SkySoaringMagpie

This is one of the reasons I specifically asked in my first post for the experiences of those who own more than two dogs. Anedotally no issues between two dogs is common. Triple that number and things can be very different, especially as dogs age or are introduced and when they are entire. One of the reasons my OH and I don't take holidays together is that there are exactly 2 people in the whole of Australia who we would trust to run our pack while we are not there. Both of them have over 30 years experience running large pack households with our breeds and are already basically familiar with our pack dynamics. Anyone can do two dogs.

I do think owners have significant influence, but I think it's a long bow to say they are usually the cause. They may usually be ineffective at spotting and dealing with an issue, but that's not the same thing. I know what caused our last dust up and it happened when I was away on business. I think it's likely that it happened because I wasn't present and actively "interfering". Combine that with a change in dynamic resulting from a dog reaching maturity and realising that he doesn't have to put up with shit from one of the second tier males any more and it's dust up time. C'est la vie in a pack of 10, you have to pay attention if dogs are not under other management arrangements and one should not, in my view, just let them sort it out.

We run a mixed pack of sighthounds . There is very definitely a difference between a scuffle fight and a someone is going to die fight and we have experienced both. But there are also fights between those two extremes that mean you have some work you need to do. I think this depends a great deal on breed. From my perspective sighthounds should get on with each other, including entire members of the same sex. All of ours are entire. Because temperament is important to me, and I breed, it's important for me to run the pack together and observe the dogs. How a dog behaves, particularly a male towards bitches, does influence my decisions about breeding. We don't do everything together, they are all fed separately for example. But excepting bitches in season they are expected to behave around each other. When bitches are in season I'm conservative and separate dogs whose brains are in their balls - as well as the girls. Our job as the humans in charge is to watch what is going on. Who is reaching maturity (for us about the 3 year mark)? Who is getting frail? Where in the bitches' cycles are we? Is something developing that I could use an expert opinion on? We recently went to K9Pro about something that perhaps most people wouldn't bother over but I knew it had the potential to affect the whole structure of the male side of the pack and wanted some expert advice about how to manage it. I think if you run a multi-dog household for a number of years it would be miraculous if you didn't one day end up with a fight that meant you had to rethink and rearrange. So we need to take the stigma away - a fight in some ways isn't the problem. The problem occurs when we don't respond with appropriate intervention.

In addition to the fence and bin options, another option is to put it on the roof of a car. Not ideal because your dog might decide it can take the other dog on from that vantage point but if that's all you've got it's something.

I don't think you could usefully compare them as the injuries would be different enough that it would be apples and oranges. For example, very unlikely that a dog is going to rip itself up on a fence or break a leg in a hole on a properly audited and laid out lure course. Nor is a coyote likely to bite back at them. If you're interested tho' I'd recommend Dutch Salmon's book on open field coursing because he talks a lot about injury management. As to the properly laid out and driven course, that becomes a bit chicken and egg. Drivers and trial officials need practice to become good at it and you can't practice without dogs. However, I think you can practice on breeds that are more flexible and less prone to injury (e.g., Salukis, Afghans, CAT dogs).

One thing about lure coursing is that it is new in Australia and so we don't have an existing population of dogs that have been bred and raised and trained to lure course. That hit greyhounds particularly hard this year, as they are built for power and speed and are trained to run in ways that meant that lure coursing was a real shock to their system. Having observed the last year my advice to anyone wanting to course greyhounds would be to train the dog up from a puppy and not to use dogs previously trained to race - whether rescue or otherwise. Having said that, all the other sighthound breeds managed without any major drama.

This is a subject that has been on my mind for a while for a variety of reasons. How important to you is your breed's original purpose? Have you researched it? For those for whom there are specific dog sports (eg, retrieving and field trials for gundogs, earthdog for terriers) - have you tried your dog out in these sports? Finally, have you ever tried to train your dog to work against his or her breed's original function, and what were your reasons?

The other thing that strikes me about this thread and the other thread about breeder's terms is the issue of money. A number of leading breeders, including Juha Kares, have said that once you start relying on dog breeding for money you have a problem because it affects all your decisions. I know there are people on this forum who disagree with me, but I personally think that the minute money comes into it the risk of decisions and feelings going bad goes up markedly. I've taken the path my father took - get a good job and use it to support your hobby. That way I can do what I think is best in any given situation without worrying about money. We have a few stud dogs which we own outright. No contract. If the breeder of one of those dogs wanted to bring a bitch here I would set up the spare room and get the kettle on and I would not have my hand out. Because they took a chance on us and sold us a dog outright and have provided years of support and advice. Do we agree with what they do all the time? No. Do they agree with what we do all the time? No. But that's not necessary to have a productive relationship and shared goals. For people for whom money is scarce, or a measure of success (always wanting to win at any deal) then I think they are better off not entering into these sorts of arrangements at all. This is not a car or a fridge, but a companion.

Me too :laugh: We'll hitch him up and he can pull the trolley.

Some children have special needs and are difficult to supervise. I love my dogs but I have no desire to take them to Bunnings because I know that something untoward might happen. At home they have a secure yard where they can be left safely. Some dogs are fine with unpredictable kids, including kids who don't behave according to the rule book. If I took our IW into a store, I know he'd be fine - you can't take an IW out in public without the whole world wanting to say hello anyway. A couple of our other dogs I would avoid putting in that position. If I had to, just like the vet waiting room, I'd have my own radar on and act accordingly to avoid a problem just as we all do when we walk our dogs in public. This is an issue of education, if all dogs stay home then no-one learns anything and the dogs have a pretty narrow and sad life. Edited because I can't punctuate or spell today.

With the sought after, more expensive breeds I have seen things work well where people have been prepared to purchase a desexed adult at the end of its show or breeding career. A co-worker's daughter got her much loved Bulldog that way. Purchased outright, hers for life.

Having travelled in Europe with dogs the whole culture is different. I saw a lot of dogs on ferries and inside restaurants etc and overall the dog smarts of the owners are higher than the average Australian, and the temperament and training of the dogs better than the average Australian dog. And that will never change without a preparedness to accept a high level of disruption while we "catch up" to those standards. For a long time Australia's had a 'working' view of dogs not a companion view, and that's translated badly into our increasingly urbanised and segregated lives. I agree that if your dog doesn't need to be with you, then don't take it. However, the other day I unavoidably had to run some messages on the way home after taking a dog to a health test, and I deliberately chose a shopping centre with an underground car park. It was a pain and out of my way, but at least it was cool. If we can do approved parking for people with strollers at shopping centres, can Bunnings not demonstrate some of its shade products in a the carpark in a parking area? Honestly I get tired of seeing dogs being fried on ute trays.

Unless you have pots and pots of money and the willingness to enforce a contract gone bad in a cross jurisdictional situation then honestly I would just agree on arrangements by email. It has basically the same effect for most practical purposes and you can easily cover the things that are of interest to you both. And yes I do know of people who have paid for American lawyers to win a case, but it's not a trivial exercise (see again, pots of money). The kinds of things you want to cover are: How many breeding units? Which bitch is the first mating meant for if more than one breeding unit? Do they want a puppy back - which puppy (e.g. second pick either sex, first pick male) and when will they decide so that you can place the other puppies promptly. Any health tests not yet done that you want done? What is the fee for the semen? Any other fees for the other arrangements? Commitment on part of exporter to send all necessary paperwork. If they send you more than one breeding unit are there any restrictions on the use of the semen with other bitches. If you get hit by a bus do they have a view about who is the secondary contact for the semen in Oz? While the semen is yours, you still have a reputation in the breed to consider. The owner of the dog may not be OK with you listing it for public sale, for example, and I think it's wise to be considerate if you want future stud dog owners to work with you. What happens, if anything, if the whole thing doesn't work out as you planned (terrible quality semen, singleton or no pups etc). Much of what you'd cover with a stud dog owner living in the next suburb you cover in these situations, the main things are the future stewardship of the frozen semen and ensuring that you've done your homework to ensure you're not about to flush a lot of money (eg, is stud dog proven, can they provide info about semen quality etc).

HW has modestly not pointed out that Dodger was the top scoring Sighthound that day. When you look at the video you can really see it.

We've had one very successful little Beagle running but apart from that no other scenthounds. The Beagle is a pro and has never sniffed around. We are used to the vocal dogs, there are a couple of Lappies who have a word to the lure the whole way around :D

Yes, NSW and QLD are running ANKC recognised lure coursing on complete courses. I am not sure where Victoria is at with setting up lure coursing but there will be an official ANKC trial as far south as Yass next year, run by NSW. A note about fencing because I have a feeling that field selection is causing issues for people. The fencing on the field we have been using in NSW is not complete and not higher than stock fencing. So far we've found that most dogs are so focussed on the bag that they don't wander off and those that do run off the field are usually running back to find their owner or their crate. And this is with the herding sheep in the next paddock. While it's likely that people with dogs who would be at a major risk of doing a bunk are self-selecting out of running their dogs on the course, most people have been pleasantly surprised at how well it's working. And in Europe they run on all sorts of fields with no fences at all. We have been out scouting fields for next season, there are a lot of country race tracks and show grounds out there that are disused most of the year - we're finding most are not suitable for various reasons (dangerous rubbish, too small, too close to highways, show trust wants your first born for a deposit etc) but for every 9 that aren't suitable, there is 1 that is.

I don't think those larger sighthounds would be hitting full stride in 100 metres - they'd still be winding up!! This is an important point. 100 metres on a straight tells you nothing about the ability of an Afghan or a Saluki. Afghans are the all terrain vehicle of sighthounds. Their advantage comes from their strength and agility not their speed. IOW you can't usefully compare a top shelf 4WD to a Ferrari. To really see an Afghan's advantages, you need to put them on a field that has a lot of natural obstacles. I have watched our Afghans jump sure footedly from rock to rock on bushwalks but on a straight they are not going to beat most greyhounds. A Saluki is a long distance breed. When all the other sighthounds have fallen away at 800 meters a good Saluki is just picking up speed.

I think there is an apples and oranges thing going on here. Some breeds are bred to work independently - some to work closely with humans. Both might have high drive but how that is expressed and managed will vary by breed and by temperament within a breed. And I say that as someone who can call one of my Salukis off a running hare, but not another. As a lure courser I know I don't want them to be too dependant on me for instruction either way, for obvious reasons.

Agree with this. All the best with Miss M :D

Toilet training is one of those things where you go back to basics as soon as you get a slip up, because each slip up puts more time between now and reliable toilet training. 10 weeks is not old enough for it to be solid Without seeing this dog it's hard for anyone to say, but I have a breed that is well known for being very hard to toilet train, and that has shown me that we inadvertently train all sorts of crazy things while we train our dogs and inappropriate peeing is just one of them. Submissive peeing is a reality, be very very sure this isn't what you are dealing with because if it is, coming down hard on her will make it much worse.

Cost of the dog Cost of boarding the dog while it does the pre-preparation required before getting an import permit. You're looking at the dog being 8-9 months old before it can fly. Cost of quarantine - costs the same as it used to even tho' less time is required now Cost of the flight Veterinary bills both in the country of origin and AQIS bills here Permit fees Cost of the flight where you go to the country where the dog has been born and check it personally yourself before committing I agree that budgeting for $10,000 sounds wise. The other thing that doesn't involve money but is a big part of the purchase is the relationship with the breeder. If you have a good relationship they are unlikely to send you something with a bad bite and may be prepared to run the dog on so you don't get stung for boarding fees.