The Spotted Devil Posted July 3, 2014 Share Posted July 3, 2014 (edited) Agree Leah - it can seem overwhelming. However as SG says, if you do less it's ok it will just take longer. If your bucket of gold coins is empty vs your dog's distraction bucket you need to make a LOT of gold coin deposits. My dogs' recalls are great except for Em in the face of free running near a forest. So I control the latter for the moment. She also needs more impulse control. Zig's issues are more about not coping with failure so I put an emphasis on the games that highlight our weaknesses. Edited July 3, 2014 by The Spotted Devil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silentchild Posted July 3, 2014 Share Posted July 3, 2014 (edited) You are right Leah, it was very overwhelming seeing there is so much to do. Breeze has great whip-lash recall except when there is a duck to be chased LOL. I have been doing a lot of recall in drive work I learnt from K9Pro when they were in Melbourne so I'm hoping I can get away with less time spent on recalls and more time on the other games. Will still definitely work through the recall and distraction list to keep proofing her recall but I think I would like to place more emphasis on games that can help strengthen our bond - and from reading what all of you are saying the Crate Games is best for that so I will be working on that. We also already do some form of IYC in our everyday life anyway so I breathed a sigh of relief... still I have been working on it with her every day, especially sitting at the door in the mornings to go out. We tug every night as a routine too so another sigh of relief. Will just have to work on tugging through distractions. It's going to be tricky getting through everything in time for me as I am so strapped for time as it is, still I'll try my best. I've just looked through the site very carefully again and I think I understand what I need to do now, and I will get started on the games tonight. TSD I'm not sure if I want to do the Collar Grab game as she is an extremely soft dog and since she already has Fenzi's similiar "squishing" game down pat I'm not sure if I want to introduce something else which is more or less a similiar concept/result anyway but with the added stress of pulling her by the neck. Edited July 3, 2014 by silentchild Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
raineth Posted July 3, 2014 Share Posted July 3, 2014 raineth, From memory, once you have mastered the basics of Crate Games you can transfer that to something else such as a dog bed, chair or table. So I would do Crate Games at home in whatever location you can to the point where you have good understanding - will sit in crate when you touch door, wait for release, YOYI, will go into crate from a distance etc. and then start with dog bed or something else, starting in same location. The only difficulty with using something else is that you don't have a door to close for inappropriate responses. SG often has her dogs on an agility table while waiting their turn. Another thing you could consider is getting an xpen? They generally are lighter and fold up smaller than a crate, and have a door. Thankyou so much for this information Kavik :) I must admit, I have decided to not expect a sit. I know this is not ideal, but she is doing the rest of the crate games levels 1-3 beautifully, and I just feel like I can't expect her to sit when she has to maintain a crouched position doing so. I don't have any competitive aspirations so I'm hoping this will be adequate for a pet dog. Yes I will look into an x-pen, great idea. If I get the xpen it will solve my sit problem and possibly the transport problem Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leah82 Posted July 3, 2014 Author Share Posted July 3, 2014 You are right Leah, it was very overwhelming seeing there is so much to do. Breeze has great whip-lash recall except when there is a duck to be chased LOL. I have been doing a lot of recall in drive work I learnt from K9Pro when they were in Melbourne so I'm hoping I can get away with less time spent on recalls and more time on the other games. Will still definitely work through the recall and distraction list to keep proofing her recall but I think I would like to place more emphasis on games that can help strengthen our bond - and from reading what all of you are saying the Crate Games is best for that so I will be working on that. We also already do some form of IYC in our everyday life anyway so I breathed a sigh of relief... still I have been working on it with her every day, especially sitting at the door in the mornings to go out. We tug every night as a routine too so another sigh of relief. Will just have to work on tugging through distractions. It's going to be tricky getting through everything in time for me as I am so strapped for time as it is, still I'll try my best. I've just looked through the site very carefully again and I think I understand what I need to do now, and I will get started on the games tonight. TSD I'm not sure if I want to do the Collar Grab game as she is an extremely soft dog and since she already has Fenzi's similiar "squishing" game down pat I'm not sure if I want to introduce something else which is more or less a similiar concept/result anyway but with the added stress of pulling her by the neck. I'm really working on the collar grab game with Sarah, she will purposely back away if I go for the collar so it can be really difficult if I need to control her in an unsecured area. She is also incredibly soft but I find I don't need to pull on her neck, as long as I can get a good hold of the collar she will follow my lead pretty easily. She needs to learn that it's a good thing and trust that I would never do anything to harm her. From what I understand many of these core games lend themselves to games further on so it's probably a good idea to get the basics down at this early stage Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sue & Waldo Posted July 3, 2014 Share Posted July 3, 2014 Hw are you following each other. I am pleased that a list of abbreviations was put up! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Spotted Devil Posted July 3, 2014 Share Posted July 3, 2014 (edited) I use CGG on miserably fearful dogs that have come out of puppy farms - starts with resting a finger on their collar and building from there. The pulling on the neck does not happen until the dog just loves the collar touch - and I don't pull on mine at all as they are too busy rushing in to me. It is worth working on as you can hold the collar as a restraint and fun gateway to more games including crate games. Just take it slowly and you will both be fine. Em doesn't come across as a soft dog but she is - only making handling and collar grabs etc a mountain of fun has turned her into such a confident little dog. Timing in the CGG is essential to make the connection and the vast majority of people get it wrong. Touch collar, treat, release collar. Keep your hand on the collar until the dog has had the treat. Again I always start this on leash and the handler sitting on a chair or the ground. Very controlled. No surprises until they relax about it. Edited July 3, 2014 by The Spotted Devil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silentchild Posted July 3, 2014 Share Posted July 3, 2014 (edited) I just got home and worked on a little bit of Collar Grab game to see how Breeze would react to it. Started off gentle, on lead like you suggested TSD, thanks for sharing your advice. She's ok with it. Not very keen and I can definitely see she gets a bit uncomfortable, lip licking and all, a bit flat. So just did very little, will consider building on it a bit more very gradually, probably with higher value treats too. At the moment it's killing her drive a bit. Edited July 3, 2014 by silentchild Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Spotted Devil Posted July 3, 2014 Share Posted July 3, 2014 I just got home and worked on a little bit of Collar Grab game to see how Breeze would react to it. Started off gentle, on lead like you suggested TSD, thanks for sharing your advice. She's ok with it. Not very keen and I can definitely see she gets a bit uncomfortable, lip licking and all, a bit flat. So just did very little, will consider building on it a bit more very gradually, probably with higher value treats too. At the moment it's killing her drive a bit. Yes! Get out the A +++ treats! Great one for doing in front of the TV during the ad breaks :D Good on you for giving it a go! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Law Posted July 3, 2014 Share Posted July 3, 2014 I really wanted to sign up but have too many bills right now bah humbug! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Spotted Devil Posted July 3, 2014 Share Posted July 3, 2014 I really wanted to sign up but have too many bills right now bah humbug! Yup. Been there and completely understand. There will be a right time :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fbaudry Posted July 3, 2014 Share Posted July 3, 2014 I'm having the same issue Silentchild, so going very slowly with high value mushy food. Not sure about Will's background (picked up as a stray and repeatedly failed assessment a at the AWL for being too fearful), but I suspect it wasn't a happy one. He's very weary of hands and feet We did a crate game session with Penny tonight which I think went well. She maintained solid sits at the back of the crate pretty much the whole time. In hindsight I wish she'd made mistakes early on, because towards the end she just lied down nod didn't sit up when the hand touched the door... Back to square one tomorrow! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Max#1 Posted July 3, 2014 Share Posted July 3, 2014 Coming out of lurkerdom after googling this course and finding this thread, hope that's ok. I couldn't resist signing up tonight when I saw the course was re-opened...! I've got a 'bolter', so really excited at the prospect of improvement! Haven't done crate games, but have done a bit of IYC - but never really took it any further than the trick. Failed at my first attempt at 'Call Once'. I called. Dog just looked at me ... "Wha..?" Lol. Next time I might try BEFORE dinner, starting closer, better treats, one dog at a time. Must remember to start at the beginning! And I appreciate the CGG tips. One dog thought it was great. The other who is a bit softer didn't seem to mind but has since been kind of avoiding me. I've got so much to learn! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leah82 Posted July 3, 2014 Author Share Posted July 3, 2014 Welcome Max and we've all got a lot to learn. Lesson number 1 I've found is high value treats make all the difference, especially with the softer dogs. I think I got somewhere with Sarah tonight, we were playing a modification of the call once game. I would run her up onto the ottoman like a pause table and get her to stay, then I'd call her off, take her collar and give her a treat, then run back to the ottoman and repeat. Because we were making the game faster paced and more exciting she didn't really care about the collar grab :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Spotted Devil Posted July 3, 2014 Share Posted July 3, 2014 Welcome Max! Leah you could also try another version which is great for confidence - move the game along FAST rather than stopping to pat and praise...throw a boring treat along the ground so Sarah is moving away from you, then you can call her and get the head turn which is what you are looking for. With the pause table you won't quite get the same effect. The movement really seems to help both the anxious and distractable dogs :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J... Posted July 3, 2014 Share Posted July 3, 2014 (edited) One thing to remember with SG's work is to make sure it is fun. There is a huge amount of information there, a heap to learn and get your head around. It's really easy to get bogged down in trying to keep up, be perfect with your mechanics, do things to a standard, have the ideal equipment etc etc and I can see some of you guys already falling into that trap. Please don't :) Just go out and give it a go, and if you achieved something small and had some fun with your dog, then that's a good thing. I've seen so many people obsess over the little details that they forget the fun, and then no-one enjoys it. SG is one hell of a trainer but she's also really obsessive - doing 50% of something is better than 100% of nothing ;) For what it's worth, I've done more of SG's online courses than my bank balance wants to admit All my dogs have done crate games, and all 3 do crate games to a level where they will all sit in camp chairs/in open crates or in the ute with the door open while I train the others, even at agility training, and will run to the chair or crate when asked to. NONE of them sit when I put my hand on the side of the crate, cos I personally didn't see the value of training it to that level. It can get a bit confusing, especially when I'm reading about doing 20 recalls per session, 3 times a day, 7 days a week. That's pretty impossible when it's the middle of winter and you work full time. A recall is a recall, whether it's down the local park, or calling your dog from the lounge room into the kitchen. They all count. Do heaps in the house and backyard during the work week and then work on the bigger ones on weekends when you have more time and daylight. :D I do know how you feel though, I work long hours too and every course I've done online has what feels like a majority of people in it who don't seem to do anything but live and breathe the course, in fact I've often wondered if some of them even sleep!! :laugh: Edited July 3, 2014 by Jess. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sue & Waldo Posted July 3, 2014 Share Posted July 3, 2014 Thanks Jess. It is hard not to get bogged down. A good reminder! I still can't work out how to follow people though! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Spotted Devil Posted July 3, 2014 Share Posted July 3, 2014 Thanks Jess. It is hard not to get bogged down. A good reminder! I still can't work out how to follow people though! Hi Sue - just click on the person's photo or name and you will see their profile. There is a button that will say Follow (with green plus sign) or Undollow (with red minus). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Max#1 Posted July 4, 2014 Share Posted July 4, 2014 Out of curiosity, what's the benefit of following someone? I'm DaisyM on there, but I'm not sure I'm doing much worth following as yet! I do want to ask a question about IYC. My timid girl is quite good at it. A little too good :/. When she comes to my hand and I close it she backs away and is not interested at all. I really hurt her feelings with that! I wonder whether to treat and go on or not as she'll never approach my hand again in that session. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fbaudry Posted July 4, 2014 Share Posted July 4, 2014 Hey Max#1, 2 cents worth from someone who faces the same issue (closing my fist led Will to go away, tail between his legs, and into his bed). I found doing it when really relaxed, in a room where the dog is comfortable and with no other distraction really helped. But the big game changer is to find a food that your pup is really motivated by. So I've been boiling chicken liver and that seems to work for Will I think the main thing is to keep it very light hearted and not put any "pressure" on your dog. Easier said than done, I know, when one has a hypersensitive dog! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leah82 Posted July 4, 2014 Author Share Posted July 4, 2014 yep, high value treats make a big difference. Treat them once they step back providing you have your hand open and they'll slowly get the hang of it. I noticed a big difference in Sarah when she figured it out, she went from being really unsure about what was going on so she would just lie down and look away to looking intensely at the treat waiting for me to give it to her. Also don't forget if they are not going for the treat in your hand move the treats to the floor, this will perk up most dogs interest Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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