Rebanne

But that's what you want, a breed club that caters for your un papered dog. And I didn't say full of non-reg pet owners either.

How do you know the ANKC's platform is well known to all given that you just said the bit I bolded?

This concept isn't new, I heard it years and years ago and agree with it. I never pat my dogs on the head, couldn't imagine anything more annoying. Photo's here show dogs being stoked or massaged not patted.

My dogs don't like being patted on the head, however they love being stroked.

Was it Stix??? I want to know this as well

Then join the club and work to get things changed instead of sitting on the outside whining about things. ETA in fact start your own club then you can run it the way you want until someone comes along to challenge you.

And you know this how??

Just what I need more time sitting at the computer Forums are fun but they are no substitute for real life hands on getting out and about with your dog but since I'm just the owner of a dodgy pet shop dog I should just crawl back under my rock hey? It's been fun but I really have to go we have gotten a bit OT anyway. If you are not prepared to join your breed club how do you know they have nothing to offer you? You would get a newsletter I assume you would have fun days organised for you. I am a member of a sighthound club in another state, will most likely never ever get to one of their shows or fun days but so what, I am supporting my breed by being a member regardless. it's not always about what you can get out of things.

I didn't need to join a breed club to help me decide that my next dog, after owning a purebred but unregistered dog, was to come from a ANKC registered breeder. I was smart enough to make that decision for myself. And when I did finally join the breed club of my chosen breed back then they were more than happy to add a column to their newsletter called country capers, where people could send in their results from various country shows and trials etc instead of just news from the various branches. All it needed was for someone, me, to write in and ask.

I am grown up and I will frown at anyone who lies on web sites or thinks it's acceptable for others to do so. I do think of the dogs and one of the things I think of is not to vaccinate at 6 weeks, nor to have my dogs separated into groups to live in the back yard, nor to breed some poor bitch 7 times before deciding she was worthy of a home.

The "them" is anyone involved with dogs. Researchers, rescue organisations, dog owners, vets, vet nurses, groomers, scientists, judges, kennel councils, RSPCA, pet breeders, pet shops, feed suppliers, ... The day I'm expected to find common ground with a petshop owner that sources 6 week old pups from puppy farmers and sells them to the first person with a credit card is the day they'll be wearing parkas in hell. There is no common ground to be found with people who exploit dogs for profit. Period. couldn't agree more

well find me a website from a registered lab breeder that proudly states "voted worst breed for leaving hair everywhere by Best Friend Holiday Retreat" or a website from registered French Bulldog breeders that has in it's banner "WANT A FARTING DOG?" and then I will duly frown at Kate for glossing over some matters on a website designed to attract buyers. I note the people on this board most disinclined to take anything said 'onboard' and make quick smart posts dissing the presenters (and even the people who DID go) weren't actually there. Really. No I wasn't there and yes I will diss you when you say it's okay to tell lies on web sites, oops sorry gloss over some aspects of the dogs they are producing. As for Best Friends voting labs as the dogs who leave behind the most hair I don't know as I haven't looked at the web site nor do I know that Frenchies are a breed noted for farting alot. And you of course know this because you know many french bulldogs? To me you are saying it is fine to gloss over things (tell lies) because you want to attract buyers. Not very ethical no matter what you are selling, let alone a living breathing creature that relies on us humans to care for it.

My guess she was honest yesterday. Bear in mind her website is designed to cater to her 'market' - of course you tell fibs when marketing something ;) glad you find the telling of lies to be funny. Wonder if the people who feel duped find lies funny as well. Wonder if the dogs that may now be neglected because of such lies find life funny.

In a shelter at least the animals are there longer than a day, in most cases, so "you" might get some idea on whether music etc does make a difference. Don't see how you can get a true reading from new animals every day. I don't know why you bring this up, and it's a long way off topic at this point, but what if I'd extended the period to 5 days? In one study (in shelters) it was discovered that Classical Music played for 1 hour per day for 5 days resulted in reduced stress in the animals. Handy to know, and at least one study has actually measured it. because you bought it up first re dogs at vets.

Goodo - then you could use the test to find which "UNamicable" dogs you could use as breeding stock. The test is not to say dogs should be "amicable", it's simply meant to be a measure. how can I use it as a test when the context has not been given? What was the test, where was it conducted, what did the stranger do if anything, etc.

I must be very strange as I don't see a problem with a dog not going near a stranger nor do I see a problem with a dog growling at a stranger, depending on the context. Which is not explained here.

In a shelter at least the animals are there longer than a day, in most cases, so "you" might get some idea on whether music etc does make a difference. Don't see how you can get a true reading from new animals every day. A lot of people, racehorse trainers come to mind, do play music for their animals but they are doing so to a fairly static population, not one that changes every day.

7 litters per bitch :D my dogs would need multiple houses complete with couches and queen size beds, not multiple backyard areas. No cages allowed, pens only to be used temporarily; so how do you keep the groups of dogs in their own designated backyard type area? Daily contact of pups by humans, how much is that? 5 minutes when you chuck them some food, or nearly 24/7 as many breeders do.

My suggestion was not a possible test for "amicability", it was an example of something that we CAN quantify. We can count the number of times a dog barks in a vet clinic in the first 24 hours. If that information is useful (and I know of several experiments where it has been useful), then we have an objective measure. You still don't know why they are barking, is it fear, stress, seperation anxiety, over excited, etc, all of which should be handled differently or you worsen the problem. It doesn't tell us how each dog got there and it does require an assumption that in-patient presentations to a vet clinic will follow some sort of statistical norm across a large enough population of dogs (e.g an average number of labs, an average number of terriers, an average number of dogs with broken legs, an average number of dogs who are blind etc etc) but we could test a hypothesis that "water spray collars and citronella collars are equally as effective in reducing barking in the veterinary clinic environment over the first 24 hours of admission" or "Classical music decreases barking in a vet clinic over the first 24 hours compared to no music at all" - and because we can objectively measure the behaviour, we can repeat experiments to see if they continue to provide similar results. How do you objectively measure how effective a "treatment" is when each and every day there would be new dogs in the vet clinic barking? You might strike a day when they are all very mellow or a day when they all set each other off. A day when all the dogs admitted have very stable temperaments or days when they are all stress heads, or a day when they are a mixture. I'll ignore the use of a antibarking collar because I find that thought unbearable but you would have to play music for a long, long time to even come close to seeing if it would work.

:D

chicken pecks are something a chook does, it is part of being a chook, all chooks peck. A test would be easy to work out. Same as all dogs pee so you could measure that behaviour. Amicability, though is in the eye of the beholder, there is no way a test could be developed to check for this, as everyone would have a different view on what amicability is, so no way to test for it. Even testing how many times a dog barks in a vet clinic in 24 hrs as Aidan suggests is totally flawed unless those dogs have lived in a vacuum. I have 4 dogs and all react different while at the vets but all are very amiable, IMO. Like it or not, how a dog has been raised, what it's life experience has been, has a huge impact on it's behaviour. You can not get around that simple fact.

I would have him muzzled and on lead for several days around the cats. Then remove one or the other for a day or two more. I always left the muzzle until last.

Yet the "forprofit" cross-breeders are selecting for temperament over looks, while purebreed breeders may well put looks first. for Dogs sake what a load of bullsh!t, this would have to be the stupidist, most idiotic thing I have ever read here.

a lot of dogs who won't chase a lure will chase live prey, the two are chalk and cheese.

Victorian owners/trainers have to account to the GRV how they dispose of their dogs