exist, it would be a case of remembering that black is dominant to chocolate. You can have three different possibilities then, Homozygous Black (black dog, not carrier for choc - BB), Heterozygous Black (Black dog, Choc carrier - Bb) and Homozygous Choc (chocolate dog - bb). When you introduce the yellow gene, the presence or non-presence of the yellow gene (Ee or ee) dictates whether you will see the black or chocolate. a chocolate dog cannot carry black, because chocolate is bb, but it can carry yellow (Ee). In this case MG Gibbs' granddam being black would have been black carrying chocolate and maybe yellow, and Gibbs' mum being chocolate would have the bb which could never produce black unless the sire carried the black gene, in this case, Gibbs' father, who is yellow masking the black gene (eeBB)

Oh that makes sense now, I understood that there was 2 genes from Mirawee said, but I didn't understand how they work together...now I know lol

So is this possible, homozygous black bitch, if bred to yellow, can she produce yellow pups?

I think... yes... if she is a Homozygous (black) bitch she can still carry yellow so she'd be EeBB. if she's mated to a yellow (ee) she could produce yellow pups but she would not be able to produce liver pups. If she was a heterozygous (EeBb) black bitch, depending on the yellow sire, she could produce choc and yellow (if the sire was a yellow with heterozygous black gene)

I think... lol

Edited January 23, 2012 by SparkyTansy

[mikelli]

If you are interested to know more look here.

Go to the above link, shows every possible combination of colour mateings and the outcomes, no guess work needed.

[RubyStar]

If you are interested to know more look here.

Go to the above link, shows every possible combination of colour mateings and the outcomes, no guess work needed.

But we were having fun working out the why's and how's :laugh:

[GoldenGirl85]

the confusing part is as mirawee said, that it is on two genes... yellow (which can mask black/choc) and the black/choc gene. If the yellow gene didnt exist, it would be a case of remembering that black is dominant to chocolate. You can have three different possibilities then, Homozygous Black (black dog, not carrier for choc - BB), Heterozygous Black (Black dog, Choc carrier - Bb) and Homozygous Choc (chocolate dog - bb). When you introduce the yellow gene, the presence or non-presence of the yellow gene (Ee or ee) dictates whether you will see the black or chocolate. a chocolate dog cannot carry black, because chocolate is bb, but it can carry yellow (Ee). In this case MG Gibbs' granddam being black would have been black carrying chocolate and maybe yellow, and Gibbs' mum being chocolate would have the bb which could never produce black unless the sire carried the black gene, in this case, Gibbs' father, who is yellow masking the black gene (eeBB)

Oh that makes sense now, I understood that there was 2 genes from Mirawee said, but I didn't understand how they work together...now I know lol

So is this possible, homozygous black bitch, if bred to yellow, can she produce yellow pups?

I think... yes... if she is a Homozygous (black) bitch she can still carry yellow so she'd be EeBB. if she's mated to a yellow (ee) she could produce yellow pups but she would not be able to produce liver pups. If she was a heterozygous (EeBb) black bitch, depending on the yellow sire, she could produce choc and yellow (if the sire was a yellow with heterozygous black gene)

I think... lol

But if she carried yellow, would that mean that she is NOT homozygous?

The reason for the question is I went to the Guide Dogs QLD open day, and they brought out one of their black breeding bitches, and her 8 black puppies, and they were saying that because she is 'dominant black' which I understood as laymans for homozygous black, then regardless of what colour she is bred to, she will only ever produce black...so obviously she doesn't carry yellow, but if bred to a yellow, her pups could carry yellow...and possibly chocolate yes?

[mikelli]

the confusing part is as mirawee said, that it is on two genes... yellow (which can mask black/choc) and the black/choc gene. If the yellow gene didnt exist, it would be a case of remembering that black is dominant to chocolate. You can have three different possibilities then, Homozygous Black (black dog, not carrier for choc - BB), Heterozygous Black (Black dog, Choc carrier - Bb) and Homozygous Choc (chocolate dog - bb). When you introduce the yellow gene, the presence or non-presence of the yellow gene (Ee or ee) dictates whether you will see the black or chocolate. a chocolate dog cannot carry black, because chocolate is bb, but it can carry yellow (Ee). In this case MG Gibbs' granddam being black would have been black carrying chocolate and maybe yellow, and Gibbs' mum being chocolate would have the bb which could never produce black unless the sire carried the black gene, in this case, Gibbs' father, who is yellow masking the black gene (eeBB)

Oh that makes sense now, I understood that there was 2 genes from Mirawee said, but I didn't understand how they work together...now I know lol

So is this possible, homozygous black bitch, if bred to yellow, can she produce yellow pups?

I think... yes... if she is a Homozygous (black) bitch she can still carry yellow so she'd be EeBB. if she's mated to a yellow (ee) she could produce yellow pups but she would not be able to produce liver pups. If she was a heterozygous (EeBb) black bitch, depending on the yellow sire, she could produce choc and yellow (if the sire was a yellow with heterozygous black gene)

I think... lol

But if she carried yellow, would that mean that she is NOT homozygous?

The reason for the question is I went to the Guide Dogs QLD open day, and they brought out one of their black breeding bitches, and her 8 black puppies, and they were saying that because she is 'dominant black' which I understood as laymans for homozygous black, then regardless of what colour she is bred to, she will only ever produce black...so obviously she doesn't carry yellow, but if bred to a yellow, her pups could carry yellow...and possibly chocolate yes?

Her puppies would only carry chocolate if the yellow stud dog carried chocolate and then only some of the puppies would carry chocolate....50% black carrying yellow 50% black carrying yellow and chocolate