RachelleBuck Posted January 14, 2008 Share Posted January 14, 2008 (edited) Hi Everyone, I am after a bit of info here. I have an almost 3 year old BCxKoolie that is very highly strung. I was after some information as to what people would recommened to calm her down a bit. She is a great dog but just can not sit still for 2 seconds to concertrate on anything. A bit of background: Libby has been going to obedience since she was 16 weeks. I have had her since she was a puppy She has had a number of sessions with a behaviourist (which were great help) I have tried using differant foods to see if that worked I have had her on bach flower remedies (a heap of differant conbinations) I have tried rescue remedy I have tried vitamin b It is most likely genetics that makes her this way. (as per her bahaviourist) I have found the session with the behaviourist have helped a great deal but she is just so hypo all the time (I always say she goes off like a frog in a sock!!! ) Her behaviourist said maybe a DAP would help her, only I am worried about my other 2 dogs as if they were made any calmer they wouldn't move at all. Could anyone please give me something else they think may help clam her down a bit. I know she is a really smart dog but she does poorly in obedience as she can not sit still for more than 2 seconds. Thanks everyone for your help!!!! Edited January 14, 2008 by RachelleBuck Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nekhbet Posted January 14, 2008 Share Posted January 14, 2008 what method of obedience are you using Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sheree_e4 Posted January 14, 2008 Share Posted January 14, 2008 Must be a koolie thing Matilda is the same,but I have found that if I don't "talk" to her while training and just use hand signals she calms down as she has to watch to find out whats happening,the more I talk to her or give her direct eye contact the higher she "bounces". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ptolomy Posted January 14, 2008 Share Posted January 14, 2008 I have tried a predopamine tablet to try and calm my obedience dog down (yes he is also stressy) and it was like working a dog that couldn't get out of second gear - I hated it - so I took him off it. It might be what you are after though. My specialist vet suggested giving it a try and said if this one didn't work there were others such as dopamine and pregabba that I could also try. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tonymc Posted January 14, 2008 Share Posted January 14, 2008 Rachelle,there could be several aspects at work here.Firstly a question.Does this Dog show any desire to herd? What is your demeanor like around this Dog?I mean your tone of voice,mood and body language?What is your level of leadership?At times a self assesment of our leadership can be a little off the mark,so it pays to have an experienced person make an objective assesment of our leadership. Rachelle one of the problems with working bred dogs in Surburbia is drive.Does this Dog have any way to release or express drive?A good working Bred Dog if it cannot express drive in a natural way,will adopt other behaviours to do so.These other behaviours are not always desirable. What is the Dogs exercise routine? Do you know this Dogs breeding?Is she from a Working line or bench line? Genetics certainly plays a big part here. My next statement is only the tip of the iceberg and will not rectify all this Dogs problems.but I would start by praising or rewarding desirable behaviour you want and correcting or ignoring unwanted behaviour. You mention her breaking the Sit.With a situation like this go back a few steps.Start again in an enviroment with no or very very little distraction like the Backyard.Get her solid in that enviroment them gradually work up to enviroments with more and more distraction. Tony Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarkS Posted January 14, 2008 Share Posted January 14, 2008 Good points Tony. If its drive she is displaying, exercise, exercise. Remember she is a working dog. She needs to be able to express her drives. Walking her 20 mins to and hour a day may not be enough for her. She needs to get out and run, run, run,run. Tony has made many important points for you to consider. I personally don't agree with medication if its a dog that is becoming frustrated due to not being able to express her drives. How many hours a day is she confined to a yard with little stimulation? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pockets Posted January 14, 2008 Share Posted January 14, 2008 (edited) I know these dogs well, they are all beautiful dogs... Libby (the dog in question) does herding, goes for runs down the park on a daily basis and is heavily involved in all family ongoings...it seems that she is just highly strung...It also seems nothing you can do will wear her out (relax or calm her) at all, she goes swimming, chases the ball, goes for long walks, does herding and obedience... Believe me running is not the answer here, if thats all it was this dog would be perfect, yes she is a working breed, but Rachelle is quite knowledgable in working breeds and stimulates there dogs physically and mentally..... Edited January 14, 2008 by Ruby&Axel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kavik Posted January 14, 2008 Share Posted January 14, 2008 Some dogs need to learn to relax I think. What about teaching a quiet spot/quiet time? Like 'on your mat' or something? With something to chew - a chew toy/kong or Kaos's favourite is those rope bones He will happily lie down and destroy it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RachelleBuck Posted January 14, 2008 Author Share Posted January 14, 2008 (edited) As R&A said she does herding every second weekend and she is great at it. She still goes in full steam but. Once she calms a little she is great with her sheep. She is ran every morning with 30 mintues of full on ball work followed by a swim. Then in the evening she is ran again or taken for a walk. She was trained in the VCA method and that was a flop, she jumps around too much for walking in straight lines. She has now been trained in the NDTF method for the last 2 years. I have seen a behaviourist that pointed out points that would make training her easier ie: reward not correction all the time and this has worked but sometimes it is hard to get the good behaviour to reward. I own Libby's mother and my dad owns her father. We also have two of the other pups from her litter that are nothing like Libby they are quite and calm and sometimes a bit shy. Libby is a differant dog to her family Libby's parents are from working blood lines. Her fathers family is sheep and her mothers sheep/cattle. Her mother is such a quite dog people do not believe me when I say that is her parents as they are just calm solid dogs. Thanks for your help everyone ETA: I have tried to make her have a calm spot, I will put her on her mat and rub her tummy to try and calm her down but she just moves all the time, i am always saying she has ants in her pants. Libby wont even eat a pigs eat sitting still and forgets about food if something else gets her attention. Her fav game is chasing, she will not sit and chew on a toy or lay down for anything. Edited January 14, 2008 by RachelleBuck Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tonymc Posted January 15, 2008 Share Posted January 15, 2008 Rachelle, I am not being disrespectful but every two weeks can be a long time between drinks for a working Dog. Trying to look at all angles and eliminating all possibilites, has the dog had a hair analysis or similar to rule out any inbalance? Rachelle,have you explored training in drive? I agree totally with Mark about medication.Many times medication only masks the real problem/s. Rachelle,is your Father"s Dog working stock? It would be interesting to see changes in this Dog if she were in an enviroment where she was working nearly every day. Tony Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pockets Posted January 15, 2008 Share Posted January 15, 2008 But having her work all day is not an option and I beleive the problem lies deeper than that aswell, she is very reactive to other dogs on lead and looses focus easil as Rachelle stated.. Granted she is a highly driven dog, and she is good at herding (as Rachelle stated a bit overzealous at first) her problem is that she is high strung and reacts quite quickly to a certain situation not that she is lacking in physical and mental stimulation. At the same time as loosing focus she is also absolutly besotted with Rachelle Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarkS Posted January 15, 2008 Share Posted January 15, 2008 (edited) Again Tony I agree. Also if she is continually this overly active.. I am suggesting it could very well be stress related. Again, not being able to express her natural instincts enough. A dog that is constently in a high state of agitation and anxious, is a stressed dog, and not in a balanced state of mind. to me it really sounds like a VERY high drive dog that should be out running/herding a farm every day.. But then hard to say without actually seeing her. But fortnightly runs in drive work I am suggesting may not enough for her. What diet is she on? Edited January 15, 2008 by MarkS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RachelleBuck Posted January 15, 2008 Author Share Posted January 15, 2008 If you could suggest somewhere in Melbourne that herds at least everyweek I would take her. As it is I travel to Elmore every other Saturday to take her herding (I leave home at 5.30am every second Saturday). When there is no situmlation, ie in the back yard, she is a differant dog. She is in no way stressed or anything like that. All our dogs herd in this manner, all 5 of them, and all the others are able to cope. The best way to describe her is like an ADHD kid or a red cordial kid. Libby is on the same diet as all our other dogs with Bonnie and chicken necks/eggs etc. Tonymc what drive to you suggest to train her in. I currently train her in pack drive so that I have control over her when another dog comes to close to her. I won't what to train her in prey as she needs to be in pack so that I can control her. Has anyone used a DAP that could give me some info on them Please?????? I have been recommended this by her qaulified behaviouist but am just worried what effect it may have on my other dogs. Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve K9Pro Posted January 15, 2008 Share Posted January 15, 2008 K9: Its true that some working breeds will never be satisfied with a normal amount of excercise, & that allowing the dog to run, run run will help. But I have found that this is only a short term solution as when the dogs fitness increases, it will need to run run run & run run & run.. My preferred route to success is to do some training in drive so that the dog recieves mental stimulation. I have found 15 minutes mental stimulation can equal 1 hour of running... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jesomil Posted January 15, 2008 Share Posted January 15, 2008 What is your demeanor like around this Dog?I mean your tone of voice,mood and body language?What is your level of leadership?At times a self assesment of our leadership can be a little off the mark,so it pays to have an experienced person make an objective assesment of our leadership This could have alot to do with it maybe?? Your level of leadership and your own demeanor around the dog. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RachelleBuck Posted January 15, 2008 Author Share Posted January 15, 2008 (edited) Libby sees me as the pack leader and will listen to my every word. You can see she is just trying to please so much but is having trouble focusing for more than 2 seconds. With Libby I am very calm and relaxed with her as my emotions shoot striaght down her lead and she reacts to them everytime. I have learnt not to train her when I am upset or not to get upset when she can not do something for more than a couple of seconds. I make everything short and sharp with her as anything more is too much. K9 force what training would you recommend I try in drive? I do not have access to sheep all the time as I live in Melbourne. Is there something else I can try to make her brain work? Edited January 15, 2008 by RachelleBuck Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pockets Posted January 15, 2008 Share Posted January 15, 2008 K9: Its true that some working breeds will never be satisfied with a normal amount of excercise, & that allowing the dog to run, run run will help. But I have found that this is only a short term solution as when the dogs fitness increases, it will need to run run run & run run & run..My preferred route to success is to do some training in drive so that the dog recieves mental stimulation. I have found 15 minutes mental stimulation can equal 1 hour of running... Thats what I was talking about, no amount of running is going to solve the problem... Some people in here seem to suggest, shes a working dog, rehome her on a farm, that might put an end to the problem at one end, but it in no way helps the dog to solve the issue....I would imagine rehoming the dog would do more harm than good, an already anxious dog being taken out of its environment, its pack, its routine and forced into daily life as a working dog, I can only imagine what issues the dog would face then... K9 - you put forward a very good point, mental stimulation can do wonders more than any amount of running.... What sort of mental stimulation would you suggest? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve K9Pro Posted January 15, 2008 Share Posted January 15, 2008 RB: K9 force what training would you recommend I try in drive? I do not have access to sheep all the time as I live in Melbourne. Is there something else I can try to make her brain work? K9: Any training that invloves using a dogs drive is technically training in drive... Anything from having to do a search for the daily meal to training OB in drive.. There are a few that can teach you this or we have Distance Learning Packages that cover this... RA: K9 - you put forward a very good point, mental stimulation can do wonders more than any amount of running....What sort of mental stimulation would you suggest? K9: I havent seen the dog so dont know what makes it driven, but something that is menatally challenging for the dog that will stimulate & exhaust the mind... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pockets Posted January 15, 2008 Share Posted January 15, 2008 RB: K9 force what training would you recommend I try in drive? I do not have access to sheep all the time as I live in Melbourne. Is there something else I can try to make her brain work? K9: Any training that invloves using a dogs drive is technically training in drive... Anything from having to do a search for the daily meal to training OB in drive.. There are a few that can teach you this or we have Distance Learning Packages that cover this... RA: K9 - you put forward a very good point, mental stimulation can do wonders more than any amount of running....What sort of mental stimulation would you suggest? K9: I havent seen the dog so dont know what makes it driven, but something that is menatally challenging for the dog that will stimulate & exhaust the mind... Would something like trick training help?? Or maybe taking the dog out on her own without the pack? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve K9Pro Posted January 15, 2008 Share Posted January 15, 2008 K9: no, no... I would stimulate the dogs drive, for say a toy, then teach it to do something, very simple to win the toy.. Then increase the learned moves to win the toy, making the dogs mental state go from high drive peak to drive initialisation tires the mind. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now