voloclydes Posted January 30, 2012 Share Posted January 30, 2012 ok so i have a friends her and her bro share a house. her bro is not the smartest tool in the shed and has had a gf.... who is very loopy. they are now finished but she is reporting them to the police( 20times in one weekend alone) and council repeatedly. the council ranger has taken the ex gf on board and as one of their dogs has been labeled pit bull on her microchipping(which was done before they were given her).... the ranger is now taking court action to seize the dog.... dog is NOT a puppie but 10 yo old. never had so much as a complaint against her apart from barking at fence as people pass...(this because small town small minded people and kids bait the dog to do so as they pass!) what we need is some advice how to take this to court, as my jrt are more dangerous than this dog. the ranger has said if they can get a dog assessor to assess her breed they might have a chance of fighting this in court. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Whippetsmum Posted January 30, 2012 Share Posted January 30, 2012 Hi V, Is this the story so far? Friend and her brother had been sharing a house with a third person. Brother and third person (now ex girlfriend) have split up Friend's brother owns a dog which is listed as a Pit Bull on council records There is some question of whether the dog is a Pit Bull, but brother of friend never questioned this previously. Ex girlfriend is making trouble - has made complaints to police and council Friends brother has a Pitbull which council are taking action to sieze Pitbull has a record of minor offences The Council officer has said the owner of the dog could get someone to assess teh dog to tell if it's a Pit Bull or not Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tangopatutti Posted January 31, 2012 Share Posted January 31, 2012 I have no idea if this would help or not, but you can get doggy DNA kits to test your dogs DNA - I have never used one, have no idea how accurate they are, but perhaps you could do some research and see if a DNA test would be any use as evidence in court? Good luck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
megan_ Posted January 31, 2012 Share Posted January 31, 2012 In NSW I believe the dog gets breed assessed and then, if it is deemed a pitbull, it gets temp assessed. If it passes the temp assessment all is okay. Restricted breed isn't the same as dangerous dog so tell them not to panic. Maybe PM Pavlova as she seems to know about these things? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greytmate Posted January 31, 2012 Share Posted January 31, 2012 In NSW I believe the dog gets breed assessed and then, if it is deemed a pitbull, it gets temp assessed. If it passes the temp assessment all is okay. Restricted breed isn't the same as dangerous dog so tell them not to panic. Maybe PM Pavlova as she seems to know about these things? Yes, she knows the procedure for NSW. You need advice from somebody that knows. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
voloclydes Posted January 31, 2012 Author Share Posted January 31, 2012 its pretty much the whole thing but gf had not lived with them.... she is reporting them to police for all sorts of things not just the dog... the only behaviour thing is the dog protecting and barking at the fence... a bunch of the local kids think it fun to hit the fence and bait the dog. the dog is just to upset his sister my friend... how does she go about temp testing? who does em? the local ranger before all this had met the dog and found her a lovely dog and complimented my friend on her well behaved dog. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
piperspal Posted January 31, 2012 Share Posted January 31, 2012 See if you can get some photos or video footage of the kids taunting the dog, it may assist in explaining the barking etc should they bring it up. Other than that, not much help from me but good luck Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
voloclydes Posted January 31, 2012 Author Share Posted January 31, 2012 there is an adult woman as well who lets her own dogs attack the fence as well. the drama is she only does it randomly which is hard... every day for a week and then not for a couple of weeks. pratt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChristineX Posted January 31, 2012 Share Posted January 31, 2012 I'd recommend contacting K9Pro - steve courtney. He's a professional dog trainer, very highly thought of here on DOL and often helps people with dangerous dog orders. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
voloclydes Posted January 31, 2012 Author Share Posted January 31, 2012 thanks for the names.... they are going to the police to get the officer who investigated all the calls to them to write a statement... so when i get home thursday i will contact the people mentioned above. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jigsaw Posted January 31, 2012 Share Posted January 31, 2012 The council should have registered temperament assessors which will put the dog through basic temp test. Assessment by a behaviourist also will assist. I've sent you a PM. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WreckitWhippet Posted January 31, 2012 Share Posted January 31, 2012 (edited) You are confusing the terms " dangerous dog " and "restricted breed", if the dog is chipped as a Pitt Bull, APBT or a cross there of, then it is automatically considered to be a " restricted breed". There is no way of accessing a " breed assessor" unless the owner has been issue with a "notice of intent" to declare the dog to be of a restricted breed or cross, as the dog is already chipped and was originally chipped as such, then council has no legal obligation to issue the notice, as the dog is already considered to be " restricted". If the owner has not built a child proof enclosure, then council is well within their rights to seize the dog. If you can prove that the dog is not a resticted breed, by way of parentage ( DNA ) , then there is some chance you could fight it in court, otherwise, you are pretty much up poo creek without a paddle. If the council are on the side of the ex, it is unlikely that they will accept any excuses or arguements from the owner as to what breed the dog is. The owner could write to the general manager of the council and the DLG, stating that the dog is x number of years old, has lived it's life as a good canine citizen and state what breed they believe the dog to be. They may have struck a ranger on a power trip and going above them might get the dog off. You caould lawyer up and attempt to fight it but really, it will cost thousands to engage a solicitor and there aren't many around that are familiar with the CAA. ETA: there was an "grace" period, to enable those with dogs that were already chipped as "resticted breeds" prior to the legislation coming into play, which enabled them to make acceptable provisions for their dogs, this expired about 6 years ago, so there is very little chance of council changing their mind. Edited January 31, 2012 by Pav Lova Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WreckitWhippet Posted January 31, 2012 Share Posted January 31, 2012 The council should have registered temperament assessors which will put the dog through basic temp test. Assessment by a behaviourist also will assist. I've sent you a PM. You cannot access a "breed assessor" or the " temp testers" without the notice of intent. BA and TT will not be considered valid unless an NOI has been issued and the BA and TT have been performed within the 28 days ( unless extra time has been approved by council ) You can approach an independent dog trainer or behaviour specialist, who could write a report about the dog but council and the court do not have to accept this, to let the dog off the hook. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WreckitWhippet Posted January 31, 2012 Share Posted January 31, 2012 I'd recommend contacting K9Pro - steve courtney. He's a professional dog trainer, very highly thought of here on DOL and often helps people with dangerous dog orders. "Dangerous dogs" and "restricted breeds" are two different things. any dog can be declared "dangerous" and Steve can help with that but a " restricted breed" is one of the breeds prescribed in the Companion Animals Act and is limited to those breeds and their crosses and this includes Pitt Bulls. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
voloclydes Posted January 31, 2012 Author Share Posted January 31, 2012 the dog lives in an 8ft fenced area. no way has the dog ever escaped. Even when their house was burgled. They also have the street facing gate locked... People have to enter the property via a fenced double gate system. Ranger has admitted without the 1 lone ex gf complaint..... They would not be taking action, they have no other reason...... I think a letter writing and video evidence is the way to go. Vet i think will also stand on dog side, the xgf knows my friend has no children and her dogs are her life hence the reporting.... Pretty low imo! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sas Posted February 1, 2012 Share Posted February 1, 2012 Contact: http://www.k9pro.com.au/ they help people with Dangerous Dog cases. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bilbo Baggins Posted February 1, 2012 Share Posted February 1, 2012 The ex gf should have a vexitious (??? Spelling) complaint made against her. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WreckitWhippet Posted February 1, 2012 Share Posted February 1, 2012 You are still missing the point, the dog is aleady deemed to be of a resticted breed, because of the microchip. The owner is not fighting a "dangerous dog " charge, the dog has been declared restricted and they are two different things, although if a complaint has been made about fence fighting/charging etc, then it's a double whammy. The owner needs to be aware of excactly what council is going to seize the dog for. They can walk in at any time and seize the dog if it's chipped as a Pitt Bull or a cross and it doesn't matter how high the fences are. If the owner wants to save the dog, the very least they need to do at this stage is build a child proof encloser, that meets the requirements, they need to have the dog on lead and muzzled whenever it's out of the enclosure, have a dangerous dog collar on it and make sure they follow the rules. The rangers can't seize a restricted breed, unless they are not adhering to the requirements. Once council takes the dog, they can destroy it straight away and if it is registered as a Pitt Bull, council can do that at any time, regardless of the owner being there or not. The owner needs to be aware of that Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
melzawelza Posted February 1, 2012 Share Posted February 1, 2012 You are confusing the terms " dangerous dog " and "restricted breed", if the dog is chipped as a Pitt Bull, APBT or a cross there of, then it is automatically considered to be a " restricted breed". There is no way of accessing a " breed assessor" unless the owner has been issue with a "notice of intent" to declare the dog to be of a restricted breed or cross, as the dog is already chipped and was originally chipped as such, then council has no legal obligation to issue the notice, as the dog is already considered to be " restricted". If the owner has not built a child proof enclosure, then council is well within their rights to seize the dog. If you can prove that the dog is not a resticted breed, by way of parentage ( DNA ) , then there is some chance you could fight it in court, otherwise, you are pretty much up poo creek without a paddle. If the council are on the side of the ex, it is unlikely that they will accept any excuses or arguements from the owner as to what breed the dog is. The owner could write to the general manager of the council and the DLG, stating that the dog is x number of years old, has lived it's life as a good canine citizen and state what breed they believe the dog to be. They may have struck a ranger on a power trip and going above them might get the dog off. You caould lawyer up and attempt to fight it but really, it will cost thousands to engage a solicitor and there aren't many around that are familiar with the CAA. ETA: there was an "grace" period, to enable those with dogs that were already chipped as "resticted breeds" prior to the legislation coming into play, which enabled them to make acceptable provisions for their dogs, this expired about 6 years ago, so there is very little chance of council changing their mind. The council should have registered temperament assessors which will put the dog through basic temp test. Assessment by a behaviourist also will assist. I've sent you a PM. You cannot access a "breed assessor" or the " temp testers" without the notice of intent. BA and TT will not be considered valid unless an NOI has been issued and the BA and TT have been performed within the 28 days ( unless extra time has been approved by council ) You can approach an independent dog trainer or behaviour specialist, who could write a report about the dog but council and the court do not have to accept this, to let the dog off the hook. Yep all correct EXCEPT the dog is only automatically restricted if it's chipped as a pure pit bull. If it's chipped as a pit bull cross it is NOT automatically restricted and Council must issue an NOI so the dog can be breed/temperament assessed. Sounds like from what is being described that the dog is chipped as pure. If it is chipped as pure and isn't, the Council CAN request a breed change from the DLG but you need the Council on your side supporting you. Read here page 63: http://www.dlg.nsw.gov.au/dlg/dlghome/documents/Forms/Guideline%20on%20the%20Exercise%20of%20Functions%20under%20the%20CAA%20-%20Dec%202011.pdf So if the ranger is nice please alert them to this - a lot are not aware they have this option. If they aren't they've reached the end of the line unfortunately and will have to comply with the restrictions or give up the dog. Very sad Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WreckitWhippet Posted February 1, 2012 Share Posted February 1, 2012 I'm going to assume that this dog was chipped prior to 2005, given the age of the dog and as such, it falls under this part of the ACT and that because the transition period has expired, then no NOI need be issued as it is automatically declared 57D Declared restricted dogs may be seized and destroyed after transition period (1) This section applies to any dog that becomes, any time after the transition period, a restricted dog because of a declaration by an authorised officer of a council under Division 6 of this Part. (2) However, this section does not apply to any such dog if: (a) the dog was, before the relevant date, registered under this Act (or a corresponding Act of another State or Territory) otherwise than as a breed or kind of dog referred to in section 55 (1) (a)-(d1) or as a cross-breed of any such breed or kind of dog, and (b) no person has been convicted, whether before or after the relevant date, of an offence under section 16 (1) (or a similar offence under a corresponding Act of another State or Territory) as a result of the dog rushing at, attacking, biting, harassing or chasing any person or animal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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