dasha

I think it is an individual preference. Yes the advice is good so far but that is only the opinion of the writer. If you have facilities and time to be able to give time to each one and also to have 2 possibly rowdy pups jumping etc, get 2. Its your choice. Just because it didn't work for one person, doesn't mean its doom and gloom all the time. I bred 2 litters of pups, (2 days apart) and kept 2 bitches from one litter and a boy from the other litter. They do spend a lot of time together but they also get single time too. This may not be every day but they all see me as their person, they all have recalls and know their individual names and get training time each. They also get training time with the distraction of the other pups and dogs trying to get in the way etc but hey............ its great distraction training. I know of other people that often get multiple dogs at once or keep whole or most of a litter and their dogs all seem to get to perform at high levels at the sport they are for. It is an individual thing. And it also depends on the individual temperaments of the pups So I have 7 dogs (5 border collies all young) and 2 mature Kelpies. they all get along well most of the time, any puppy fights are quickly over and play resumes, or if I have to intervene, some quiet time is given. I will admit training 3 pups and their mothers is a lot of work, but the rewards are there too. I also work full time. So I have done everything people say not to do and if anyone knows my dogs, they are all well adjusted, happy friendly dogs

I guess it comes down to the fact she wants to buy a puppy.................. And she will do so. How she spends her money is her business. It's not up to you or what you think she will be like as a pet owner. SHe may very well purchase a very happy, healthy puppy from someone and give it the best life it could. It's not really your place to say she shouldn't get joy out of dog ownership that millions of other Australians get. The best advice you can give her is how to look after it well and given you are a vet nurse, you shouldn't have too much trouble giving her advice rather than judgement and criticism. If it turns out unwell down the track for whatever reason (and lets face it all dogs get unwell, purebred or not) again as a friend and vet nurse, you should offer advice and support rather than tell her I told you so. If you don't think YOU can do this, walk away now and don't let it become your business.

Realistically, they will survive. 2 meals a day is better than one if it can be done. I love my dogs and will provide what they NEED when its needed. I also give them toys, fun stuff, training and have all the things they want for a good life. But I also believe that they should fit in with my lifestyle and that sometimes if I am unable to do something, then they miss out. I do not believe in organising my daily life around the dogs. They get fed when I am home, no set times etc, I am a shift worker so meal times vary anywhere from 4:40AM to midnight. I have never had one suffer from this program. They are adaptable and will fit in with however you bring them up.

Why don't you just feed him before you go to work, when you get home then a small meal before you go to bed. My pups (working Border Collies) were only getting 3 feeds a day while it was convenient for me to do. So they had 3 times a day until about 12-14 weeks then dropped to 2 times a day. Now at nearly 6 months they are on 1 feed per day. If I am on a RDO they may get 2 feeds a day or a snack and sometimes if I am late home from my night shift, they may miss out and just get fed in the am instead. They have grown just fine. You can't necessarily gauge if they need or feed or not by their eagerness to eat it. I have 7 dogs and 6 of them would eat 15 times a day if you offered it to them.Doesn't mean they still need it. I also think you should keep them a little on the hungry site so that when you want to do a little bit of training, you have that little something left in the tank for food rewards. It also helps build food drive and value if you make them do something for it from early on. I find this help reduce fussy eaters down the track as they see you with food and just get excited about what might be coming.

I do agree that most pet owners need to be more aware of reading dogs body language. This includes their own dogs as well as other dogs body language. I don't think it is necessarily something that can be taught in a class though. I think that interpretation of the body language is more important than recognising it and as there is a multitude of reasons a dog a dog displays a behaviour, the correct interpretation is difficult to portray to people that have not recognised the other behaviours that accompany it. For example if you had 10 dogs that all reacted fearfully to a loud sound, the 10 dogs would all give a different response even though they were all scared. I think that body language is too complex to be able to explain in a class environment. I think that reading and interpreting body language and behaviour is MOSTLY intuitive. And intuition cannot be taught, it is a feel. That is why some excellent dog/horse trainers are great at their craft but can be not good teachers. If you ask them how they knew,did,saw,reacted etc they don't know as they just do it. It wasn't a conscious decision for them. In order to accurately teach a basic body language class, you would need a range of demo dogs to show people what different signs to look for. The use demo dogs, you would need dogs that reacted 100% consistantly to a stimulus so that you can predict the response to use it in order to show people. As any dog person know, dogs are consistantly inconsistant. As behaviour and responses are made up of a range of things going on at any moment, it would be very difficult to teach anyone other than the dangerous basics of wagging tail is generally friendly, rolling over is submission etc. As we know these are not the cases and can get people in more trouble. If people can't read their own dog they live with, they certainly won't be able to interpret the behaviour of a dog at the park that they have had 2 mins exposure to. Like I said I do think that people need to improve their general reading of dogs etc but as explained, I don't think it can be done in a class to a good level. If someone was to do a class though, it would need to be done by someone that has a lot of credentials in the area of training and behaviour modification in my opinion and so a whole range of causes and effects could be taught as well as the dangers of interpreting things wrongly. Not just a basic overview.

Good thinking. That is what I would do too.

I don't think they are any more vulnerable but their bodies do have a response. When I was teaching puppy classes at the vet, we used to ask people NOT to vaccinate the day of as they will often then just sleep through the class. Each pup will respond differently. Some you will not even notice and others are sleepy and may even go off food for the day.

Pick any name you like. It doesn't have to sound similar at all. just spend a few mins loading his name with food like loading a clicker or bridge word. They pick it up in no time. Thats how I get my animals to learn their name. People have often commented on how well my animals respond quickly to their name. Even my cats impressed some people when they had to go to a tv job and the trainers said they can't believe how they respond to their name. They just got taught the same. Say their name and a piece of food would be magically right in front when they turned. They are food mad though which helps.

Personally I would wait til you got back. I wouldn't do it the day of as some pups can get a bit quiet after their needles so if you were going to want her to be perky for the training seminar, don't do her that day. Depending on when her 1st one was and what type, you could possibly bring it forward a week, but if its a few days late it really doesn't matter

I had a pup that had a terrible heart murmur at 4 weeks. Was stunted in growth and her bone development was slower than her siblings. Vet suggested waiting til 8 weeks and seeing if it improved and if not, maybe take her to specialist or discuss other options. At her 6 week vax, heart murmur not detectable and she had begin to grow and catch up to others. She is now certainly not a small pup and has overtaken some of her siblings. She also has a heart of steel and the most attitude of all. Glad I didn't euth at 4 weeks... but was prepared we may have to when young as soon as she had trouble being a normal pup. BUT, your pup's murmur has not improved and is prob going to be there 4 life. Being an active breed of dog, I would prob opt to get a refund and try again. Yes you miss them for a week or so, but you get over it. If you decide to keep him, be prepared you may have to spend a lot on treatments for life, testing, management of him. In hot weather it will be worse, if he gets excited. He may be unsuitable to run along with the kids on bikes, play fetch or soccor with the kids etc. Personally I wouldn't want to have a dog that may not be able to enjoy the life of a dog. I also would rather have a dog that is suitable for kids to enjoy rather than not be allowed to run him at the park or play fetch etc in case he keeps collapsing etc. The fact he has aready had a collapsing epidode, I would say it is a murmur bad enough to affect his activies for life. Choice is up to you.

Every dog I have had here does exactly the same thing. They are all Border Collies and Kelpies. Any starting of any machinery sets thenm off. Whipper snippers, mowers, chainsaws, water pump. No reaction from cars, trucks. Mainly the cord pulling but also the key start mowers. They usually bark in real close to it, then redirect it on the horses so they then race off to the horse and try to bit them on the legs and nose, then about 15 seconds later, all over and they go sit down. Its just the starting thing. Someone once told me a lot of working dogs do it.

I have heard it is actually illegal to use to control dogs. So be careful who you tell if you do it. I can vouch it is very effective. We have it for the horses etc but when the dogs touch it accidently, they certainly don't go back in a hurry

I bred working border collie pups this year I had 2 litters this year and with one bitch I had someone that ordered 2 males and some others that wanted females and I wanted to keep one maybe 2 That said she had 2 males and 4 females. Males already taken so no option for colour etc. They just wanted 2 males of that mating. DONE Of the 4 females left, each other party was happy with whichever they got, as long as I picked mine out and was happy with my choices. One person had very frequent visits and watched them all grow and had her eye on one but still would be happy with any of them. I ended up deciding to keep 2 of that litter and I had a tough choice between the other 3. To be honest, they were all a bit different but I would be happy with any of them. So in all, I person selected theirs, I picked my 2 and the other person got what was left over. I person missed out. But all pups of that litter have gone to homes where the owners are over the moon about them. The other litter was different. 5 boys so suddenly had more pups to find homes for as most people previously interested wanted bitches. I wanted 1 but couldn't decide. I guy picked his out early as he liked the markings and just wanted a dog out of the bitch. That still left me with 3 male pups. I took them to sheepdog trials and training and sold 1 to an agility person that came to watch the sheepdogs and fell in love with one, the other was sold to a farmer who came to the dog trial looking to buy another dog. the last one hung around for a while and finally at about 15 weeks old, he met a lovely lady at an agility trial I went to watch and has now found his new home that he is greatly loved. So 2 went to people that had no plans of another dog and saw the pups and bought one. Again, ALL owners that have one of that litter are all over the moon. So really there was really no decisions needed in finding the right homes. Sometimes the right homes just come along. Of that litter though, only my pup and one other have really gone to a working home and the others went to sporting homes. The only choices available in the all male litter was a colour preference

What a lovely little girl. I think her distance will be good naturally personally.

Do you know the reason that she is reactive. Is it fear, confrontation or just because it is a dog she doesn't know etc I think without knowing where the reactivity is coming from, it would be hard to know what exercises are appropriate to try to correct the issue. What breed and age is she

Like others have said. Sometimes things come up in life because they are supposed to. Maybe the universe is trying to get you to be more impulsive instead of being anal organised If there is no real reason to say no, then say yes. And run with what happens.

I also depends on the temperaments of the individual dogs. You can't say that just because they have X number of bitches they WILL have fights. I have 4 adult bitches that can all run together. Admitedly my older grumpy kelpie will have the occassional spat over food with my younger kelpie (also food possessive) 99% of teh time they are fine. The only management thing i have to do is lock all food up and not get them too over the top over toys. I also have kept 2 more bitch pups out of a litter and they also are run with the adults at times. I only have one 5 month old dog pup and 7 females. At the end of the day you can only suggest they keep a look out for signs of trouble and fix it immediately. If it doesn't affect your life, give them the advice and walk away.

I think a dog trained and rewarded correctly using food can give at least as good a performance as a play reward dog, and display the same kind of drive. Obviously depending on the dog and the handler. I think it comes down to identifying the type of natural drive the dog has, developing the drive/desire and rewarding with the desired choice. Once the dog understands the idea of behaviour in exchange for its most favoured reward, the possibilities are endless. In a nutshell I have worked with many dogs over the years and some were food reward dogs and some were tug reward dogs. Basically overall there was no difference in their work ethic or performance other than individual variations and ability to do the job. The play dogs games varied from great tugs to a catch or chase the tug game depending on if the dog had to work again straight away, what the dog actually found (uncommon items had a more valued reward). The length of game varied as well. The food dogs rewards varied from regular kibble biscuits to something better like devon or chicken/roast meat leftovers. The delivery was also varied (sometimes at source of odour, mainly bridged and return for reward), and the amount given was also varied. It was noticed that if a play reward dog was frequently rewarded with food, its response diminished. The same happened with food dogs rewarded with play/tug. It was all fine to do occassionally but not too often. So that is why I was asking why people with food driven dogs would try to change what the dog found MOST rewarding into accepting a less preferred reward.

What your vet said is correct. At 5 months, the adult ones may not have moved enough to push them out yet. I would wait another month or so too. If she is getting bones and stuff there is not much else you can do.

My Border Collie bitch seems to get fearful, unsure and really weird about 3-4 weeks before coming into season. It is really frustrating as she becomes scared of the other dogs, scared of me, runs and hides and lacks self confidence on sheep. Her brain truly goes scatty. She is a 6 month cycler normally but she had pups in end of May and she now seems to be doing the weird things again so I am pretty sure she is coming back in already. I don't change much I do with her as she still needs training and still needs to live with all the other dogs. We just have to live with it. When training her though I am mindful of her being extremely pressure sensitive so I try to avoid situations I know will put bad habits into her work as she is a trial dog, but other than that nothing changes.

KTB its a discussion forum so any replies are welcome. Sometimes reading someones elses posts trigger a thought for someone else so don't feel you should not have your post here.

Pacing horses are a naturally pacing animal. Other horses trot. Pacing is actually a more energy efficient gait and so it can be done for long periods of time. Some breeds of dogs do it naturally more frequently than others. Personally I think dogs are actually a gaited species, but depending on their rate/mode of travel would determine their need to use it. Like Bisart Dobes said, dogs may do it when tired, lazy or sometimes because the speed they are travelling at that point may suit a pace more than a forward trot maybe. I guess each individual dog has a reason for doing it. Maybe your friends dog has bad hips, maybe its lazy. Who knows

Koalathebear.......... Reading your post about your dog finding agility self rewarding so you redo the weaves if he makes a mistake is an interesting point. When I used to do agility there was a dog that was also over the top for agility and his owner did the same thing as you are. Over time though, as he weaved, if he missed a pole, he would pull himself out and start again. As he got near the end, he would miss one, go back and start again...........Without any verbal cue from her. Making a mistake became rewarding as it meant he could do it again. As a result, she had to change it so that when he made a mistake, he was simply stopped, taken from the ring and put away for a while so he got NO more fun. Then he could come out after 5 mins and do his next run. But whenever he didn't do as asked or made a mistake, it meant he was taken off.

Yes Pax that what I meant before. You shouldn't have to provide the reward instantly if you have correctly trained a bridge word/s. Isn't that why you use a bridge? So you can inform the dog that is is correct and then get the reward Thats what I have learnt anyway. Sometimes it isn't possible to give the reward in that second so you bridge and as you go to the reward or are preparing it you can still praise the dog to keep the anticipation of the reward. Anyway sometimes I am not good at writing what I mean :rolleyes:

But couldn't you bridge the behaviour, praise off on way to primary reward on side line? That way no food in ring. Anyway, people shouldn't be using food if they are going to drop it everywhere