Rappie

The intranasal vaccination has been around for a while but now covers 3 of the causes of respiratory disease / kennel cough not 2 (this "B3" is probably the "new" one that is being promoted). The immunity it produces is local to the respiratory tract and is created rapidly, as you said 3-4 days. It is generally well tolerated by dogs - 0.5ml of vaccine down each nostril. I haven't seen any of the literature on the B3 but I believe that the incidence of vaccination reactions is reduced.

Sentinel makes the adult fleas infertile rather than killing them, so it is good for preventing fleas if you don't already have them - not so good if you're using it as the only product to get rid of a flea problem. If you have the occasional flea problem (like after going visiting) you can use Capstar at those times. Treating for tapeworm only requires a praziquantel tablet every 3 months, so something like Droncit or Popantel. There isn't a lot of significant difference between the two products other than the choice between the formulation ie. tablet vs top spot and whether or not you need fleas dead NOW.

The intranasal one is live - doesn't quite make it to the lungs, its effect is to create local immunity in the nasal / respiratory mucosa (Which takes days) instead of the killed injection with results in cell mediated immunity (which takes weeks). I think its only been recently that the intra-nasal one has been reformulated and really pushed well to vets. It has always been availalable but the supply often depends on the what the wholesaler has.

Jed, my bad!

Very idealistic. "Preventative medicine" will always be important, however it wont account for the things that will always happen like dogs and cats aging, broken bones, ripped toenails, stuck grass seeds, traumatic hernias etc. Learning medicine isn't just about the drugs used - its essentially everything but surgery - how fast to run a drip, what kind of fluids, what the heck to do about a dog in shock with multiple things wrong, how to get glue out of noses etc. With reference to drugs specifically, often there is no time to check a book - you just have to KNOW what you can and can't use there and then. What do you use to anaesthetise an epileptic dog? What about one with head trauma? A blocked cat? A dog with a heart murmur? Yes, we all learn all of the major species - dogs, cats, birds, horses, pigs, sheep and cattle - husbandry and management, medicine and surgery. We're allowed special interests of course but if the course were to allow undergraduate specialisation then we wouldn't be able to become registered with the vet surgeons boards since our education would be deemed incomplete. In our final year, we are allowed relative freedom in choosing our placements - we've been offered two elective rotations where we may do whatever we wish. Some students are going to zoos in South Africa, some are doing orthopaedics research - I'm doing a dermatology rotation and also trying to get an equine rotation. So yes, that means we can manage stress is pigs of all age and sex groups, in both intensive and extensive settings, preg test sheep, cows, horses and pigs, pull stuck calves, help down cows, treat impacted crops in birds, fix broken legs or wings, manage renal disease in a goat, identify anthrax - right down to doing blood smears and stains, know the national procedures for a Foot & Mouth outbreak in this country.

I don't think you can really view the number of hourse in isolation - that is pure lecture time for the actual subject. It doesn't include what is covered in other subjects nor what is done outside of formal tuition (given that each hour of lecture time equates to at least 2 or 3 more spent doing private study). Given that we spend 40 hours per week at uni for 5 years - where would you like the extra 300 hours of nutrition to go? Replace some pharmacology? Medicine? Surgery? Forget about horses, cows, pigs and birds? What is BEST is subjective - as I said earlier, our education is a grounding and people don't always do the right thing with it, nor do they care. Until they do something negligent (which recommending PAL for whatever reason is not) then often they will never get the kick in the shins they need to wake up. Personally - in my grand scheme of things nutrition isn't the most important thing I need to know about however I can fully understand that when you have the cares of an owner it becomes more hugely important. I build up knowledge when I have time - but for the most part I'm more interested in being able to make accurate and informed medical and surgical decisions.

Have heard about ipecac syrup - not sure how it stand in terms of being in favour at the moment. It sure works (I got threatened with it once when I was a kid) but is difficult to use for re-dosing and can have some cardiac side effects. Glad everything is sorted and everyone is ok

Just a note that the dose of peroxide should not exceed 3 tablespoons in any dog (the published dosage I found for clinical use are comparatively higher) and preferably preceded by some food. Using peroxide isn't without risks - but in a lot of cases is outweighed by the potential for toxicity from what has been ingested. If it's going to be used, I'd like a vet to be involved at some point. The possible side effects are gastric and mucosal irritation with the potential for ulceration and sloughing - since it induces vomiting through mild gastric irritation rather than acting centrally (ie. influencing regions of the brain to cause vomiting).

Peroxide can be (and is widely) used to induce vomiting however because of the fairly long list of complications I'm hesitant to provide a dose rate while knowing very little about the situation. The "nicest" effective method of inducing vomiting is apomorphine however that needs to be administered by a vet. Wouldn't recommend salt, as if it isn't effective, it can cause its own set of problems.

Cooking and dark chocolate are definately worse. Not sure of the dose of peroxide, I think its an arbitrary few drops, but I will have to check before you quote me on that! A specialist centre is best equipped to answer these type of questions - happy to help but would try calling one - they're staffed 24 hours.

Keyword is potentially! The 100mg/kg is the figure that I remember - and from the range you quoted there are 45mg in 60g of milk chocolate, very roughly 100g / kg making a dog very sick. My boss and I did a calculation once and I think we established that 2 rows of a "normal" Cadbury block (what is that? 250g?) would make a Chihuahua sick (that was the dog we were dealing with at the time). Of course, it is all variable - I suggest you keep a close eye on them, not sure about inducing vomiting (I can check) but charcoal should be fine. Keep tabs on high heart rates at rest, a really bounding heart beat and signs of distress - and know where an after hours vet is.

You're forgiven Jed We do 100 hours of fairly tradition nutrition, and no its not entirely canine but it might be suprising how applicable the general principles are. It's also pretty hard to say that in 5 years I will only know 100 hours worth of nutrition. Anyhow its not really about numbers of hours - I don't want to know how my "Study" time compares to my "lecture" time because it would probably only end up demonstrating that I have no life, lol. I think when it comes to the choices that individual vets make, it really is the individual that makes them and not a reflection (not neccessarily anyway) of the education they received. As it is, I've read (and own) Raw Meaty Bones, still tracking down Ian Billinghurst's book - and (still) in the process of completing the Hills Nutritional Advisor Program - not really swayed either way. IMHO - owners should feed what suits them best, suits their dog best and what they can best afford. I'm not down with people being "guilted" into making decisions and as a (future) vet I would prefer to do my best to support people with making sensible choices, not be dictating any particular one to them. That said *I* feel that it is *my* responsibility to at least be able to offer guidance on the more "alternative" options (being it BARF, alternative therapies etc) even if that only be offering to do research or refer to someone who does know :D

I'm just joshing Just noticed a little hint of "Zose vets, zey know nutting!" over the past few day *chuckles*

Can we ease up on the vet bashing, pretty please I'll just take my 100 hours of nutrition and put it in a little box with my 300+ hours of anatomy and physiology and go sit in a corner, lol.

I have a figure in my notes somewhere that suggests well over 50% of chicken sold commercially to consumers (including butchers, supermarkets etc) is contaminated with Salmonella at the time it is for sale. Meat processing plants do a lot of quality control before meat leaves their plant but it will only get worse once it leaves...... So certainly a "real" problem, however probably also requires a dose of immunosuppression to cause a problem in an otherwise healthy dog. Of course, too much of anything can cause problems so if you're eating / feeding chicken that's been lying about and causing an ideal environment for bacterial growth there are few other factors involved. Food hygiene is VERY important.......

But if you're not sure what you're dealing with Malaseb is ok....the yellow bits look like dried serum / lymph rather than pus and the whole areas looks a bit greasy.

I'd go for Malaseb - its fine to use around the mouth, just make sure to rinse well because it tastes a bit foul It's generally well tolerated and doesn't seem to sting too much if at all, it's got a bit of an anti-pruritic effect too. Still yet to be convinced of the benefits of iodine as anything other than a surgical scrub.....much prefer working with chlorhexidine....

Incontinence is a risk unfortunately and its not one that can neccessarily be avoided due to the close proximity of the nerves to the area. Theres a few different methods of doing the surgery which go in and out of favour but the results are much the same - it really depends on the preference of the vet doing the surgery. If you can get away with regular manual expression thats good, but with chronic inflammation you may find that the anal ducts are blocked so that the sacs with be difficult to express anyway, despite normal secretory function. Could make the problem worse....

Greytmate, We do go over the common breed specific problems in our anaesthesia course (which is a 2 semester course) including greyhounds / sight hound and barbiturates and boxers with ACP and brachycephalic breed specific problems. We also spend a considerable amount on time covering anaesthesia in compromised patients such as those with liver, kidney, respiratory or heart failure. Even if we didn't remember the details specifically I'd say that most people in my year would remember that there was something "funky" associated with a breed and would look it up. We'd also be familiar with the pharmacology of the drugs that we are using so even if we didn't remember about greyhounds specificially, it could be expected that thiopentone would be a bad choice in a skinny dog due to the distribution in fat and potential for prolonged metabolism (which gives the "hangover" effect). The other thing that might be worth mentioning, and I don't intend it to be in defence of anyone......part of how some vets approach anaesthesia may be related to when they graduated. Suggested anaesthetic protocols are always changing and have changed significantly over the last 10 years particularly - some vets don't know, don't care or aren't brave enough to move out of their comfort zone and continue on with the "not quite right" drugs and protocols which nearly always work for them. There is a degree of trial and error - but it should be based on educated decisions. In most cases the variances will be in dose rates - there shouldn't be a whole lot of guess work about the drug choice - but it can be complicated to balance analgesia with sedation. Experience goes a long way to improving the ability to make decisions - but its no substitute for thinking things through and making sure that your plan is appropriate. I think you are entitled to ask your vet what they would use to anaesthetise your dog - and also ask questions if you think they are warranted. There shouldn't be anything to hide. I'd also say that you are entitled to request a certain protocol, but then it is also up to the vet to decided a) whether they think it is appropriate and b) whether they are comfortable using it. I don't know how you find out about anaesthetic deaths - I think the last patient we lost at work was a mouse and that was at least a year ago - but my boss is conservative with his plans and very concious of potential problems.

Speed of recovery reflects a lot of different factors, not just the "quality" of the anaesthesia. I just spent the day anaesthetising pound dogs for desexing, some bouncy patients, some quiet. We were aiming to give them sufficient sedation and analgesia in the premed to allow them to sleep their surgery off in peace and comfort. They were being speyed and castrated by student surgeons, so would obviously be a little more uncomfortable than with an experienced surgeon. Premed adds to the anaesthesia - using ACP often just prolongs the sleeping time after the procedure, but there's plenty of other options that aren't phenothiazines. Crash inductions, either with gas or an IV induction agents generally go ok but often have particularly rough recoveries. Propofol (which is a drug, not a family) and Alfaxan can be used as a sole agent for anaesthesia or induction but the recoveries aren't at all pretty a lot of the time. Providing a balanced anaesthesia is both very important and effective. Premeds will reduce the amount of induction agent used generally, and pre-emptive analgesia keeps patients a lot more comfortable. As far as I'm concerned pain relief and "better" anaesthetics shouldn't be a choice that the owners have to make - the vets should be able to make an educated choice about the most appropriate protocol for each individual patient. Of course, life doesn't always work that way

There aren't a great deal of obvious breed characteristics, but a lot of individual characteristics that are common amongst members of the same breed. Sight hounds don't have a lot of body fat, that's true, but dealing with them is like dealing with any other lean dog. If you give them an incremental dose of an induction agent, the don't have enough fat to redistribute it before metabolism they stay awake. Later, after it begins to metabolise they get a hefty dose of it all at once. Due consideration to choice of drug, administration and an individual assessment of the patient should make things easier for the vet. Common sense should prevail when anaesthetising pugs - they just need some anaesthesia TLC and they usually cope well. I would say that the being zonked out for a day or so after an anaesthetic has a lot to do with the choice of drug and the dose it is given at.

The virus itself still exists in the environments - but in epidemiological terms, the percentage of the dog population that is vaccinated is high enough to prevent infection and spread amongst that population. It's very common to hear of ferrets dying from distemper - and it is important that they are vaccinated against it. There's also still some suggestion and heated discussion in the medical community about whether Paget's disease in humans may be related to canine distemper - if the relationship could be proved, then vaccination of dogs would become a human public health issue. I don't trust titres tests at this point - from what I've read after their introduction in the US there has been some suggestion that while the "numbers" may be over a certain threshold, the levels don't neccessarily reflect the ability of the animal to respond adequately to an immunological challenge. At this point I'd be happy enough to follow one of the US vaccination protocols, but I wouldn't go as far as never vaccinating again after 12 months.

I'd find a vet that will take the time to listen to all your concerns.... Feathers wont show up on radiographs, but areas of inflammation or other changes in the structure of the lung tissue will. It would also let the vet evaluate the appearance of the heart if you were concerned about that. Another option (instead of, or in conjunction with radiographs) would be an upper airway exam, which is done under very light anaesthesia - to investigate the larynx and pharynx and the proximal part of the oesophagus in some cases. Age is defiantely a consideration for anaesthesia but it doesn't need to discount the possibility of anaesthesia completely. Ideally, the vet should take the time to formulate a plan for anaesthesia that takes into account all the possible complicating factors like age, obesity, prior history etc. A lot of vets can be resistant to change and will only have one "plan" that they use for everything - and when they have a bad experience, they just don't anaesthetise other cases that are like it. Is going to a university vet clinic or specialist centre an option for you? On the one hand long work up can become expensive, but on the other hand they will take you seriously and do a thorough investigation and will save you getting "repeat first consultations" with other vets. Otherwise, choose a vet you get along well with and ask them what they are willing to do to find out what the problem is. Feel free to PM me if you'd like.

Further invetigation would be warranted if you wanted to determine a cause. If there has been no change in the characteristics of the cough for a number of months now, I would be looking for something else. Losing some weight will help generally at this point. I would suggest that you ask whichever vet you see if they feel xrays would be appropriate. Sometimes there can be something going on that you just can't hear - absence of evidence isn't evidence of absence. Two of the things that I would consider would be the possibility of a foreign body (such as grass seeds or something) in the respiratory tract, an inflammatory process that hasn't responded to antibiotics or, given that she is "senior" it's not possible to rule out neoplasia. That's not meant to be a scary list of possibilities, but given her history I would find it hard to just pin it on kennel cough without doing something else. There's more diagnostic tests to determine things, but I think radiographs might be a good place to start, but you would have to talk to your vet about whether they ar appropriate for your dog.

I feed mine Eukanuba Maintenance and occasional table scraps (a few left over hot chips, left over pasta or rice etc). He's very fit, very lean and in beautiful condition. He gets at least 2 walks a day or one walk and 15 mins to belt around the back yard (we live in a 2br apartment).