Advice On A Breed For Our Lifestlye (found)

[JackC]

Although I haven't had much to do with these dogs, I imagine that a Lapphund or a Schipperke could work.

I think the best thing to do when you're a bit overwhelmed with making a choice is to narrow it down to 2 or 3 breeds that have the right attributes for your lifestyle and then go to a show where you can meet them. You might find that when you see them in real life and get to interact with them that you will really be attracted to one breed more than the others :)

Thanks raineth,

Didn't think about going to an event to see them all up close, me and the miss's both really like the look of the Lappy, Shetland sheepdog and Schipperke and if they fit our life style then that's great, its kinda hard to choose between them so we should probably start talking to a few local breeders and maybe try to meet one face to face.

Jack

Edited May 3, 2013 by JackC

[corvus]

My Lapphund is basically the perfect dog. :D He is a particularly big one at around 25kg, but he also has a very big coat. The coat is the hardest thing about him. I should really brush it a couple of times a week. When he's shedding (twice a year), it takes me hours to strip the undercoat out. If I don't do that it felts up. Also, he loves to roll in stinky things and if we have to wash him it takes all day for him to dry. If we take him out in the rain for a walk he's wet for the rest of the day. He needs a raincoat. The girls are smaller and usually have less coat. My boy is about as non-reactive as a dog can be. He is very chilled and easy-going. Generally the breed is pretty chilled, but I haven't met many that approach him in sheer laid-backedness. He's very easy to manage. He's kind of trainable, but nothing compared to my Vallhund. The Vall is a whole different beast. They are both spitz herders, but the Lappie is more spitz than herder and the Vall is more herder than spitz. The Lappie's recall took a lot more work to train and takes a lot more work to maintain than the Vall's.

My Lappie is not one for "vigorous" exercise. He plays hard with the Vall for about 5 minutes and he's done. He can keep up on a long hike (5 hours is the longest we've done with him), but a long road walk is something else. He drags the chain after about an hour. He likes to stop and smell the roses. He is extremely friendly and sweet-natured and is very gentle and affectionate. Everybody loves him. He is not as cuddly as the Vall, but the Vall is a cuddle machine. The Lappie likes to be close to you, but not on top of you. He is fine if you come and cuddle him, but we usually only get him coming to us for the morning cuddles in bed. He has been known to sneak onto the bed in the dead of night and somehow insert himself into my arms without me waking up. In the morning I open my eyes to find I'm spooning with a Lapphund. Generally speaking, though, he's more of a passive cuddler.

I'd also consider a corgi. They are short and stocky, but so cute! And they are a bit easier to train and care for than a Lappie IMO. A Japanese Spitz might work for you, but some of them can be a bit reactive.

ETA, he also woo-woos and howls to greet people he is especially fond of. It's adorable. The other day we were having a greeting love-in and I dropped something and said "Nooooo!" and Kivi howled with me. Exactly, Kivi!

Edited May 3, 2013 by corvus

[LisaCC]

I second a Corgi, I don't know heaps about them but from those I've met they seem to match what you are after. Also they are freaking adorable!

[Bjelkier]

If you're interested in a dog JS sized what knocked the JS of the list for you? There is also the German Spitz that comes in a variety of colours if that is what you're after.

That being said I'd never recommend a Spitz if you want trustful dog off leash. They all seem to have their own ideas of what they are and aren't allowed to do. But that's half the appeal for a lot of Spitz owners.

A Corgi might be a good choice

Edited May 3, 2013 by Bjelkier

[JackC]

My Lapphund is basically the perfect dog. :D He is a particularly big one at around 25kg, but he also has a very big coat. The coat is the hardest thing about him. I should really brush it a couple of times a week. When he's shedding (twice a year), it takes me hours to strip the undercoat out. If I don't do that it felts up. Also, he loves to roll in stinky things and if we have to wash him it takes all day for him to dry. If we take him out in the rain for a walk he's wet for the rest of the day. He needs a raincoat. The girls are smaller and usually have less coat. My boy is about as non-reactive as a dog can be. He is very chilled and easy-going. Generally the breed is pretty chilled, but I haven't met many that approach him in sheer laid-backedness. He's very easy to manage. He's kind of trainable, but nothing compared to my Vallhund. The Vall is a whole different beast. They are both spitz herders, but the Lappie is more spitz than herder and the Vall is more herder than spitz. The Lappie's recall took a lot more work to train and takes a lot more work to maintain than the Vall's.

My Lappie is not one for "vigorous" exercise. He plays hard with the Vall for about 5 minutes and he's done. He can keep up on a long hike (5 hours is the longest we've done with him), but a long road walk is something else. He drags the chain after about an hour. He likes to stop and smell the roses. He is extremely friendly and sweet-natured and is very gentle and affectionate. Everybody loves him. He is not as cuddly as the Vall, but the Vall is a cuddle machine. The Lappie likes to be close to you, but not on top of you. He is fine if you come and cuddle him, but we usually only get him coming to us for the morning cuddles in bed. He has been known to sneak onto the bed in the dead of night and somehow insert himself into my arms without me waking up. In the morning I open my eyes to find I'm spooning with a Lapphund. Generally speaking, though, he's more of a passive cuddler.

I'd also consider a corgi. They are short and stocky, but so cute! And they are a bit easier to train and care for than a Lappie IMO. A Japanese Spitz might work for you, but some of them can be a bit reactive.

ETA, he also woo-woos and howls to greet people he is especially fond of. It's adorable. The other day we were having a greeting love-in and I dropped something and said "Nooooo!" and Kivi howled with me. Exactly, Kivi!

Love the mimicking howl haha :)

they look beautiful dogs and why it is so hard to choose between the breeds.

I think the next step for us is to get out and meet some of these we have narrowed down to

[JackC]

If you're interested in a dog JS sized what knocked the JS of the list for you? There is also the German Spitz that comes in a variety of colours if that is what you're after.

That being said I'd never recommend a Spitz if you want trustful dog off leash. They all seem to have their own ideas of what they are and aren't allowed to do. But that's half the appeal for a lot of Spitz owners.

A Corgi might be a good choice

The off leash part did put me off a little, my sister in law has one and its so beautiful and so cute but she is so independent that its very hard to keep her in control when you need her to be, its not really off the list as per say just unsure it will adapt well to our lifestyle and requirments

[Bjelkier]

If you're interested in a dog JS sized what knocked the JS of the list for you? There is also the German Spitz that comes in a variety of colours if that is what you're after.

That being said I'd never recommend a Spitz if you want trustful dog off leash. They all seem to have their own ideas of what they are and aren't allowed to do. But that's half the appeal for a lot of Spitz owners.

A Corgi might be a good choice

The off leash part did put me off a little, my sister in law has one and its so beautiful and so cute but she is so independent that its very hard to keep her in control when you need her to be, its not really off the list as per say just unsure it will adapt well to our lifestyle and requirments

Perhaps you should look at a more biddable style of dog then instead of the Spitz. Lappies can be trained (any dog can) but it's the amount of effort you're willing and able to put into the dog. Spitz styles will almost always require that little bit more work.

What about a CKCS or a Shih Tzu?

Edited May 3, 2013 by Bjelkier

[Sheridan]

If you're interested in a dog JS sized what knocked the JS of the list for you? There is also the German Spitz that comes in a variety of colours if that is what you're after.

That being said I'd never recommend a Spitz if you want trustful dog off leash. They all seem to have their own ideas of what they are and aren't allowed to do. But that's half the appeal for a lot of Spitz owners.

A Corgi might be a good choice

The off leash part did put me off a little, my sister in law has one and its so beautiful and so cute but she is so independent that its very hard to keep her in control when you need her to be, its not really off the list as per say just unsure it will adapt well to our lifestyle and requirments

The dogs that do really well off lead are the dogs that are really well trained. Or the ones like these.

[dancinbcs]

If you're interested in a dog JS sized what knocked the JS of the list for you? There is also the German Spitz that comes in a variety of colours if that is what you're after.

That being said I'd never recommend a Spitz if you want trustful dog off leash. They all seem to have their own ideas of what they are and aren't allowed to do. But that's half the appeal for a lot of Spitz owners.

A Corgi might be a good choice

A JS could have a ball yapping incessantly at the noise of the planes. They also don't do well left alone all day so I don't think a JS would fit the bill except for size.

[Bjelkier]

If you're interested in a dog JS sized what knocked the JS of the list for you? There is also the German Spitz that comes in a variety of colours if that is what you're after.

That being said I'd never recommend a Spitz if you want trustful dog off leash. They all seem to have their own ideas of what they are and aren't allowed to do. But that's half the appeal for a lot of Spitz owners.

A Corgi might be a good choice

A JS could have a ball yapping incessantly at the noise of the planes. They also don't do well left alone all day so I don't think a JS would fit the bill except for size.

I totally agree, I wasn't recommending so much as asking why they decided against it.

Edited May 3, 2013 by Bjelkier

[kelpiecuddles]

What about a hungarian puli, an ex neighbour of mine had one and he was a very cruisy little fella. Plus who could go past that hairdo!

[JackC]

If you're interested in a dog JS sized what knocked the JS of the list for you? There is also the German Spitz that comes in a variety of colours if that is what you're after.

That being said I'd never recommend a Spitz if you want trustful dog off leash. They all seem to have their own ideas of what they are and aren't allowed to do. But that's half the appeal for a lot of Spitz owners.

A Corgi might be a good choice

A JS could have a ball yapping incessantly at the noise of the planes. They also don't do well left alone all day so I don't think a JS would fit the bill except for size.

I totally agree, I wasn't recommending so much as asking why they decided against it.

The main reason was being left alone, my sister in laws one has redesigned the back yard because they work allot as well and the JS needs to be entertained allot during the day or will find its own entertainment :)

I'm not making it a requirement to be an "off the leash" dog, the only time she would be off the leash is up at the mount or in a large open area with no main roads. our park area is not suited to off the leash dogs unless I spend the time and dedication to train her well enough to behave when off (which I'm willing to do)

Edited May 3, 2013 by JackC

[corvus]

The dogs that do really well off lead are the dogs that are really well trained. Or the ones like these.

Yes and no. It took about 12 months to get a reliable recall on the Lappie, but we never really actually trained one for the Vall. He just doesn't stray far. Mostly we just reward him as well when he comes to Kivi's recall. He does have one of his own, but it's never been intensively trained like Kivi's and it is not maintained like Kivi's.

Both dogs are great off leash in the bush. They run ahead and stop on the path and wait for us to catch up. We never taught either of them to do that. I know dogs who just don't have that inherent need to know where the pack is. The corgi I had as a kid never really left my sight when she was off leash. I didn't teach her a recall at all. All I ever did was say "good girl" if I called her and she came back. I don't remember ever having her run off to do her own thing. Like the Vall, she was not comfortable not knowing where I was. She took it upon herself to keep track of me.

[W Sibs]

I suggest you to to a dog show and walk around see other breeds and talk to their breeders/owner. Although by the sound of things.. I wouldn't suggest a Spitz breed, I will think a Cavalier King Charles Spaniel will suit you better :)

All dogs regardless they are spitz breed or not, if you put in the work and effort, you're going to have a good dog... you are rarely going to get a really good dog and obedient without training and putting in the world. Especially if you want the dog to be trust worthy off the leash.

Spitz breeds are known to be independent and having their own mind, they have a streak in them where you if you don't have a sense of humour about it you are going to go mental...

I know a few lappies and even though they are amazing dogs, I have seen what kind of work their owners do mold them that way. They are working breed dogs, so they like to be worked...

BTW, I have a Japanese Spitz and she is my best trained dog I have at home. I trust her off leash completely :p But, I won't recommend you a Jap Spitz either... they are companion dogs (which means they like being you with at all time) and leaving them at home alone for long period of time will cause them stress and they can get destructive and very yappie.

[Salukifan]

Can I just say that no matter whether or not your dog is inclined to stay with you and no matter how well you've trained a recall, I'd not trust a dogs' life to it.

Roads, remote control aircraft, non-dog friendly folk at remote control aircraft events, small kids - all pose a risk to the life and safety of your dog.

Frankly you're better off assuming your dog will bugger off and managing it accordingly. They live longer that way.

When you are away from road and major distractions, or in a secure space AND your dog has your complete focus then offlead becomes doable, particuarly if the dog has a good recall. Otherwise? Nope, no way.

Edited May 3, 2013 by Haredown Whippets

[juice]

i think corgi too, loads of attitude :laugh:

we have a cardigan a few doors up.

[Mrs Rusty Bucket]

The gun dogs will probably cope with the flying machines. They're supposed to sit with the shooter until told to go get the shot bird, or go when sent to flush birds off the ground for shooting and then fetch them - without damaging or chewing the bird on retrieve. You'd have to train some of that, but some of it comes naturally to them. And if you want one that is true to the breed temperament - you might want to go to a gun dog club meet and see who has what and where they come from rather than go to some commercial (pet shop) or back yard breeder (gumtree) who doesn't choose for hunting skills.

I have a cattle dog bitsa and I have managed to train her to ignore the glider and model airplane club that meets in the off lead space, right next to our dog club. Not the easiest neighbours.

My dog still likes chasing model cars - and the model car owners actively encourage it which is a bit disconcerting. At least she doesn't tear them to pieces but I think that's just pure luck she's that kind of dog, and not due to training on my part.

Gundogs include Nova Scotia Duck Tolling Retriever, Labradors, Golden Retrievers, Spaniels (various), Pointers (various) and more. Some of them are better at the sit and wait kind of work and others are better at the flush game kind of work. You probably want one of the sit and wait sort. But others would be able to advise better. All of them can be very fit dogs and trainable. Some of them are not great outside dogs - their coats are too thin (in my opinion).

[Salukifan]

The gun dogs will probably cope with the flying machines. They're supposed to sit with the shooter until told to go get the shot bird, or go when sent to flush birds off the ground for shooting and then fetch them - without damaging or chewing the bird on retrieve.

And most of which requires considerable training and proofing.

Most gundogs I know, if left alone up to 10 hours a day as youngsters, will make what a Jap Spitz can do to a backyard look lke gardening.

Edited May 3, 2013 by Haredown Whippets

[kelpiecuddles]

Actually the Tollers aren't a large dog, they might fit you wants quite nicely.

[JackC]

I suggest you to to a dog show and walk around see other breeds and talk to their breeders/owner. Although by the sound of things.. I wouldn't suggest a Spitz breed, I will think a Cavalier King Charles Spaniel will suit you better :)

All dogs regardless they are spitz breed or not, if you put in the work and effort, you're going to have a good dog... you are rarely going to get a really good dog and obedient without training and putting in the world. Especially if you want the dog to be trust worthy off the leash.

Spitz breeds are known to be independent and having their own mind, they have a streak in them where you if you don't have a sense of humour about it you are going to go mental...

I know a few lappies and even though they are amazing dogs, I have seen what kind of work their owners do mold them that way. They are working breed dogs, so they like to be worked...

BTW, I have a Japanese Spitz and she is my best trained dog I have at home. I trust her off leash completely :p But, I won't recommend you a Jap Spitz either... they are companion dogs (which means they like being you with at all time) and leaving them at home alone for long period of time will cause them stress and they can get destructive and very yappie.

Can I just say that no matter whether or not your dog is inclined to stay with you and no matter how well you've trained a recall, I'd not trust a dogs' life to it.

Roads, remote control aircraft, non-dog friendly folk at remote control aircraft events, small kids - all pose a risk to the life and safety of your dog.

Frankly you're better off assuming your dog will bugger off and managing it accordingly. They live longer that way.

When you are away from road and major distractions, or in a secure space AND your dog has your complete focus then offlead becomes doable, particuarly if the dog has a good recall. Otherwise? Nope, no way.

Thanks all, we know that we will have to put the hard yarns in with what ever breed we choose, and I agree that we would not risk our dog off leash unless it was a controlled situation. even up on the mount I would probably have here on a long leash.

We are dedicated to caring as much for the dog as we are to getting the right soul mate, this isn't something we are going to rush.

I guess all in all the only major requirement that matters is a breed of dog that will be happy and not destructive if left alone at home while we work during the day on weekdays, everything else is workable and manageable.

No one gets the perfect dog and I guess that is why we all love them so much, the little quirks, challenges and strange things they do give us the most enjoyment and create bonds between pet and owner.

Jack