cavNrott

My guess is that behaviour is not being discussed in this thread because it's about whether or not the pup can hold on all night and not about behaviour. My question to the OP is, has this pup been inside and house trained during the day? Since he's been outside at night since he was a baby puppy I doubt he will hold it all night. You'll probably have to get up and take him out at least once. If he's never been house trained then it's pretty certain he won't hold it. My dogs are all inside dogs and they have access to outside 24/7. They have all slept through the night from about 16 weeks of age. At that age if they need to pee they take themselves out.

:p Who's bitter :D I'm not the one stalking around trying to pick holes in someone elses posts just for spite. Nope, not bitter. Never been happier and all the dogs are well Geez your good though . Not only can you diagnose complicated veterinary problems online you also do backyard psychology :D Since you ask. Yes, I did pay for a specialist to perform arthroscopy for one dog shortly before another dog here required surgery. In total for ortho surgery for one dog alone = $20,000 including xrays, surgeries. specialist consults and medications. BTW your elbow surgery was far less expensive than the one performed on my dog. You got a bargain. It's not that there is money to spare it's sensible use of the credit card. It's a matter of priorities. Mine are the health and well being of my dogs. I'm sure if I, who have retired from active employment, can afford veterinary care for my dogs then surely someone who is in full time employment would be more easily able to afford the things that are important to them.

So you don't believe I have the best interest of the dog in mind? That's interesting, considering I paid many thousands of dollars for TWLO surgery for my dog. I didn't try to rehome her and palm the problem off onto someone else because my dog had vision problems for which I wasn't prepared to pay the cost of corrective surgery. Does that ring a bell to you? . All things considered, I doubt you are in a position to decide whether I have my dogs best interest at heart. I'm responsible for my dogs and seek vet advice. I'm happy to pay the cost of restoring my dogs to health. I don't try to rehome my dogs rather than pay their vet expenses. My suggestion to those who have a dog with problems is to firstly seek veterinary advice. Don't pay attention to unqualified people on the internet who diagnose conditions that can only be diagnosed under examinationby a hands on qualified vet.

I think that was the statement I was referring to. That's where you show that you had doubts. I am referring and also in the above posts, to chiropractors fixing luxating patellas. I am not making claims about any other condition. As quoted by the OP, the condition has not been diagnosed. Being a large breed dog it does seem that it could be a partial ligament tear rather than a luxating patella. However we don't know without a diagnosis. In any case, you stated that the approximate success with chiro treatment for luxating patella is 50%. This confirms my doubts that chiro will fix a luxating patella. The odds are not great. I would go with an approx. 100% success rate which would be the expectation with surgery done by an ortho. I would follow up with myotherapy and swimming in a heated hydro pool. People will take whatever they think is the best course of action. I take your point that a GA and recovery discomfort is part and parcel of surgery though pain relief is usually prescribed post surgery, but chiro manipulation is not necessarily painless either.

Give it a rest will you Blacklabrador Haven't you anything better to do than nit pick my posts. Show me where I said I have doubts about chiropractic care. I mentioned ONE case where chiro treatment failed with my neighbours dog. Whether or not you want to hear it, the condition was not helped by chiropractic care. It was not my dog with the patella problem. You have no need to be sorry that I have personal doubts about chiropractic care. Don't waste your sympathy because your assumption is incorrect. It's often the case when people assume things that they are completely wrong. Perhaps next time you decide to post my opinion on here you might like to check that you get it right. As it happens I have taken my dog to a chiro who is also vet a number of times and will do so again if the need arises. If I thought that a chiropractics wouldn't help the dog I would hardly have taken that course of action.

No but they work for animals. Hope you never have an emergency with your dogs where you need vet attention. Take a chill pill. This is a discussion forum. You're the one who's pissing and moaning. Why bother to post if you have nothing intelligent to say?

*sigh* NO, that's not what I recommended. Do you recommend people take advice given by unqualified people on the internet who are neither vets nor ortho specialists and who can't see the dog even if they were qualified to diagnose? Do you have a problem with the suggestion that an ortho condition needs to be diagnosed by a vet? The decision (in the case mentioned) to proceed with surgery was made by an orthopaedic specialist, not due to my recommendation What I said was that these people made several visits to a chiro with no positive result. That cost them a heap of money for nothing whilst the dog continued to suffer the problem. BTW luxating patella surgery costs around $500-700 dollars, not several thousands of dollars. I'm quite aware that luxating patella problems are often bilateral. I did not suggest that the delay in having the surgery played any part in the other knee going Where did you get that from? Perhaps you might read a post as it's written instead of putting your own slant on it.

Lissa, being a large breed dog I feel it would be more likely to be a torn or partially torn cruciate ligament. Has your vet done the drawer test on your dog? We usually refer to ligament damage as an ACL rupture but the correct term is Cranial Crucial Ligament. (CCL) Along with ligament damage there is often damage to the meniscus. (A google will bring the info up for you). Is the course of injections you the dog is having at the moment Cartrophen? Unfortunately xrays will not show if a ligament is torn, hence the drawer test is necessary for diagnosis and is usually done by your vet and who will usually referred you to an orthopaedic specialist. Xrays will indeed show if it is a luxating patella but that can usually be diagnosed without xray and is usually a problem with small breed dogs. Please let us know how you get on and best of luck with it.

So sorry for your loss. Godspeed Chopper.

I see we are like minded. My first Rottie live to 12 1/2 years. The last Rott was 13 1/2 when she went, she was a rescue. She was in bad shape when she arrived here but the raw food and bones diet saw her health improve quickly. I have another elderly rescue Rott here who is estimated to be 10yo and again she was in bad shape but is now doing well despite horrific hips. My papered Rott who I've had since a pup had cruciate ligament problems and had surgery as a result but as far as general health goes she's always been extremely well. She is 6 1/2yo now and looks like a young dog. I'm all for a natural diet.

Den: the difference now being that our dogs live long and healthy lives, if we're lucky, whereas 50 years ago dogs had a relatively short life span. I think that's due to them being fed a more balanced diet. I don't feed pork bones to my dogs but many people do with no ill effects.

I'm so sorry to hear the bad news. Sympathy to you and Cara's owners. RIP Cara

Unfortunately you seem to have struck a puppy school instructor who has no idea what she's talking about. Your pup is acting out of fear, not being protective. I took one of my pups to puppy school run by a vet nurse whose complete ignorance of dog behaviour was astounding. That puppy class did my pup more harm than good but it took me about 3 sessions to figure it out. I've never taken another pup to puppy class but opted to socialise them myself. Some training clubs run puppy classes where the instuctors are dog trainers and they have knowledge of dog behaviour.

Large cattle weight bearing bones are unlikely to splinter because they are so hard....and big. However I was advised never to have a large bone split down the length of the bone due to the fact that the dog may be able to break small pieces off and they can get stuck in the intestines and they are basically indigestible. With large marrow bones I have them split crossways rather than lengthways.

My neighbour had a Lab x Poodle. Took him to a chiro for luxating patella. Stuffed around for ever with chiro and then the other knee went. Result: Surgery on both knees, 6 weeks apart. OOOPS it was a Cocker x Poodle, not a Lab edited because it seems I can't type a coherent post.

It could be a luxating patella. It's pretty common in small breeds. You need to take him to a vet for diagnosis. efs. Oh dear, my spelling!!!!

Any vet worth a crumpet will have no problem in diagnosing a luxating patella. They can feel a loose knee cap. I seriously doubt chiro manipulation will fix a luxating patella.

Many years ago when I first started feeding BARF I posed this question to Dr Billinghurst. He suggested frames, wings and necks but no weight bearing bones as they are more likely to splinter.

The OP said the dog was limping on the right HIND leg so it most certainly won't be elbow dysplasia. Xrays do show dysplasia and arthritis but ligaments are not visible on xray.

Ligament tears or partial tears don't show up on xray. The vet need to do a drawer test on the dog. Better still get a referral to an ortho surgeon.

Sorry Shek :D R.I.P Tommy

I would have gone about it from the opposite angle. I would have had the pup inside right from the start in a confined area and taken her outside every hour to train her to toilet outside. You may have to toilet train her from scratch if she's been an outside dog all her life. I agree with you that it's too cold to have a pup sleeping outside this weather but I doubt she's toilet trained herself if no one has shown her what's expected of her. I dont know how old she is but they can hold on longer as they grow. Still, if she hasn't been house trained then she still won't know what to do until you teach her. Good luck.

After two months the dog should be using the leg. The appearance of a hard lump plus the dog isn't using the leg means a trip back to the vet to find out what the problem is. Did you have the extracapsular repair done or the TWLO surgery?

I have a myotherapist come here to massage my two big dogs. I was having them done every week and it made a huge difference. Haven't had them done for a couple of months now but it's time to start again. The myotherapist is able to pinpoint any trouble spots and she concentrates on those spots as well as giving the dogs a full body massage. It's money well spent IMO.

I'm so very sorry Kristie. R.I.P. Barker