sophmadz Posted July 5, 2015 Share Posted July 5, 2015 Hi, I am buying a purebred puppy from a breeder, and the breeder would like to keep the registration under his name and when possible use my puppy for breeding. I don't have an issue about coming to an agreement about lending out the services of my dog when required but am worried about the registration ownership details. Is this common practice? what legal issues may arise? Thanks for your input Soph. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bjelkier Posted July 5, 2015 Share Posted July 5, 2015 This kind of thing can lead to a lot of issues, especially if you want to breed and show the dog as well. I would be wanting to see a really good contract between both parties with a clear understanding of what is expected from which person like health testing, stud fee's etc, if the dog is to be shown who will take it, pay for the entries, how long will the dog be gone etc. It can work out well provided everyone knows where they stand. I have a bitch with me who is still technically owned by her breeder however we have an arrangement between us that works for both parties and we'e had no issues at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sophmadz Posted July 5, 2015 Author Share Posted July 5, 2015 This kind of thing can lead to a lot of issues, especially if you want to breed and show the dog as well. I would be wanting to see a really good contract between both parties with a clear understanding of what is expected from which person like health testing, stud fee's etc, if the dog is to be shown who will take it, pay for the entries, how long will the dog be gone etc. It can work out well provided everyone knows where they stand. I have a bitch with me who is still technically owned by her breeder however we have an arrangement between us that works for both parties and we'e had no issues at all. Hi, Thanks for your input, it is a man so the plan would be that the bitch would come to us. My real concern would be a future claim of ownership and then the possibility of losing the dog. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
persephone Posted July 5, 2015 Share Posted July 5, 2015 did you mean you are getting a male - and would have bitches coming to your place for matings? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sophmadz Posted July 5, 2015 Author Share Posted July 5, 2015 did you mean you are getting a male - and would have bitches coming to your place for matings? Hi, Yes I will be getting a male. So I have been told that the bitch would come to us for an hour then will go. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
persephone Posted July 5, 2015 Share Posted July 5, 2015 THIS might help you -CLICK here. :) it is not anything I would do - Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
persephone Posted July 5, 2015 Share Posted July 5, 2015 presumably this breeder has a kennel prefix & is a registered breeder ? Like " Chad's canny Canines" - or whatever - and they breed/show/sell puppies? before you even think about any co owning /breeder's terms , research your chosen breed, find out health problems which are/may be genetic ..those which have tests that are done on PARENTS- and request written test results for things which could well be serious .;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bjelkier Posted July 5, 2015 Share Posted July 5, 2015 did you mean you are getting a male - and would have bitches coming to your place for matings? Hi, Yes I will be getting a male. So I have been told that the bitch would come to us for an hour then will go. Hmmm have to say as a breeder I wouldn't be comfortable sending my girl to be mated with someone who didn't know what they were doing. So much can go wrong with matings and it's best to have an experienced person doing it. If I were you I'd be insisting on the breeder taking the male to do matings at their place. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Salukifan Posted July 5, 2015 Share Posted July 5, 2015 (edited) If I were you I'd be buying a pup from a breeder who will sell to you outright and enjoy sole ownership of your pet. I'd not be paying for a dog that I wouldn't own and that the breeder expected to use for stud duties. Edited July 5, 2015 by Haredown Whippets Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
persephone Posted July 5, 2015 Share Posted July 5, 2015 I may be wrong , but would much prefer to have matings done elsewhere , so Dog doesn't associate your yard with his 'duties ' .. revel in urine etc left by the bitch, pee even more , and go looking for the bitch once she's left. Having in season bitches at your place will perhaps advertise to neighbours' dogs too - scent does travel - . (yes, I have worked with stud dogs/breeding bitches) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dame Aussie Posted July 5, 2015 Share Posted July 5, 2015 If I were you I'd be buying a pup from a breeder who will sell to you outright and enjoy sole ownership of your pet. I'd not be paying for a dog that I wouldn't own and that the breeder expected to use for stud duties. I agree here Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
persephone Posted July 5, 2015 Share Posted July 5, 2015 ..and that "hour" estimate? it may work ..but perhaps on a different day ;) It doesn't all go as planned - esp. with an untried dog/maiden bitch - if the bitch is unsettled being somewhere new - or even if the two do not like each other! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scottsmum Posted July 5, 2015 Share Posted July 5, 2015 ..and that "hour" estimate? it may work ..but perhaps on a different day ;) It doesn't all go as planned - esp. with an untried dog/maiden bitch - if the bitch is unsettled being somewhere new - or even if the two do not like each other! Slightly off topic - but not really: Do bitches need multiple matings/serves to be really sure the deed is done? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mrs Rusty Bucket Posted July 5, 2015 Share Posted July 5, 2015 Do bitches need multiple matings/serves to be really sure the deed is done? Some bitches must think so and left to their own devices will have a litter with multiple fathers ie each puppy can have a different father to its siblings. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Spotted Devil Posted July 5, 2015 Share Posted July 5, 2015 ..and that "hour" estimate? it may work ..but perhaps on a different day ;) It doesn't all go as planned - esp. with an untried dog/maiden bitch - if the bitch is unsettled being somewhere new - or even if the two do not like each other! Slightly off topic - but not really: Do bitches need multiple matings/serves to be really sure the deed is done? Probably depends on whether you prog test or not - helps a lot with timing but I still mated Em twice to be sure. The sire's owner is in a similar situation to the proposed OP's and it worked out fine BUT there is a really good prior relationship with the dog's technical owner. I definitely prefer to take the bitch to the dog, especially having a male here myself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Christina Posted July 5, 2015 Share Posted July 5, 2015 If you are not an experienced breeder its better not to do this & buy a puppy you will own completely. Matings can go wrong its not as simple as the bitch comes to you, dog does his job & that's it. The dogs can injure themselves, the bitch can get nasty, the timing & maybe a few matings can be inconvenient for you, your dog may start to hump & pee all over the place too. Terms of how many matings, how often your dog is used ect would have to be agreed in a written contract & also financial adjustments would need to be made in all fairness. Not a good idea really unless you know the breeder very well & understand entirely what you are in for. Best of luck with it but do think carefully. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sandra777 Posted July 5, 2015 Share Posted July 5, 2015 (edited) So the breeder is going to SELL you a dog then continue to own it?? I hope you are getting the pup at a reduced price. Who is going to use this dog - the breeder? Other people? If the breeder wants to breed a single litter from the dog to continue a bloodline I wouldn't have a problem with the arrangement - provided you get a contract stating: Who pays for the genetic testing/x-rays for hips/elbows/eye screening/any other health testing required. I would expect the breeder to do this as none of this really matters to a pet owner. IF you are paying full price for the pup - how much will the stud fee be? At what age will this mating take place (ie age of the dog) - this tells you how long you have to keep the dog entire if you want to neuter him. You will need to ensure that the bitch has live pups before neutering the dog so make sure this is in the contract too - how long afterwards do you have to wait. If your council charges more for an entire dog and you want to neuter the dog, who pays the extra cost to register an entire dog for the period of time the breeder wants him to stay entire. The microchip will be transferred to your name immediately, that the breeder has no rights at all to the dog except as specifically stated in your contract and that the council registration will be in your name. If other people are going to use the dog I would walk away as it can get very complicated. ETA: It's probably simplest if the breeder takes frozen semen from the dog as soon as it can be done, then the dog is signed over. Mind you - if you aren't going to show/trial/race/whatever the dog I would be very suspect about why more than one or perhaps two people would want to/be allowed to use a dog which has never been proven in any field. Edited July 6, 2015 by Sandra777 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pepe001 Posted July 5, 2015 Share Posted July 5, 2015 Apart from tat mentioned above I would also be worried about out of pocket expenses like being injured during breeding. The breeder of my dog also asked if the dog turned out well would I consider letting the breeder use him as a stud. BUT he doesn't own my dog in any way and all papers etc are in my name and he would pay me service fee and the dog would go to his place to breed to his bitches only. I would be responsible for genetic testing and can say no if I wish. So very different from your situation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
persephone Posted July 6, 2015 Share Posted July 6, 2015 Sandra 777 has said it all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pjrt Posted July 6, 2015 Share Posted July 6, 2015 If you own the male outright, you have the say on what happens in regards to breeding him, but you incur all the costs. You would need to make sure you have main registration papers in your name, be a member of your states ANKC canine Assoc, make sure your dogs health testing is done, at your cost, approve and arrange bitches for breeding etc etc. Do you have the knowledge to know and make the best choices in these regards. If you are a novice dog person it may benefit you to have the breeders guidance through all of this. You also need to know whether your breeder has the knowledge and the best intentions for the dogs in making these decisions. Would you be happy if you ended up in a situation where you have agreed to let the breeder stud your dog, and find a bitch of poor quality arrive at your place. Or what if your boy doesnt quite turn out to the standard you would approve of for breeding etc. What happens if your boys health tests dont return the results you hope for. So much to think through. If your breeder is terrific and you can be confident in them and the terms and conditions set out and signed by you both are to your satisfaction, then great. If you just want a pet dog then I would just make an outright purchase. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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