persephone Posted January 10, 2010 Share Posted January 10, 2010 I don't believe in the death by licking theory... the dog may have already eaten previous mice, before bringing you that one, IR ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WreckitWhippet Posted January 10, 2010 Share Posted January 10, 2010 http://www.bayeranimal.com.au/default.aspx...0&ItemId=49 Sandy there's the link to the racumin. It says it's a paste but it's not actually a paste as such it's contained in little satchels. Racumin is a multiple feed bait, which means rats and mice must feed several times to ingest a lethal dose. Thus large residues do not build up in the body of the rodent. This minimises the risk of secondary poisoning, where an animal that eats a poisoned rodent is poisoned Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OSoSwift Posted January 11, 2010 Share Posted January 11, 2010 I have seen 2 cats and a Jack Russell affected by secondery poisoning. They were hunters that were lightning on mice though. I have used mouse bait in the ceiling and had a couple of "drunk" mice I have caught and disposed of, but no other dramas. I know have the worlds best mouser, who when in the garage overnight (and had access into the ceiling via a manhole) was killing up to 6 mice a night. We no longer use bait due to her as no mouse ever gets away. Do have to keep the worming up to date in that situation though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ceilidh Posted January 11, 2010 Author Share Posted January 11, 2010 Thanks Jaq, Mick is getting some Racumin today, god I can't wait to get rid of the stinking things. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rysup Posted January 11, 2010 Share Posted January 11, 2010 I think as SBT said, they would have the eat a rat/mouse who had JUST eaten the bait themselves. My dogs have eaten dead rats they have found, after I poisoned them, and I've not lost a dog to it. I wont let them eat them if I can, but then my dogs are not hunters, and it has to be on deaths door before they can catch it. But once they are dead, its like grease lightening to see who can eat them the quickest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AmandaJ Posted January 11, 2010 Share Posted January 11, 2010 Ratsak is an anticoagulant type using warfarin and other blood thinning agents. Vitamin K has been suggested as the antidote for both people and pets ingesting it directly or secondary. What you need is a bait containing phosphides. Phosphides don’t accumulate in the tissue of the poisoned rodent therefore the risk of secondary poisoning is low. The most common is Zinc Phosphide. Other than that the only alternative is specialized traps which prevent pets from accessing the bait and prevents the rodent from exiting the trap. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BowWow Posted May 9, 2011 Share Posted May 9, 2011 (edited) We are absolutely infested with mice this year - worse than I've ever seen it here. I'm nervous of using bait as the secondary poisoning aspect makes me too nervous, I have little faith in Hugh Wirth's take on this, plus I know many people who have lost pets to secondary poisoning. Glue traps are just plain cruel (and illegal in Victoria I believe) and live traps present the same problem of having to dispose of live mice. The best (and most) humane traps are the Rat Zappers - believe me these things are the best. We have two. When the mice first venture into our home at the turn of the weather, we set both traps and after perhaps a dozen kills we are mice-free and peace is restored. Ours have lasted about 5 years and we have only just ordered replacements, so they last and will cost you little in the long run. The Classic (older) model runs on 4 AA batteries and will last one month or approx 10 kills (sometimes more), whichever comes first. The new Ultra model takes 4 DD batteries and apparently offers 60 kills and two years on standby, although I'm awaiting my Ultra to arrive so cannot vouch for this yet. We use dry dog food (and we all have some of that kicking around!) - kills instantly by electrocuting the critters and no need to touch or look at the dead rodent. Light flashes to indicate there's a kill. They are effective and this season we have set it every ten minutes and caught a mass amount of mice (40 the first week alone) although now all is once again going quiet. No threat to other pets, unless you have pet mice or hamsters that run around the house too! Expect to pay around $80 or $90 for both models. They have taken out a few hefty rats here too, so good for mice and rats. Can't recommend them highly enough. I have bullies and a staffy and they are all pigs and love to hunt, so I definately don't want to go the poison option. Edited May 9, 2011 by BowWow Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ish Posted May 9, 2011 Share Posted May 9, 2011 (edited) I've just bought a rat zapper ultra, in 2 nights so far its zapped 6 rats out in my shed Edited May 9, 2011 by ish Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clyde Posted May 9, 2011 Share Posted May 9, 2011 Racumin is supposed to have no secondary kill. That's what we use in our ceiling Yes!! I was told this a few days ago but it is near impossibly to source. Bunnings had just pulled it from their shelves, even the woman there couldn't believe they weren't stocking it anymore as she gave me the big rundown on all the poisons and Racumen came up trumps every time. I came home with one stoopid mouse trap as Im too scared to try anything else. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WreckitWhippet Posted May 9, 2011 Share Posted May 9, 2011 There appears to be a shortage on lots of the baits, traps and glue boards. Mice are everywhere and the places are selling out quicker than they can get stock in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poodlefan Posted May 9, 2011 Share Posted May 9, 2011 My Toy Poodle told me this morning that we've got little furry house guests again. The traps will be going out again tonight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WreckitWhippet Posted May 9, 2011 Share Posted May 9, 2011 My Toy Poodle told me this morning that we've got little furry house guests again. The traps will be going out again tonight. I'll have a chuckle now We bait the ceiling when we have them, never had a smelly dead mouse up there but the mice are nowhere to be seen. We've not had any for at least two years now. I'm sure they'll move back in this year, given the numbers about Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
megan_ Posted May 9, 2011 Share Posted May 9, 2011 Yes the poison is poison. The question is dosage. It takes a lot more poison to kill a dog than a mouse. So unless your dog is very small, the amount of poison needed to kill a mouse should do no noticable damage . . . not that it will do any good . . . and not that eating a dozen poisoned mice would be a good thing. At least that's what our local exterminator -- who also breeds Rottis -- told me. A doler lost her terrier to this very thing. He ate a few mice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edenblue Posted May 10, 2011 Share Posted May 10, 2011 When we're talking about the commercial rat/mice baits that we buy off the shelf, by the time the rodents die, the poisen has already been metabolised by thier system and seconday poisening is not an issue. I believe it is a concern though with some of the drinks and baits the pros will use. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Christina Posted May 10, 2011 Share Posted May 10, 2011 rural pug - do you find that they affect your pets at all? just did a search and deals direct are selling 6 x 'pest contro 3000' for $60 plus postage! I can't find them on there. Search was hopeless. Which section are they in ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erny Posted May 10, 2011 Share Posted May 10, 2011 (edited) ...I heard Hugh Wirth on his radio program stating that there was no danger whatsoever in pets eating poisoned mice - but then I don't suppose many people here would have had much respect for his opinion. Don't you believe it. There are thousands of people out there who hang on his every word. It's not their fault they don't know better. ETA : Just noticed you used the word "here". Sorry - you're right. Edited May 10, 2011 by Erny Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kitteh Posted May 10, 2011 Share Posted May 10, 2011 Here's some Racumin I found online: Racumin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
persephone Posted May 10, 2011 Share Posted May 10, 2011 What you need is a bait containing phosphides. Phosphides don’t accumulate in the tissue of the poisoned rodent therefore the risk of secondary poisoning is low. The most common is Zinc Phosphide. I'm not 100% sure- but I think this rodenticide is a registered poison, and is not for use in residential areas. AFAIK it is for broadacre use only. With other poisons/anticoagulants ... yes, it's true- with many, a mouse only needs to have one feed to get a dose high enough to start the process of bleeding to death. BUT... this takes some days, and the mouse continues to feed ,until it is too ill to walk. So would this mean the mouse could have a bellyful.. and a liver full ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ruffpup Posted May 10, 2011 Share Posted May 10, 2011 I had a related conversation with a co-worker last week. I'd heard a while back a lot of places were having mice plagues. Co-worker said she hadn't been able to get mousetraps anywhere, all sold out. She has a big dog and didn't want to take a chance. She did get traps and caught 5 over the weekend, including 2 in 1 trap. yuk. I used traps in about March and caught heaps in one kitchen cupboard, then stuffed up the gaps around the kitchen pipes with scrunched up scourers (the little curly wurly type - cheap, in Woolies). Touch wood, haven't seen a mouse since, nor has the dog continued sniffing behind furniture etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mrs Rusty Bucket Posted May 10, 2011 Share Posted May 10, 2011 There was a guy interviewed on ABC morning radio garden show about various types of rat control. That was in January 2010 roughly. He said that the active ingredient in Talon was the worst. Trouble can happen when the rat carries off a purple wax blob to a new place and your dog eats the left overs. A dog would have to eat about three rats that died of Talon to have a major problem but it is serious stuff. Ie if you know your dog has eaten it, you have very short time to save your dog's life. Which is why it's so popular as a rat killer. The guy said that racumin was much safer in terms of not killing your dog - so long as it didn't have ongoing access to the bait. It would have to eat an aweful lot of rats that had died of it. The downside is that racumin takes much longer to kill a rat or mouse than talon, so it's not so popular. I prefer to use traps. There are so many pet dogs and cats around here, I would be horrified if anyone used baits without telling the neighbours but I could reasonably expect they are. I am not having much luck explaining to my mother that using it and not telling me where she's put it or where the rat relocated it to - is bad. I might have to stop letting my dog in her yard unsupervised if I care about her living a long happy life. I still have the podcast, but it's not up on the ABC website any more. I could put it where people could download it I suppose. Is there an MP3 equivalent to youtube? It's 23MB to download so I don't think emailing it is going to work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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