Erny

I agree SL .... I've been on the receiving end of their bills countless times. But in their defense there's a couple of things to be considered. First is the cost of petrol and the wear and tear on their vehicles. Second is that whilst they are spending time in the car clocking up the travel expenses, they also are precluded from seeing any other customers. If they need to travel 30 minutes to see you, there's one hour of them sitting in the car. Take into account how many animals a small animal vet might be able to see in that one hour period (and the consultation fees they receive as a result) and it is easy to see that the equine vets who visit on site need to charge more. Sure - it doesn't stop me fainting at the expense of it all but I can see why the difference.

What a stunning dog - both from an aesthetic point of view as well as from a performance point of view! I think the decoys deserve a big round of applause as well . Stunning work on all counts.

I'm more focused on what you said in your first post : I'm not concerned so much with your dog's stays, but the fact that she is more reactive with your proximity. And it seems this has been the case from before you began herding with her - not really a "one off". So I'd be searching back at the beginning and working on that aspect more than worrying over her stay work or other things.

Lizzy06 - I'm not a Vet so from that point of view, I'm no expert. There could be many reasons for your dog's low heart rate. Is your dog well, overall? How old is she? What reason/s did your Vet suggest? Was your Vet concerned? And if so, did your Vet suggest any treatment, either now or in the future?

I think there's a clue in what you've said above. Maybe you need to look closer into what you are doing, how you are projecting yourself, and maybe your leadership routine .... and work on the proximity side of things first.

But couple the warmth of the heat mat with a very small amount of moisture and the lack of air due to a dog resting on that point, the moisture could heat up enough to cause a skin burn couldn't it?

Haven't been following this thread which I think was supposed to be more about 'clicking' with a particular dog rather than solely about labs. However I don't think it is fair to criticise people as being "lazy" for sending their dog to the groomers. Maybe they are busy, yet don't want their dog to miss out on coat care. Or maybe they can simply afford for someone else to do it. Maybe, maybe. At least though they are conscious of their dog needing grooming (whether that comprise of a simple wash and dry or something more complex) and are doing something about it. I admit I prefer to groom my own dog myself as it is during those times that I get to especially notice any lumps or bumps or changes that might (or might not) be going on. But not everyone is as paranoid as I am about these things. And a good groomer will pick up on some things as well - perhaps even things that the owners, being unaware of some things, might not think anything of. If I could afford it, I'd pay for someone to come to clean my house for me. I don't think that makes me lazy though. But it does indicate I like a clean house and for it to be cared for.

Ruger01 .... you did well to know your dog well enough to insist on an urgent consultation . No - I've not heard of Liver Torsion (although the more I read the more I realise there are a lot of medical conditions that I have never heard of which affect our dogs). Did the Vets indicate the cause of liver torsion? Are there things that can be done to avoid it or to reduce the chance of it? Or is it 'one of those things'? Glad Ruger is ok and that you got him some help soon enough. Best wishes to him for a speedy recovery. ETA: I've told my current boy he needs to get a job to help pay his Vet bills, but the lazy, irresponsible young lad that he is ...... he's not even bothering to read the "Jobs Vacant" section of the paper . He'll chew and shred it up, yes. But read it? Nup.

Is it perhaps the noise of it she mostly doesn't like? Try having it running and having a favourite game (eg. tug) with her just at the point of her reaction threshold. See if you can desentise to the noise. Work her in gradually over whatever number of sessions it takes for her to be ok with it running when she's in the same room. Then let her watch a few sessions of you walking on the machine. Then let her watch a few sessions of your other dog walking on it and receiving those treats. Is she a little dog? If she is, then you could integrate a few sessions of you holding in your arm/s her whilst you are walking on the machine (assuming this is safe).

He's into the repair/sale of clippers and other grooming equipment, from what I see. I am having an identity crissis here. I've been a woman, a baker, a dog groomer,unable to afford my vet bills Then maybe you need to get some help? . "Human Clippers -vs- Dog Clippers" thread Or does re-reading your own post help to remind you?

He's into the repair/sale of clippers and other grooming equipment, from what I see.

Poodle3081 - OT but you're not by any chance related to/the same as "Poodles Plus" (a previous DOLer who was also "an engineer") or one of the other of "Poodles Plus" alias' (eg. "Lab and Poodle") are you?

See, I don't agree that pushing prices down is always necessarily a good thing - for the business proprietor nor for the Country's economy as a whole. When they are pushed down to a point where it becomes unprofitable and/or what little profit there might be isn't worth it, business ends up going OS. But that would be a whole other argument/debate.

Hey guys. I see where I think Poodle3081 is coming from. I don't think Poodle3081 deserves the sarcasm nor ridicule that's crept into this thread here and there. I don't necessarily agree with all the posts made on the subject, but I do at least recognise the point she(?)'s trying to make. And I don't think that's about just any mark-up on the drugs deployed, but on mark-ups that might be obscenely ridiculous. But Poodle3081 - that is EVERY business owner's prerogative to do. And it is what business competition is about. It is life. The places that are obscenely ridiculous will suffer as consumers will go elsewhere. That's what consumer competition is about. I buy many products of differing kinds and relating to different things. I am often surprised by the mark-up on them by comparison to their true costs. But that IS exactly what business is about. Not every business is the same. So it is a matter of shopping around. But do expect there to be a considerable mark up. I can only imagine some of the hidden expenses to a Vet. Initial out-lay and holding costs. Insurance costs for drugs on premises. Time spent in ordering and dispensing. And so on and so forth.

..... and if the banks brought their fees down, more of us would find the Vet fees (amongst the other countless bills in our lives) more easily affordable!! Problem solv-ed !! Now ...... to convince the bank execs they make so much money that it is obscene.

I think we'd all do better and that it would be more warranted complaining loudly about the mark-up/fees the banks make.

I don't really want to enter the argument of whether Vets over charge or not - I think that's a personal thing that relates to any business and is the business proprietor's right to conduct as he/she thinks fit. Just as it is the customer's right to go there or not - whether that be for the first time, or for any other additional times in the future. As a dog trainer/behaviourist, I know for a fact there are many out there who don't perceive the amount of money, time and travel that goes into learning what we know and to keep abreast of current related matters and to continue our education. So I do appreciate the feeling when people criticise for the amount they might pay for a lesson/consultation - something that might even last them a lifetime or at least the lifetime of their pet and the fact that they themselves didn't have to go to the time, trouble and expense to learn it themselves. But in response to what you've written above, MtE ..... there are many things that I would consider to be privileges that I can't afford that others can. That's life. I do agree that it is nice for the elderly to be able to share the benefits that dogs can bring, but to own one they must be able to reasonably afford its care. Therapy dogs are very good in instances where for various reasons it is not possible or feasable for these people to own a dog. Not as ideal for the person, I'm sure, but it is at least goes part way towards a compromise.

If you don't know by now what I do I recon you will never work it out. Stormie ..... "Nicestman77" includes this in the personal profile page :

That's a very obscure response. Should it have been said at all? It should of been advised. What do you mean by your last response? Are you purposefully being very cryptic?

That's a very obscure response. Should it have been said at all?

But that's fairly normal for most insurance policies (whatever they be for) isn't it? Otherwise people would only take out insurance once they become aware of a problem.

I would be careful about how you treat her for that .... Is it possible that she could perceive you as rewarding the sequence of : look with evil intent + look away on "leave it" = I get a reward. ? Watch your timing for this.

Hi Oonga. It's all a bit up and down at the moment. And changes from one to another (ie good to not so good) seem to be able to occur within the same day or even, as occurs with the hives, within the hour. His coat looks all patchy at the moment as the last bout of hives erupted, have scabbed and the coat has dropped out with the scabs. He still has hives but because he was so covered with them the last time, I can't tell whether they are a new bout of hives or whether they came up when the other ones were still very apparent. One way or the other, whilst there's still a lot of them they seem smaller in size and not as many. He still has some hives which have erupted, scabbed, but not dropped off yet. I don't know yet. But I will say that his care and attention to his health issues has been time consuming. I'm just chugging along with his Allerblend diet and helping him as best as I can with the other of the symptomatic conditions. We're at the 3 week mark now. Five weeks to go. The hope is that it will detox his system. ETA: And Dr. Bruce has been great in that he's been responding to my emails which report of different changes/symptoms, and giving me tips on what to do/how to help. This has removed a good deal of the stress I otherwise would have been feeling along the way. And on a completely different note ..... something weird is happening with my computer. I received a repeat of all the emails I have received over the past week. This has only just happened. I've been through and deleted them all. Now I see, as I type here, that they are all coming back in again. I don't know if this is some sort of virus or whether there is a server glitch or what ????? ETA: OMG! I deleted all the messages again (even deleted them from the deleted box, for the 2nd time), and now they are coming back in for the third time! Turning off and running my virus scans.

At this stage, you just want to be getting puppy used to having a lead and collar on. Use a combo of toys and treats to distract. If he grabs the lead in his mouth a gentle "uh uh" and remove the lead from his mouth. Then resume the distraction therapy. Walk along with your puppy at this point. You can also do little recalls using encouraging movements and voice tone. Don't try to use the lead to guide or steer puppy in these very early first few days. Of course, reward (in your case, click and treat) your puppy for any move in the right direction to your end goal which will be in this instance, to walk on the lead. After two or three days of this, you can begin to use the lead as a restraint, but the major part of your focus will be on distracting puppy away from its own focus on the restraint element. A lead and a collar is a new and novel thing for new pups, who have not yet learnt the meaning of restraint. I didn't do much in the way of leash training for the first week of my pup coming home. Most of the work was in the back yard, rewarding my puppy for voluntarily returning/checking in on me as I walked around. I then moved up to teaching him to do the same but on lead. He did do the grabbing hold of the lead thing (I think that's a natural occurrence at some stage), but I used my voice tone to send the message of what was advantageous and what wasn't and kept working on it consistently until we'd come through that phase.

You might find it is because her herding training is incomplete. Similar to training in drive - in the early days it is possible for dogs to go through the "whatever you have in your hand is for me" phase as they haven't had a chance for their word association training to have been completed. Maybe this is similar - you're not teaching your dog her herding instinct, she already has that. But you are teaching when she can and when she can't exhibit it and you're providing an outlet and chance to obtain drive satisfaction. But I don't know too much on herding training - only what I have seen and then thought out for myself. From the little I've seen on it, I believe that until the "city dog's" herding training is furthered to a higher level, the dog is not put into a big field with a flock of sheep. Instead, the activity is maintained in a coral where the trainer retains control and can shape the dog to the correct behaviours and word association response. I would go back to your instructor and ask him to explain to you how he sees it impacting in other areas and how he sees it improving (assuming that he does). How does this occur? Does he have multiple dogs out training at the one time? ETA: Kelpie-i would know more on this than I do.