Erny

I'll have you know I won a gold medal for my ballet efforts. And before anyone suggests, yes I did find somewhere to pin it .

I decided I don't want to get bunyeons (sp?) from being in my 'pointers'. Hurts my tootsies. Although if I did, I guess I could tiptoe through Steve's triangle of tulips. Hhhhhmmm :rolleyes:

:rolleyes: I would respond with something funny, but I'm busy carting bricks just now ...................

Steve - so when you come down to Victoria, you'll show me how to do up a nice posey of flowers? Will you be wearing your camoflauge trousers and boots, or do you have a different uniform for "flower doing"? ETA: Seeing as you're getting out of dog training, I bags "the picture" :wink: ......

Does he manage to get your attention when he paws you (whether he paws you gently or not)? I agree with PW .... do a stock-take on your leadership. Is this his way of demanding your attention because he thinks he has a right to (and because he thinks he can)? 10 months is a prime age for a dog to put into practice the pre-conceived ideas he's been developing about his perceived higher rank. Or at the very least, to assert them just to see how far he can push his boundaries and whether you "cut it" as his leader. Hope your luck with his health issues turns around.

Unless they have a digestive intolerance reason for it, raw eggs (yolk and white) are fine (and good!).

4Legged - with some dogs in some relationships and in certain circumstances, even "ignoring" can raise a challenge.

The dog has already bitten Carp - although leadership strategies are required, these need to be implemented with care and knowledge. Confrontation that could lead to a challenge that the owner is unable to cope with and remain uninjured needs to be avoided. Not only does it run the very real potential to injury, it also runs the very real potential to worsening the dog's behaviour and ongoing attitude. This is why good behaviourists tend to avoid prescribing over the net. They recognise the reactions that are possible (not suggesting on "liklihood") in what others might perceive to be even the mildest of leadership interactions. It is also why merely reading books and applying the strategies taken from them to just any dog is not necessarily a wise thing to do. Books can be a good back-up to helping people learn to understand dogs at a general level, but beyond that the giving of advice should equate to experience and in matters such as this, to having observational knowledge of the dog AND owner. I'm not confident of the strategies that Carp has been advised to adopt either. But I don't know Carp nor her relationship with her dog, so that prohibits me from drawing conclusion or making specific comment. Carp - if you are not confident that you possess the assertiveness required to manage your dog's behaviour there is no shame in returning her to her breeder. But if you want to persue this further one more time by having your relationship with your dog re-assessed and good advice/opinion given, then return here and perhaps recommendation to a known reputable behaviourist can be made.

PF writes a very good post, Carp. I've also PM'd you. Erny

There are very close similarities in treatment though, Chloebear.

Yes - it is to help you control her. And it's not about "pulling her back when she jumps on people", it's about preventing the behaviour in the first place. The bed won't serve as a crate will as it does not contain her and leaves her free to dance around and perpetuate her excitement.

Ducky - Well done on your re-think and having the courage to inform us of it. I think you mentioned you're not into the retrieving side of things (although that can be more challenging than you think - ask Lablover about that, she knows all about it and with lots of hard work does very well with her dogs) so I would be thinking along the lines of tracking (although I still think retrieving would be far more interesting, but that's just me). Good luck with it all. And I applaud you for looking to engage in a sport that your dog will find mentally stimulating and well-suited to his genetics.

Being excited is habit forming. She's learnt there is a reason to be excited. Now she needs to learn there's a reason to not be excited - and to do that you make all visitations boring. Don't expect this to occur the first time or two you have visitors in. She'll learn through patterns .... ie that every time someone comes, there's nothing in it for her. You're doing the right thing by beginning to have your visitors ignore her - and of course that means don't speak, touch OR make eye contact with her. As you can imagine, over time this would become boring. Start with her outside. When she learns to settle and stay settled for a duration, start bringing her in (only after everyone - including herself, has settled down) and have her on lead. The "ignore" rule should still apply. Although you'll have her on lead, don't make a big fuss about bringing her in. Crate training her can be a bonus with this sort of exercise, because the intermediatary step could be to then bring her inside and allow her in her crate. This gives everyone the opportunity to relax, chat and easily ignore her. Even for the first number of visits (the ones where she's progressed to being okish in the back yard and you are beginning to bring her in after everyone's been there for a while), even when she's not being excited, I'd continue to have everyone ignore her. Train her that she can expect to be ignored (rather than her present expectations, which is one of joyful entertainment). When she's better at that you can carefully (without going over the top) allow people to give her a small, non-eventful pat PROVIDED she's been quiet/calm for a good while and certainly not until the visitors have been there and settled in for a good while. As to how long you do what for is up to you to judge. But one of the mistakes most of us humans make is trying to reach our desired goal far too quickly - so inevitably we rush the dog and have our own expectations set too high for their capability.

I found that post funny as well, and i didnt drink So did I. But I was thinking it was Ducky who'd had a few drinks! :D

I'm pretty sure we all realise that D&D ..... I know I do. But at least we won't be guilty of having a hand in or encouraging it.

It's a Pointer, Pax. A Gun Dog. Not a dog bred for the genetics usually favoured for formal protection training. Great dogs but they do have a mind of their own and even in usual situations (eg. training for hunting which is what they are bred for) unless they're under training by someone who knows what they are doing, the results can go awry.

No. Contrary to what you might prefer to believe, we're concerned for the ultimate welfare of your dog and for people who are exposed to badly and unwisely trained dogs such as where your dog is headed. No-one will be the winner in that scenario. Not even you, Ducky. Nor us. And not the dog. We've all simply expressed opinions, given you as much advice and good reasoning as possible so that you don't create trouble before you know it. It's your call on what you do. And your responsibility. Such is life. Good luck.

Well .... beats me - don't know where my post ended up, so here goes again ... It can be. Do a stock-take on your leadership. Does she get what she wants when she wants it? Does she get everything for free? Have you set boundaries and limitations (from puppyhood) and do you calmly and assertively insist that she observes them? Are things done on her terms, or on yours? That depends on whether she is achieving her goal by barking at you. For example, let's just say she was on the couch and you wanted her off and told her so. She then barked back at you so you ignored her. This scenario is an example where her barking at you achieved what she wanted - for you to leave her do what she wants by being on the couch. I'm not saying this is what you do or has been done, but this example might help you work out whether ignoring her or not is the correct thing to do in each circumstance. Always think .... "is she achieving her goal by barking at me (or doing whatever else)?". And always work so that she perceives that whatever goodies she receives is on your terms, not hers.

Are there two threads running on this exact same question? Could have sworn I posted .......

A thought from outside the square ..... how is the pup's internal/digestive health? Do the stools appear normal? Is he straining when he goes (constipation)? By the sounds of it, there's more to it than just this, but if health/diet is out of order, it could be having an impact on your attempts to housetrain. Just a thought.

How large is your yard area? Given that Citronella is commonly known as an aversive smell to dogs, I can't say I'd be keen on knowing that a small yard/courtyard in which my dog has no choice but to be housed, would comprise of the smell of Citronella that he couldn't get away from. Don't know how much Citronella is involved in the formula referred to earlier, but remember that a dog's nose is far more powerful and sensitive than ours.

Thanks Miranda. I think you're right. But a search of that name shows "no results" so unable to track back at this stage. ETA: Found the thread - but in his case, after 'chatting' to us, Anthony_79 decided to listen to the voices of reason and wisdom, and elected to engage 1:1 tuition. ETA: Miranda - you have a good memory .

Although many of us are familiar with your thread by its given title, if you want to go back and change it all you need to do is return to your original post and click on full edit. You will then be able to change the title and sub-title if you wish. I'm glad also to hear of your progress and the improvements attained. Well done. Erny

If someone unknown writes to say they want to go shooting and where can they buy a gun and bullets, I'd be first asking if they have experience and if they are licenced. Why go tell them where to get the equipment so they can arm themselves without first having the knowledge required to be safe and to respect and regard the safety of others? If it is that you've had all the experience you need to be able to confidently assess and train any dog into the field of 'protection' work, why keep us all in suspenders and make it so we have to make the presumption that you've not done this before? The mere fact that you have continued to lead us on with your earlier answer to our question (Ie "follow the bouncing ball" by reading books) instead of giving answers to assure us that you know what you're doing and have the experience and intelligence to do the training safely, wisely and responsibly, doesn't really help fill us with the confidence needed to help you arm yourself for a DIY 101 protection training exercise. People here are expressing caution (hence the questions) before they help you purchase 'bullets for the gun' we don't even know that you can handle. You don't need to answer to us, I'm sure we all understand that. But likewise, people don't have to answer others either, if they're uncomfortable about what they might be helping people do without the advantage of prior knowledge of that person or that person's experience.

Ducky ..... it wouldn't be a Staffy, would it? I seem to recollect a thread from quite a while back - would need to go searching for it as I can't quite recall whether he too wanted a DIY version of protection training. Maybe I'm wrong .....