The Ark Posted January 22, 2011 Author Share Posted January 22, 2011 Hey at least these people were honest with you.Better that than telling you everything you wanted to hear, and then using one of your pups for breeding anyway. Hopefully you have enlightened them and they think carefully about their next pet. Yes that's right Esky. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Staranais Posted January 22, 2011 Share Posted January 22, 2011 Good on you The Ark for doing your best to educate them politely. I think many newbies are put off by the idea of a "show breeder" if they only want a pet - they think (reasonably enough) why would I go to a breeder of show dogs if I don't want a show dog? And to be frank, when ANKC breeders are allowed to sell puppies through petstores, it sends confusing messages to newbies - why does one ANKC breeder sell puppies through petstores, and the next ANKC breeder tell you off for buying them? I can understand why newbies are confused. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Christina Posted January 22, 2011 Share Posted January 22, 2011 I don't interpret Dogs SA as restricting trade by saying in their code of ethics that members cannot sell to pet shops. I interpret it as saying that members must abide by the code or they won't be members. They are not saying it is illegal in the country. They are just saying we don't want our members doing this. If you join any group & go against what they stand for they are entitled to tell you to withdraw. Taking it to the law is the only recourse & most people won't bother. Sounds like some states caved in to awkward members to save any possible further trouble, their rule may have been upheld in court with the right legal help. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kia Posted January 22, 2011 Share Posted January 22, 2011 Hi The Ark.....welcome to the world of breeding..... .....there should be a warning label While a lot of puppy people are very genuine there are the others out there that make life so frustrating Education is the key but even that can backfire on us as the people we really don't want getting our puppies learn to tick all the boxes. Telling them pups will be desexed usually ends the line of enquiry with these. I had an enquiry from a person who had a petshop pup that was from a"breeder" Turned out that it was a backyarder but the kicker was the pet shop telling these people that they came from xxxxx kennel. The fact that she was overcharged for a pup from parents that hadn't been health tested....she wasn't overly impressed that she got ripped off..... As for the papered pups........people really don't know what it means. A young lass I work with has a "purebred, papered" Staffy... err sorry it's a cross breed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Posted January 22, 2011 Share Posted January 22, 2011 I don't interpret Dogs SA as restricting trade by saying in their code of ethics that members cannot sell to pet shops.I interpret it as saying that members must abide by the code or they won't be members. They are not saying it is illegal in the country. They are just saying we don't want our members doing this. If you join any group & go against what they stand for they are entitled to tell you to withdraw. Taking it to the law is the only recourse & most people won't bother. Sounds like some states caved in to awkward members to save any possible further trouble, their rule may have been upheld in court with the right legal help. Not true - this was a decision via the ACCC there was no choice. If you remove them from the membership for selling to a pet shop they can no longer register their puppies on the ANKC register - it devalues their product and removes their markets and in some states removes the ability they have for lowered rates and exemptions with councils and regos etc. The ANKC is the only registry which has FCI affiliation and it removes the ability to access and sell over seas.It removes their ability to show or compete with their dogs which again limits their market and de values their product. You are restricting them in where they can seel their product over someone who is not a member. You cant tell someone where they can or cannot sell their products,you can not collude and fix prices you can not participate in anti competitive or inequitable trade practices. These are federal laws. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rebanne Posted January 22, 2011 Share Posted January 22, 2011 There is someone near Victor Harbor SA who advertises poodle like puppies for sale on gumtree and they say they're a registered breeder. I rang up SACA and asked them and they said no way is that person registered with them and no reputable breeder (eg member of SACA) would sell via the trading post or gumtree or even breed without having potential owners lined up in advance. how stupid! if you don't advertise where most people look how are these people ever going to find out about good breeders and good dogs It's up to the breeder to then vet any potential owner no matter where they come from. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Posted January 22, 2011 Share Posted January 22, 2011 There is someone near Victor Harbor SA who advertises poodle like puppies for sale on gumtree and they say they're a registered breeder. I rang up SACA and asked them and they said no way is that person registered with them and no reputable breeder (eg member of SACA) would sell via the trading post or gumtree or even breed without having potential owners lined up in advance. how stupid! if you don't advertise where most people look how are these people ever going to find out about good breeders and good dogs It's up to the breeder to then vet any potential owner no matter where they come from. Yep. This thought process has been plugged by animal rights and it has huge consequences. It is stupid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
espinay2 Posted January 23, 2011 Share Posted January 23, 2011 If you want to teach the average person to buy from a responsible registered breeder, then responsible registered breeders have to advertise where the average person looks! Very much agree with Steve. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mrs Rusty Bucket Posted January 23, 2011 Share Posted January 23, 2011 Well the average people look in pet shops. Same as when they're looking for cars. But the smarter ones go to the clubs to find out what's good. And the breed clubs could do PR by getting on radio shows, doing talk back, doing a stand at a shopping centre or the beach or sports grounds, visiting schools, ringing up reporters and helping them write an article or three etc. But do you really want people impulse buying puppies without doing the prep work that goes with it. A lot of average people are using the internet, so they should be able to get the ANKC breeder lists and show lists up when they search for (poodle) puppies. But ANKC doesn't come near the top of the list so maybe they need to adjust their web page until they do have "puppies for sale" or how to buy a puppy etc in their website information. DOL comes up but given the blue staffy lists - not sure that DOL is the first place I'd look for a breeder. Then again - I go to the pound. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Ark Posted January 23, 2011 Author Share Posted January 23, 2011 If you want to teach the average person to buy from a responsible registered breeder, then responsible registered breeders have to advertise where the average person looks! Very much agree with Steve. I can see the logic in this, but it is hard to take that step and advertise in the very places where puppy farmers and other undesirables do. I guess it's a fear of not differentiating ourselves from them - but you're right. This is where many members of the public look (if they're not staring into a pet shop window) so maybe that is part of the solution. Having just looked through another thread by feistylady which kind of followed on from this one I can understand the frustration of the genuine puppy buyer who doesn't receive any acknowledgement of their enquiry. I am pretty sure I have never missed replying to an email - although as evidenced by this thread maybe it would be better if I didn't reply quite so promptly in some cases. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mita Posted January 23, 2011 Share Posted January 23, 2011 That was a great enquiry. Gave you all the reasons to say No.At least they didn't lie & say I want a little girl for my widowed mother for company but it must have main registered papers or I will feel ripped off paying so much. Yeah :p Sad thing is that they will get a puppy from someone. At least you tried to explain. I agree with this. TA, I think you gave courteous replies to these honest people. In a few words you managed to be educational without sounding as if you were blaming them for not knowing. I can understand your feeling angry that a registered breeder might launch their puppies into a new life via a pet shop. Where god alone knows who'd buy them & do what with them. But you didn't take this anger out on the enquirers. I wish there were ways that the registered breeders & pet owners who have their dogs, could interface with the general public. Not at dog shows, where people are too busy. But I'd like to see Purebred Pride days where people could come mingle & learn a lot about the purebred dog world. Also Breed Club Days, open to the public. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaxx'sBuddy Posted January 24, 2011 Share Posted January 24, 2011 That was a great enquiry. Gave you all the reasons to say No.At least they didn't lie & say I want a little girl for my widowed mother for company but it must have main registered papers or I will feel ripped off paying so much. Yeah :p Sad thing is that they will get a puppy from someone. At least you tried to explain. I agree with this. TA, I think you gave courteous replies to these honest people. In a few words you managed to be educational without sounding as if you were blaming them for not knowing. I can understand your feeling angry that a registered breeder might launch their puppies into a new life via a pet shop. Where god alone knows who'd buy them & do what with them. But you didn't take this anger out on the enquirers. I wish there were ways that the registered breeders & pet owners who have their dogs, could interface with the general public. Not at dog shows, where people are too busy. But I'd like to see Purebred Pride days where people could come mingle & learn a lot about the purebred dog world. Also Breed Club Days, open to the public. me too. i think this is a great idea. i would like it to be advertised well so the general public knew it was on and knew when to attend. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mita Posted January 24, 2011 Share Posted January 24, 2011 (edited) JB, we've talked about it before on DOL, how pet owners of purebred dogs from registered breeders are a great front-line for 'educating' the general public. I used to think I really, really didn't like big standard poodles. But I've come across pet owners & their p/b standard poodles....& I've learned what truly delightful dogs they are in everyday life. They're now in my top 10 favourite dogs! Now imagine a pretty informal outdoor activity where registered breeders & their dogs, and pet owners with their purebred dogs, are welcoming of the general public. Just to enjoy & learn & maybe make contacts. Maybe the general pet buying public would come to appreciate why the good registered breeders are so protective of who gets their puppies & of their dogs' bloodlines, generally. Edited January 24, 2011 by mita Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RallyValley Posted January 24, 2011 Share Posted January 24, 2011 We need something like PAL Superdogs again... I found one reference to them online: http://equestrian.cyberhorse.com.au/index....s&Itemid=37 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaxx'sBuddy Posted January 24, 2011 Share Posted January 24, 2011 JB, we've talked about it before on DOL, how pet owners of purebred dogs from registered breeders are a great front-line for 'educating' the general public. I used to think I really, really didn't like big standard poodles. But I've come across pet owners & their p/b standard poodles....& I've learned what truly delightful dogs they are in everyday life. They're now in my top 10 favourite dogs! Now imagine a pretty informal outdoor activity where registered breeders & their dogs, and pet owners with their purebred dogs, are welcoming of the general public. Just to enjoy & learn & maybe make contacts. Maybe the general pet buying public would come to appreciate why the good registered breeders are so protective of who gets their puppies & of their dogs' bloodlines, generally. i think something like this was going to happen in fed square in melbourne but the event was cancelled due to weather. i haven't heard if it was rescheduled. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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