Steve

Sorry no can do . In order to be treated the way we need it to be treated when it gets to the various sate parliaments it has to be done this way.

The mistake has been corrected thank you and there is no choice on the praying. http://www.ntmajorprojects.nt.gov.au/lant/pub/ip4.shtml

It doesnt matter if its doubled up. We want it to go everywhere.I havent sent them to the ANKC or the state canine orgs as yet. Still workingthrough Farmers associations, jockeys etc.

we are spreading it around but dont rely on that - th emore places you can get it out thebetter. there is a date on each one for return - 31.1.11

There wil be more and we can order them in for you too. Julie

But this one is! http://www.dolforums.com.au/index.php?showtopic=209405 Its wearing a tutu! Tutu isnt included . Its the only photo I could find

No takers?

That will do !

Thanks Id she will number them in case anyway.

We need your help!!!!!! We want to collect over 100,000 signatures! The Master Dog Breeders and Associates has launched a petition to go out Australia wide to have laws changed to ensure agencies charged with policing animal welfare laws have a transparent accountability process. We see this as an issue which is important issue for everyone who is the owner or in charge of animals in this country. We can't gather that many signatures on our own. It will take a grassroots effort with everyone circulating petitions within their own networks of friends, family, and neighbours. In addition to signing yourself, would you please consider circulating one or more petition forms? Please cross postthis everywhere you can think of to peopel who are involved with any species of animal in this country. Your efforts are vital to having a successful drive. Here are some steps to help you: All states and territories in Australia have different requirements for lodging petitions in each state. To accommodate those requirements we have written petitions which comply with each states rules. You can download your state's petition from our website Here Please get the signatures of as many people as you can and make sure they're residents in your state. If they are from other states and they want to sign the petition please direct them to our website where they can download the appropriate state petition and ask them to collect signatures from their local area. You can work individually or copy the petition and give it to other people to collect signatures. If you are going to make it a team effort, divide the neighborhood and conquer. Decide who's going to cover which parts of town and split up. This can be done by canvassing the neighborhood going door-to-door, speaking to people at local businesses or shows, meetings, training areas in fact anywhere people are likely to be or gather. Please don't stop at the minimum required because the more signatures collected, the better are the chances the requested action will be taken. Be prepared for opposing views. Not everyone will agree with your point of view and some will refuse to sign. Get permission before asking for signatures in front of a store or at a church. · Don't go door to door in strange neighbourhoods · If you are going to collect signatures in public do this in groups of two or more · Don't forget to have enough pens, petition forms and a clipboard or table for them to lean on as they sign. · Spread the word by emailing and phoning friends and family about the petition and ask them to move it around their friends and family Privacy Any person who signs a petition is required to leave personal information to ensure that their signature and support is legitimate. Residential addresses are needed as P.O Boxes may not be counted as a valid address. You should make it clear that you will not share information with any third parties. I would also like to say to Jaxxbuddy who has worked on this for us for such a long time and pulled it all together in consideration of individual state requirements and laws [Her experience and knowledge has been a true asset for us] and to Raz who gave us insight and input into various issues which we also needed to bring it all together - Thank You.

Just checking that now.

We need your help!!!!!! We want to collect over 100,000 signatures! The Master Dog Breeders and Associates has launched a petition to go out Australia wide to have laws changed to ensure agencies charged with policing animal welfare laws have a transparent accountability process. We see this as an issue which is important issue for everyone who is the owner or in charge of animals in this country. We can't gather that many signatures on our own. It will take a grassroots effort with everyone circulating petitions within their own networks of friends, family, and neighbours. In addition to signing yourself, would you please consider circulating one or more petition forms? Please cross postthis everywhere you can think of to peopel who are involved with any species of animal in this country. Your efforts are vital to having a successful drive. Here are some steps to help you: All states and territories in Australia have different requirements for lodging petitions in each state. To accommodate those requirements we have written petitions which comply with each states rules. You can download your state's petition from our website Here Please get the signatures of as many people as you can and make sure they're residents in your state. If they are from other states and they want to sign the petition please direct them to our website where they can download the appropriate state petition and ask them to collect signatures from their local area. You can work individually or copy the petition and give it to other people to collect signatures. If you are going to make it a team effort, divide the neighborhood and conquer. Decide who's going to cover which parts of town and split up. This can be done by canvassing the neighborhood going door-to-door, speaking to people at local businesses or shows, meetings, training areas in fact anywhere people are likely to be or gather. Please don't stop at the minimum required because the more signatures collected, the better are the chances the requested action will be taken. Be prepared for opposing views. Not everyone will agree with your point of view and some will refuse to sign. Get permission before asking for signatures in front of a store or at a church. · Don't go door to door in strange neighbourhoods · If you are going to collect signatures in public do this in groups of two or more · Don't forget to have enough pens, petition forms and a clipboard or table for them to lean on as they sign. · Spread the word by emailing and phoning friends and family about the petition and ask them to move it around their friends and family Privacy Any person who signs a petition is required to leave personal information to ensure that their signature and support is legitimate. Residential addresses are needed as P.O Boxes may not be counted as a valid address. You should make it clear that you will not share information with any third parties. I would also like to say to Jaxxbuddy who has worked on this for us for such a long time and pulled it all together in consideration of individual state requirements and laws [Her experience and knowledge has been a true asset for us] and to Raz who gave us insight and input into various issues which we also needed to bring it all together - Thank You. The MDBA Team.

What about not being a redneck rebel, but still being open to the idea of law change? Cause laws get changed by sensible lobbying, not by large mobs of loud bogans. Can I please join in? In about 2 minutes when we roll out our first visible approach you will see that we are open to law changes when everything is in the right place and going after what we want in a unique way and Im not saying we are not open to it on this issue - Im saying we want to work on ways which dont require law changes to start and if we get to that its a way off and would only come with lots of homework.

Isnt Renbury pound a for profit pound? Pounds in Victoria are owned by LDH and RSPCA too and they are paid a per animal fee.

Even law abolishment as a change? Im not saying that we wont be eventually led into petitioning for new laws or taking old laws away of law change - but for now - forget laws.

Same here as the others. Discuss what can be done without advocating for law changes. The one single consistent thing I see on this forum and what most dog owners talk to me about is the fact that they cant walk their dogs without fear that someone's dog which is not under control will put them or their dog at risk. There is no doubt that irresponsible people have made it harder and harder for us to be able to take our dogs to more and more places and do the thing we used to take for granted. Recently we saw a TV program which made much of people living in one shire targetting pit bulls and pit bull types - this led to more calls for more law changes. When we first started the MDBA one of the things we wanted to do was encourage people to join us - build the numbers of pet owners - regardless of what breed they owned so we could approach councils and state government to show them we had lots of people who had proven they were more educated on responsible dog owners ship and who were owners with a voluntary code of ethics for dog ownership. the idea back then was to be able to ask for our members to be given the right to do something and take their dogs some places which they have been locked out of and as the numbers grow that is still on the table. But Im growing impatient and when I see calls for dog ownership licences etc I think its time we really had a good look at this. So if we want to have a fair go at turning this around what is the answer? No law changes

O.K. Im interested in gathering a group of people who will join a small action/ working group to start to do something rather than just talk about it - in order to approach a goal of no live animals in pet shops or at a very minimum much less animals sold by pet shops - without changing any laws. You will not be asked to do anything you are not comfortable with and in the initial stages it will take little more than putting together plans and getting to realistic methods of approaching this. This is the second of many small working groups we will be kicking off so if this is something you feel really passionate about over any other pressing issue in the dog world this one will be for you - or you may want to hold off until we start another which might get you blood pumping a bit more. So before you put your hand up think it through. Troy will allow us a small area on the forum which only you will have access to while we are working on this and the only restriction is that we will not be looking at any strategy which includes law changes or redneck animal rights methods.

I'm quite sure that laws wont help this issue. So far I have poochmad little Bear Perry's Mum sas Anne Jaxx's Buddy Goldchow Me This is how it will work - Troy has given us a private spot to get this started where only those who have said they would like to have a go at finding and working on real solution which come to action will be able to have accesss to.When you log in you will have access to this but no one else will. Thats because we will know we only have people who are wanting to help us find a solution and we dont get way laid by somone trying to stir and to enable us to come to some plans of action - get it all ready and moving before we share it . The only condition is that we leave any ideas of law change at the door. Anyone else before I give the list to Troy?

This "solution" would require law changes and the purpose of the discussion is to talk through solutions without looking at those which would require law changes.

Large shops source from puppy farms. That is the only way they can keep an constant supply of pups. 3 times purchase price for shops in busy shopping centres. 2 times purchase price in smaller centres. Small independent stores double the purchase price. If the pup has been there too long, price will reduce. Sllight difference between pure and x bred dogs, but that is the rule of thumb Don't believe me? ir's easy to find out. Same way you would find out what any store pays for anything. You will find I am correct. None of this is important, if RSPCA continues to push to ban puppy farms, the gov MAY ban the sale of pups from pet shops. Only way to do it. Without pet shops, half or more than half of puppy farms trade would disappear and if they were unprofitable, they would close. They are businesses, NOT dog lovers Nothing will happen because the government will not grasp the nettle and ban the sales of pups in pet shops. Neither will the RSPCA push for it. Are you saying that the only way pet shops can source their puppies is by buying from someone who keeps their dogs in substandard conditions? The RSPCA is not pushing to ban commercial breeders more than they are any other breeder. Law changes which have been promised to curb people breeding in sub standard conditions dont mention pet shops. Government can do anything but in this country before they do they will need to consider federal laws and facts and not emotive animal rights led propoganda which is so easy to refute.Way before they ban them they will introduce more laws to regulate them and take away the element of anonymity of the breeder in my opinion. Either way other people can carry on if they like about more laws and chant "ban the sales of pets in pet shops" but Im not backing any law changes and Im looking for alternatives for the purposes of this discussion. In response to the piece I have bolded (above). That is not what I said, please re-read my post. Headlines - all over Australia. RSPCA & Biosecurity Qld raid Kingaroy puppy farm - two hundred and something dogs seized. People on this forum fostered some of the dogs. Ruth Schloss was a supplier to pet shops. Whether you consider this operation "substandard conditions" is your call. I'm not chanting anything. My belief is that the sale of pups from pet shops should be banned for a whole lot of reasons which have already been discussed in this thread.. You asked for information, I gave it to you. I have re read your post several times and I wasnt quite sure what you meant so I asked and as instructed I have re read your post again and I am still unsure of what you meant - you said Quote Large shops source from puppy farms. That is the only way they can keep an constant supply of pups. Given that the agreed definition of a puppy farmer is someone who breeds their puppies in substandard conditions it still reads to me that you are saying that the only way pet shops can keep a constant supply of puppies is to purchase puppies from those who are puppy farmers or people who keep their dogs in sub standard conditions. If we are each using a different definition of what a puppy farm is then the whole meaning of the post will be changed for me and many who have read what you have written and why I asked the question. "Steve" - you know me and I am by far the last person to support any type of mass production of pet animals - however - you really need to distinguish between large breeding facilities which abide by all codes of ethics and mass produced puppies for profit - there is a difference - I have yet to see a facility of good care - however - you do need to be able to verbalize the distinguishing features to the public...if you continue to only criticize large facilities you will only alienate those facilities further when the aim is to educate and improve. Provide a descriptive form which shows the difference between large sentient animal care housing and sub standard care which equates as opposed to puppy farms. Sorry - terminology needs to be addressed.. Yes that's what I said.

I pulled the german shep pup out to show someone the day they arrived here - an elderly lady with 2 GSD of her own. She is in her mid 60's . She burst into tears and paid me 50 bucks for it right then and there! It sits on her bed and she brings it out to sit on the couch of an evening . She reckons it comforts her. Very strange.

Any chance of a copy of your "owner criteria" check list please - I'd like to compare notes.... OOPs sleping rerror I dont have one. I talk to them and listen a lot. I dont just talk about the dogs but everything - just nice comfortable chats. I learned a long time ago if anyone really wanted to scam me they would have every question I could have on a criteria list down pat but the longer I make you chat and relax with a conversation little clues give you away. Julie

Large shops source from puppy farms. That is the only way they can keep an constant supply of pups. 3 times purchase price for shops in busy shopping centres. 2 times purchase price in smaller centres. Small independent stores double the purchase price. If the pup has been there too long, price will reduce. Sllight difference between pure and x bred dogs, but that is the rule of thumb Don't believe me? ir's easy to find out. Same way you would find out what any store pays for anything. You will find I am correct. None of this is important, if RSPCA continues to push to ban puppy farms, the gov MAY ban the sale of pups from pet shops. Only way to do it. Without pet shops, half or more than half of puppy farms trade would disappear and if they were unprofitable, they would close. They are businesses, NOT dog lovers Nothing will happen because the government will not grasp the nettle and ban the sales of pups in pet shops. Neither will the RSPCA push for it. Are you saying that the only way pet shops can source their puppies is by buying from someone who keeps their dogs in substandard conditions? The RSPCA is not pushing to ban commercial breeders more than they are any other breeder. Law changes which have been promised to curb people breeding in sub standard conditions dont mention pet shops. Government can do anything but in this country before they do they will need to consider federal laws and facts and not emotive animal rights led propoganda which is so easy to refute.Way before they ban them they will introduce more laws to regulate them and take away the element of anonymity of the breeder in my opinion. Either way other people can carry on if they like about more laws and chant "ban the sales of pets in pet shops" but Im not backing any law changes and Im looking for alternatives for the purposes of this discussion. In response to the piece I have bolded (above). That is not what I said, please re-read my post. Headlines - all over Australia. RSPCA & Biosecurity Qld raid Kingaroy puppy farm - two hundred and something dogs seized. People on this forum fostered some of the dogs. Ruth Schloss was a supplier to pet shops. Whether you consider this operation "substandard conditions" is your call. I'm not chanting anything. My belief is that the sale of pups from pet shops should be banned for a whole lot of reasons which have already been discussed in this thread.. You asked for information, I gave it to you. I have re read your post several times and I wasnt quite sure what you meant so I asked and as instructed I have re read your post again and I am still unsure of what you meant - you said Quote Large shops source from puppy farms. That is the only way they can keep an constant supply of pups. Given that the agreed definition of a puppy farmer is someone who breeds their puppies in substandard conditions it still reads to me that you are saying that the only way pet shops can keep a constant supply of puppies is to purchase puppies from those who are puppy farmers or people who keep their dogs in sub standard conditions. If we are each using a different definition of what a puppy farm is then the whole meaning of the post will be changed for me and many who have read what you have written and why I asked the question.

You can turn them off

The GSD was sold before I got them out of the box - but we can order them in for you Julie