The Spotted Devil

Is that a bit of a gundog thing? Most gundogs I've met seem to be capable of phenomenal focus. Possibly - but I think it's something you select for in a good hunting dog. Em's breeding is in that category. If you hunt over a dog all day, for example, you want them to work tirelessly - they cover a LOT of miles - and pay no heed to the other dogs or people around them. When they get an opportunity to rest you want them to take it. Em goes from being curled up asleep in the car to flat out crazy in seconds. Straight back in the car, eyes closed with guns going off and other dogs having their turn. Same with the working Kelpies - when they work they are single minded. When they're resting you barely notice them.

Not to mention that a relaxed dog is much less likely to chomp.....even dogs that have "soft" mouths will chomp if under too much pressure.

My personal experience with retrieving, at least, is that I want Em walking from the car or the hide to the starting pegs as relaxed as possible - I might even do a few hand touches and spins to relax and focus her but she's happy to wait quietly or sniff around like crazy if she finds some rabbit scent. She is a "switch on-switch off" type of dog so the minute her leash comes off and I take the gun, she just goes into "the zone" - takes no notice of anything or anyone else - it's just me, her and a couple of retrieves.

To be honest we don't know for sure. They are often described as calming signals but I'm not entirely comfortable with that description. Sometimes it seems to be a release of anxiety in - you will see a dog yawn and shake and then appear to relax. Context is really important with these behaviours too. What I see in shelters and training classes and dog competitions may well be different to dogs in other scenarios.

Oh that's darling Nice work WP :)

Love it! :laugh: Had my suitcase used in a training scenario for a young Lab at an airport once. Of all people to ask and they got me!!!! It was awesome - the dog was learning "intelligent disobedience" and you could just about see him swearing at his handler :D

I struggle to describe what I see with gundogs sometimes....the complexity of the behaviour is way beyond any simple term like "drive". In training I try to keep it simple. Reward what I like. Ignore what I don't. And let the dog do the rest. So often I feel like a privileged observer when Em's on fire in the field. So much she has learnt without me teaching her. A completely different sensation to running agility or doing anything else.

Hmmmm....based on his writings of "The Retrieve" I'm not wholly impressed. Not that I practice forced retrieves but, when it is used in gundogs, it is generally for dogs with stinking high prey drive in the first place. In most cases it's nothing to do with making a dog retrieve that doesn't want to. The whole point of a gundog is that it doesn't want to rip and shred what it catches....that's a good thing right? I know my Springer gets a huge amount of satisfaction from simply hunting and quartering and using her nose and they are certainly used for that purpose in scent detection. And to retrieve game is just MAGIC for her! Just to carry it for a while is a huge reward. She actually doesn't enjoy tugging that much to be honest although it's something I do work on just for the hell of it.

Started on some angle water entries on Tuesday....it went pretty well although I must remember to take a special something out of the freezer to use as a reward next time :D Didn't do too much as it was bloody cold when the wind whipped up! Yesterday was a short but effective session with my helper throwing dummies for us. Started with a couple of doubles which went perfectly fine. Then moved on to a 2 bird - as is her new habit Em sat when I fired at the dummy with my stick and then I had to call her in. Happy with that as she had a very good look at it. Left her sitting in a "hide", walked out and placed a cold blind, returned, rewarded, left her in the hide, walked the opposite direction, fired at the blind with my stick, called her up, had Mr TSD throw a mark, send for mark, send for blind. Took a very nice line through cover and over a log and needed 2 left overs to get her to the dummy. She wanted to hunt in cover so it took some convincing that it was much easier than that! On her return she purposely attacked the cover when she could have easily cheated so I was really happy.

Yes. This. Definitely.

My pleasure. Thanks for caring :)

Stan - can you please contact the good folk at The Dalmatian Club of NSW rescue service - linky

Only tugging at home is not unusual at all...I think it takes a lot of focus to "tug in public" so not the easiest for some dogs. Zig definitely went through this but I gradually built it up because I'm extremely stubborn :laugh: Em is now in the same place and I will take her down the same path albeit a little more slowly as retrieving is her main game.

What pie said :D But also look here....linky

Oh yeh - definitely a boy dog thing *rolls eyes* After an agility run, he gets any combination of heeling/spins/nose touches/tug/food/ and it always finishes with a good pi$$ing session. One of my favourite moments was finishing a run in Canberra (was staying with his breeders) and as I ran out of the ring with Zig on leash I realised I was needed in the next ring with Em. Handed Zig straight to his breeder who had a VERY SEXY Dalmatian girl on leash and Zig thought it was bloody Christmas.....needless to say we couldn't stay with them on the way back from the Agility Nationals because he brought their entire girls into season within a few days

:laugh: Wobbly, at least you are aware! Glad you enjoyed that Pers - it's funny 'cause it's TRUE!!!

JulesP - I can see where you're coming from (and I know your dogs!) but it's very hard to train distance, speed, obstacle independence, weaves and contacts for competition agility with praise alone. The only drive my Dally had for a good 18 months was micturition drive :D Finally I had him working for food as well as the opportunity to pee and his improvement was phenomenal. Along the way he developed a liking for praise. But he wouldn't tug. Hated it. Detested it. I didn't think it would make much difference but I persisted in teaching him just for the challenge of it. After a lot of work I had him working for tug, food and the opportunity to pee and his performance went through the roof. Now I can play full on feral tug with him whilst having a handful of food and he loves it. He will take food in the presence of tug. He loves a "good boy!" and a scratch under the chin. He will voluntarily give up pissing on trees and harass me until I train him. He will leave Em in full season and happily come training...a little bit more airhead than usual but keen as mustard. It's so cool to have multiple reward options depending on the situation. Same with Em - she has to fetch dummies and take food in the presence of game - something that rules her world like nothing else. She is not fussed on tug but I insist upon a short session before she gets to play agility with food as tug is not rewarding enough....yet :) Wobbly - can I suggest that you keep your reward rate high but push your criteria higher still!

I hear ya sister

Nice one P Runs in the family I see :D

Fantastic! Congratulations to you all - RubyStar, Livertreats and Ptolomy I have been a bit slack in here but have been keeping the training up.....mixing up single marks, cold blinds, handling drills and agility! Bumper Boy transmitter battery is stuffed and I have someone working on a solution for me as it is specifically made for the BB and difficult to replace. I really want to do some water work with Em but it is just freezing!!! We have been training in as many different environments as I can think of with trees, cover etc to keep her thinking. Confidence in cold blinds has gone through the roof - I set up 3 yesterday....first was over bare ground and up on a small mound and she did that without a command. Second was through quite a bit of thick cover and on bare ground and the little bugger did that in one go as well - she took a much, much better line through the heavy cover than she normally does and consequently came out in a really good spot. Third blind was on the edge of cover - she nearly ran straight past but one right back got her in there. No popping, no hesitation - just lots of flapping ears :laugh: There were LOTS of water birds and rabbits around too so I'm really pleased with her enthusiasm to pick up boring old dummies. The other thing I've noticed when I'm handling her in heavily treed areas is that, when she stops to the whistle, she immediately turns around but if she's behind a tree for example shuffles before sitting so that she can see me. Quite clever I reckon!

Let us know how you get on! And good luck :)

FANTASTIC She is a little star So dare I ask.......... what is the next challenge? Retrieving :D Yay! Well done kath and Coco

My head hurts

And it's so heartening to see the next generation of dog trainers! It helps protect against the number of idiots out there

More a context than concept for us. Had a delightful 5 year old child tagging along with her mum for Puppy Games class last night. I had her helping me with some puppies (impulse control and jumping up) and she just handled it perfectly and with better timing than half the class! She loves my Em and always comes over for a snuggle - Em doesn't have much experience with kids but was really good with her. I had Em working for the child, doing multiple hand touches and spins - I'm not sure who was having more fun. Kid was awesome and it was just so lovely to see!!!