Large Straining Dog (march Update)

[spottychick]

Persephone gave a pretty good description and some important caveats. The basic idea is to have the chain running freely along the cable so that he can at least move around beyond the radius set out by the chain. This page gives some tips:

http://www.unchainyourdog.org/Trolley.htm

The cable I have is very strong with good strong crimps at either end, not sure how long it is though. About 5m I guess. I've got stoppers and shackles. Have they got a tree or suitable post? What have we got to work with?

Oh okay! That site was very helpful and I get the picture now. I think he would be best off if I (and/or THEY) could set up something like the ones on that site - with the run line up high.

They have a couple of strong trees around his yard and I reckon the owners brother would be able to put in a post properly if needed. One of the trees is a bit close to the fence tho so I can see where a stopper would be needed.

I wonder if they'd be able to use a slightly lighter chain for him with this set up, or a strong rope?

What are shackles???

Meanwhile I'm having problems with my own dog as the dalmatian I just rescued has attacked my other dog a couple of times and bit me this morning. Someone suggested I PM you about it - would that be okay?

[spottychick]

why dont you use a prong - such a bi9g strong dog will just pull straight through harnesses especially if his pain threshold and excitement are through the roof

A prong collar is the only thing that gave me any control over my big bad boy. I use it with a martingale

and a good quality leather leash. All bought from K9 Force. None of this has broken, which was always my fear with

everything else i tried.

I also have plenty of choke chains i don't need if the OP wants one.

Hi rottylover!!

Thanks for your comments - I'm a little unsure about the harness too except that it clips on at the front and I'll be interested to see how much difference that makes. I certainly wouldn't bother trying an ordinary harness to walk him LOL.

I will see how I go with the harness and if that's not successful - will use choke chains (and thanks for your offer but I am already getting some choke chains in the mail next week - from another rotty lover!!! ) but my main concern is whether I'm strong enough to work him on his own (if I can't the owner can't) using any of these tools. I'm not a weakling but I'm also not very big and I know he can pull me off my feet very easily. If I cant hold him then I'll certainly look at the prong collar.

Interesting website at k9 force

Maybe I should buy him a present of a nice strong tethering collar or harness or something.....

[spottychick]

These connectors are available from Blackdog or Jenny Ireland for about $8. We never sell a head halter or front fastening harness without a connector.

Ah yes, I used to have one of those! Darned if I know where it is tho - trouble is they're so tiny they're easy to misplace if you're disorganised - which I am!

[spottychick]

Aiden - that website is quite inspirational - nice to know I'm not the only mad woman trying to help other people's dogs on chains. There are another 10 households that I know of within a couple of blocks of my house with dogs permanently chained on short leads - It's like a local freakin tradition.

I probably can't help all of them but I'll do my best for at least this one - at least I have an inroad with his owner. There is one other, a little Fox Terrier that I might be able to convince the owners to improve his run (with a bit of caution and diplomacy). He is stuck in a flat bare yard with very little shade, a small kennel (that gets rain in it from certain directions) and no-one actually lives in the house attached to the yard so he's never got company, even at a distance. Someone local feeds him - but I have no idea how often.

Several times I have had to go in there and untwist his chain because he can't move or reach his kennel/water/food and I'm constantly putting his one little blanket back in the kennel for him.

He is such a nice little dog and I have occassionally convinced the people who feed him (relatives of the absent owner) to let me take him for a walk with my dogs. The poor little thing obviously has damaged his trachea from standing on his back legs at the extreme of the chains reach and leaping up and down barking when people go by. So I bought him a little harness and he walks on that beautifully.

[spottychick]

Just a quick update

THe lady who owns Buddy dropped by today - I think she was lured more by wanting to see my new dog than by the fact that I've been leaving messages for her to talk to me about Buddy!!! - but anyway, I made her a coffee and sat down for a chat. I was pretty blunt (but friendly if that makes sense) with her about how badly she's treating Buddy and she agreed. I set out some options for her about Buddy which were basically - you either need to do these things or find him a new home!

Anyway, long story short - I will be going around there tomorrow to look at her yard and work out if there's somwhere that would be suitable to set up a proper run for him. I told her I would try and work out if she can do it without costing a bundle. She has also agreed that she must work on training him and that he needs to be moved from way down the bottom of the block where he can't see anything and has absolutely ZERO stimulus to somewhere where he can see the house and people and interact with everyone while he's chained up or in a run or whatever.

Now this lady is not reliable so it may not work out but it's worth a try.

Meanwhile she said she will buy him a more expensive leather collar for the chaining up and asked me what sort of treats would be best to get him for training.

So, fingers crossed that she really will follow through this time.

[Erny]

Well done, Spottychick. You have and are going beyond the call of duty in your help for this woman (and obviously for the dog, being the main reason). You've handled the situation really well, by all accounts, and I do hope you've managed to be the catalyst for an improved lifestyle for this dog.

Cheers and I wish you much good karma for all the good you are doing. Whether this lady ends up being true to her word or not (and of course for the dog's sake we would all hope she does), you've done your darndest and for all the right, good and heartfelt compassionate reasons.

Good for you. You're a

[spottychick]

awwww shucks Erny

[persephone]

It is sounding good!

SO many people have not seen dogs who ARE well adjusted/socialised/indoor dogs- they just have no idea of what can be accomplished, or how much work is needed....or what pleasure can then be gained

[spottychick]

Persephone - I think you're right about people SEEING what can be done with a dog and what a joy it can be.

The reason I think this lady is so willing to listen to me is that she has seen my dalmatians over the past 3 years that I've lived here and she is stunned by how well behaved they are (well.... most of the time LOL) She thought it was because of their breed (ROFLMAO if only she KNEW) but I think she's realising it's about how they're treated. And I suspect she wants a dog that will do what my dogs do (this is of course not including the mad beast we've just adopted!!!). But more importantly, I think she finally gets it that the way my dogs behave takes a lot of WORK!

She used to come round to see my other dog when he was sick to see how he was, I think it's the first time she's really related to a dog as a feeling, sensitive being. My boy had that effect on people, he was very gentle and sort of connected with people. She was genuinely devastated and cried her heart out when he died.

Yesterday she saw how the new dog is already starting to be as calm and cool round the house as my others have been and she said "OMG he's just like your other boy". He's nothing like him of course LOL but I knew what she meant.

So I really think she feels hope that Buddy might be able to get to something like my dogs one day and that MIGHT make the difference here.

[persephone]

excellent- she is being encouraged to see what is possible - if she decides it's too hard, fair enough, but she is at least now making a start.

[Aidan]

Well done Spottychick, sounds like you've handled it really well and opened up some eyes. Who knows how far this will spread in your sleepy little town? She won't be the only person you reach, whether you know it or not.

[spottychick]

Okay - a little update! Actually it's a bit long but I'm excited and wanted to give the whole story!

I went around to Buddy's owners house today and we got Buddy out of his "prison". As usual I sheltered behind a large tree because he just barrels straight into people when he first gets loose and has knocked me over in the past. I waited till he was sniffing at things instead of charging at people then we tried to pat him (almost impossible - think 50 or so kg hyperactive puppy). After a while we put a choke chain on him and I also put an Easy Walker harness on him. It has taken two of us to hold him in the past so we put a lead on both the chain and the harness and held a lead each.

Buddy immediately started leaping in the air and doing clever twirls which twisted the two leads together and totally skuppered our plans. All the while his tongue is out and his tail is wagging furiously and he's trying his darnedest to wrench our arms out of their sockets.

SO I unclipped the harness and we tried walking him just with the choker chain - his owner (let's call her "Sam") felt she could hold him by herself with the choke chain on. And off they went LMAO screaming around the garden in this frantic tug of war, each pulling against the other. She was all red faced and puffing and looking angry but trying really hard not to yell at him. It was hell to watch and Buddy was running with his front legs off the ground and making this horrific rasping noise. I stopped it because I'm worried he's damaged his trachea being chained up and straining and hanging himself all the time - I didn't think this was going well at all.

So I clipped my lead onto the harness instead and led him away (while she recovered sitting on the grass!) AND OH MY GOD! A different dog. Apart from initially an occasional attempt to leap right into my face (one of which landed a blow on my mouth and actually knocked my front tooth loose - I kid you not!!!) he was walking calmly on the Easy Walker within a couple of minutes, no pulling, no straining. He just walked next to me and sometimes slightly ahead calmly sniffing at the ground and looking around with this happy expression. Occassionally he'd try to go off in his own direction and I'd tell him "This way Buddy" in my quiet but silly "isnt this fun" voice and he'd follow me.

"Sam" and her brother were sitting on the lawn watching all this and they both had their mouths hanging open in shock.

I asked Sam if she wanted a try and she leapt at the offer. I handed the lead to Sam and she happily walked him round the yard like he'd been trained to walk on a loose leash!! I gave her a few instructions (eg dont yell at him, talk in a happy voice, give him losts of praise he's doing the right thing, distract him when he pulls toward the cat etc) but otherwise she was doing it all by herself. Walking her dog and SMILING!!!!

SHe was so stunned and thrilled she took him out of the yard and into the recreation ground next door and we walked him all the way to the other side of the oval - with absolutely NO pulling, no misbehaving - NOTHING. A couple of times a passing dog distracted him and I just told her to pull him back to her and say lightly "Come on Buddy! Let's go!" or whatever - so she did and he stopped being interested in the dog and looked at HER!!!!

I can't tell you how transformed this dog was. We even got him to sit a few times and get a quiet non-hyper chest rub.

I am absolutely thrilled! 'Sam is clearly excited by what happened and is talking about walking him to the river everyday when she gets back from a trip on Tuesday. I really think she means it this time because she was so happy walking him. She just kept going across the oval long after I thought she'd stop and being really nice to him - she even ran with him for a while!!! (This woman rarely runs LOL).

Thankyou especially to CavNRott for helping me out with this and for all the suggestions and support from folks in this thread.

We were looking at Buddy today - first time I could actually see him properly because he wasn't moving like a maniac all the time. He looks like a mastiff cross labrador. He is totally gorgeous. Every time I tried to get him to sit he tried to roll over for a belly rub. Not in a cringing way - just in a puppy happy way, flinging his legs around in the air - and sort of gnawed on my hand and licked my face.

He was one happy pooch when I left.

I'm going to try and remember my camera next time and hopefully get a pic or two!!! :D

[Cosmolo]

Well done!

[persephone]

Tears in my eyes ....

what a good story.

Well Done

[cavNrott]

What fantastic news Thanks for the update Spottychick. I was wondering how it was going with you and Buddy and was rather afraid to ask :D

Great work on your part and hopefully now Sam is able to control Buddy with the harness on she'll spend a lot more time with him.

Hope your poor front tooth is ok.

[harley]

That is fantastic news! What a lovely person you are, well done :D

[spottychick]

Thanks guys! I forgot to add the other slightly better thing - he had a chain round his neck that was held together with wire wrapped multiple times around the two end links. THere were at least two major issues with this. One is that if he ever got the chain collar caught on something no-one would be able to get the chain off him which could be life threatening. And the second is that the ends of the wire wrap were extremely sharp ( they cut Sam's finger when she went to grab the collar) and were sticking into Buddy!!!!

ANyway, when I was there today, without any prompting, her brother went inside and found a "shackle". Then he got pliers and unwound the wire wrap from the chain (took ages!!!) and replaced it with the shackle loop. SO at least Buddy is slightly more comfortable tonight when chained up at the back of the block. Baby steps - still working on getting a better "containment" system for Buddy.

ps CavnRott - my tooth has actually been knocked out of whack so it's now loose and slightly pushed in one side and out on the other - if that makes sense. I'm having trouble biting into my toast

Edited January 14, 2010 by spottychick

[Aidan]

ANyway, when I was there today, without any prompting, her brother went inside and found a "shackle". Then he got pliers and unwound the wire wrap from the chain (took ages!!!) and replaced it with the shackle loop. SO at least Buddy is slightly more comfortable tonight when chained up at the back of the block. Baby steps - still working on getting a better "containment" system for Buddy.

Haha, so now you know what a shackle is

P.S I haven't forgotten about the cable and parts, I'm just trying to locate all the bits that I know I have... somewhere...

[Casster17]

OMG I poped back in to update myself on this thread expecting to read he had done something else bad... but low and behold a miracle...

WELL DONE Spottychick!!!!!!!!

[spottychick]

LOL I'm happy to surprise you Casster!!!

Yep Aiden - NOW I know what they are. No worries re finding all the bits. I'm still working on getting them to set up the posts closer to the house in a spot than can be later converted to a proper run.