What Does This Mean?

[twodoggies2001]

Showdog, thank for setting me straight on this. I honestly didn't know, and when unsure, you go to the supposed experts. What the vet was concerned about was that the entire litter was involved and I didn't want possible ongoing problems.

That is why the breeder informed you.I gather you where given options ???

Your vet told you the breeder was nob & when infact the vet was a nob.

We breed a litter where we ended up with 2 bad bites,never been an issue for us bfore & highly unexpected,we used a new dog who hand t produced in Oz before,the buyers upon the change where informed of what had happened,what the future would be & to think on it.

Both cases they took the pup,1 the mouth came good the other didnt & required 2 teeth removed.They where fully aware & both where top lawyers.

many vets have less expertise than a good breeder

Azian

We groomed a dog last week where the vet told them it would grow to be huge.

The dog is 13 months,bottom of the height standard & will not grow anymore but will fill out.

These people where concerned & ask us first before they where going to call the breeder & say who knows what.

Showdog, the only option we were given was 'take it or leave it' and we decided on the latter.

[Greytmate]

In the Horse world we refer to them (time wasters) as "HoofKickers". There are those people out there who are looking for a horse but will insist on 'trying out' some top dollar horses that they couldn't afford and are out of there budget, Why? Probably the only chance they'll have to ride a top competition horse? Who knows.

In the car industry they are called tyre kickers.

But you don't see signs at car yards saying "No Time Wasters". Instead the staff have been trained to qualify potential buyers, so that their time isn't wasted.

It is exactly the same deal with dogs, except that instead of money being the only qualifier, there may be many other things the seller wishes to qualify before making the sale.

It is human nature to dream and want to look at nice cars, nice houses, nice dogs whatever. If you are good at selling stuff you will be good at dealing with that. If you don't have adequate sales skills, but you try to sell things anyway, you will probably end up in many situations where your time will be wasted.

The sad thing is, blaming the customers for your own lack of skill (by saying No Time Wasters) will put off many people from even making an enquiry. If we are trying to get more people to buy purebred dogs then we should understand that sort of advertising does discourage many people.

[Kissindra]

I don't write my ads with "no time wasters".

There are plenty of time wasters out there. There is a constant stream of emails from people who want photos. You send the photos, and they never contact you again. They didn't want a pup at all, they wanted photos. There was nothing wrong with the pups, they were rippers, but these people didn't want a pup, they wanted a photo. I often wonder if they own websites in far countries, and want photos to put on the websites

I once got 87 email enquiries for a litter. At least 50 of them were time wasters.

A girl emailed every breeder on the east coast, with a huge list of questions, and expected everyone to reply to them. Every breeder. Someone without a life.

Of course, she didn't buy anything.

And I love tyrekickers. If you want to know about the breed, and are upfront, phone me. Don't tell me you want to buy one, tell me you want information. That's my job as a breeder.

I did that, though I didn't expect everyone to reply, was surprised when so few did though now that I think on it - I wonder if most thought it was a dodgy enquirey just based on the amount of people I'd emailed at once? lucky for me there were really great people who got in touch and saw my HUGE email full of info and questions for what it was - a puppy buyer who gave a crap but was just a bit new to how to go about finding the right breeder No shame in that, and certainly not an idication of how much of a life I have I did "buy something" though, and I made damn sure that once I started talking seriously with one breeder (though not at the stage of having been approved) I let the few others know so they were in the loop. I'd done all my breed research and was looking for the right breeder, not the breeder with a pup right that second and I think I made that clear. Perhaps that is tirekicking to some

Personally I emailed over phoning because I hate catching people in the middle of something - an email means a person has time to reply at their lesuire...or not

The breeder I got a pup from had replied to my email with a phone number and suitable times to call and discuss, which was a relief!

[mita]

What Aziah & Showdog said about how bites can change....absolutely true.

The word 'development' should be used a lot more, with puppies & young dogs....just as it's routinely used with babies & young children.

The rapid growth during infancy & early childhood, sees all sort of changes. And 'differences' can emerge. Which is why the word 'development' is the pediatrician's rule of thumb.

It should be the same for all who deal with puppies & young dogs, during their period of rapid growth.....& changes. Change is what the period is all about, for good & ill. That's development.

[Earthdog]

After far too many wasted hours I put the following on our website - it seems to be working with genuine enquiry's and dedicated breed people flowing through. I don't think its rude of me to say this - it allows me to develop quality relationships with the people who do want a dog from us and gives me alot more time to help them get ready for their big day (puppy coming home ). Also - I have never advertised any of our litters - all our puppy owners have come through our website.

Please understand that we do not breed for the 'puppy market' or for financial gain and as such do not have puppies available on a regular basis.

This means that we do unfortunately for you have a waiting list and this means you may have to wait for your choice of puppy. Currently we have 6 girls and 3 boys reserved from our next two litters.

It is your choice as to whether you are prepared to wait for one of our puppies or want to just take the first one that comes along.

If this is the case please don't waste yours or our time by enquiring about a puppy at this time.This page will be updated when we know what puppies we have available.

How rude, maybe you could suggest other decent breeders in the area? Some people dont want to wait a year, nor should they feel gulity about wanting to get a puppy within a certain time period.

I can't see how you would deem this rude? The only thing I see is suggesting puppy buyers look elsewhere or wait. There is nothing in that notice to tell people not to make enquiries about the breed. It is referring to availability of pups.

[Esky the husky]

Why tell them to go to a show to chat to breeders when there is a very high chance breeders won't even speak to them?????

I had a great chat at a show with my dream husky breeder. (I was starstruck )

It was great I got to meet all the dogs she was showing that day, ask her about her breeding plans etc. She was great at multi tasking. I didn't realise at first but she was getting her dog ready for the Best in Show run off.. She still had the time to have a conversation with me..And I got to help by holding the dogs..

Some breeders may seem intimidating, I always think it's worth it to go into any situation armed with knowledge.

For example before I go to a show I look up all the breeders who I might want to speak to and might be there.

I have a look at their dogs, try to memorize some names that kind of stuff. So that when I go up to strike up a conversation I don't feel like an idiot and I have some interesting things I want to ask them about.

[Jed]

I don't write my ads with "no time wasters".

There are plenty of time wasters out there. There is a constant stream of emails from people who want photos. You send the photos, and they never contact you again. They didn't want a pup at all, they wanted photos. There was nothing wrong with the pups, they were rippers, but these people didn't want a pup, they wanted a photo. I often wonder if they own websites in far countries, and want photos to put on the websites :D

I once got 87 email enquiries for a litter. At least 50 of them were time wasters.

A girl emailed every breeder on the east coast, with a huge list of questions, and expected everyone to reply to them. Every breeder. Someone without a life.

Of course, she didn't buy anything.

And I love tyrekickers. If you want to know about the breed, and are upfront, phone me. Don't tell me you want to buy one, tell me you want information. That's my job as a breeder.

I did that, though I didn't expect everyone to reply, was surprised when so few did though :D now that I think on it - I wonder if most thought it was a dodgy enquirey just based on the amount of people I'd emailed at once? lucky for me there were really great people who got in touch and saw my HUGE email full of info and questions for what it was - a puppy buyer who gave a crap but was just a bit new to how to go about finding the right breeder No shame in that, and certainly not an idication of how much of a life I have :D I did "buy something" though, and I made damn sure that once I started talking seriously with one breeder (though not at the stage of having been approved) I let the few others know so they were in the loop. I'd done all my breed research and was looking for the right breeder, not the breeder with a pup right that second and I think I made that clear. Perhaps that is tirekicking to some

Personally I emailed over phoning because I hate catching people in the middle of something - an email means a person has time to reply at their lesuire...or not :D

The breeder I got a pup from had replied to my email with a phone number and suitable times to call and discuss, which was a relief!

It wasn't you. It came with a 2 page questionaire. I thought that was a bit rich for the first enquiry. Breeders talk, everyone got one. A few suspected her of being a PETA rep, a couple thought she might buy a pup off them ... the ones who completed the questionaire, most didn't, and in the end she didn't buy anything. Maybe she was a PETA rep> :D

And I would have emailed you back, saying, thank you for your enquiry, but I don't currently have any pups available, you might try xxxx or xxxx. Good luck in your search.

[Skruffy n Flea]

frankly, i don't know how i read that but srsly, if i was interested in a particular breed and i was that close to buying a pup, or taking on an older dog of the same breed and i was making initial enquiries, i'd be certain that my intentions were honourable ... i don't wanna give the breeder of my potential house friend anything other than positive vibes...

honesty and integrity is paramount ... both sides.

that's how i'd wanna be treated ... ergo...

[Kissindra]

It wasn't you. It came with a 2 page questionaire. I thought that was a bit rich for the first enquiry. Breeders talk, everyone got one. A few suspected her of being a PETA rep, a couple thought she might buy a pup off them ... the ones who completed the questionaire, most didn't, and in the end she didn't buy anything. Maybe she was a PETA rep>

And I would have emailed you back, saying, thank you for your enquiry, but I don't currently have any pups available, you might try xxxx or xxxx. Good luck in your search.

yeah I figured, I just mean't I'd done similar :D

Cripes, two pages of questions? I thought I'd written a heap but nothing compaired to that!

[centitout]

Showdog, thank for setting me straight on this. I honestly didn't know, and when unsure, you go to the supposed experts. What the vet was concerned about was that the entire litter was involved and I didn't want possible ongoing problems.

So how did you find out an entire litter was affected-did the breeder tell you?Just interested ,not flaming you

[twodoggies2001]

Showdog, thank for setting me straight on this. I honestly didn't know, and when unsure, you go to the supposed experts. What the vet was concerned about was that the entire litter was involved and I didn't want possible ongoing problems.

So how did you find out an entire litter was affected-did the breeder tell you?Just interested ,not flaming you

The breeder told me.

[centitout]

I also put in my emails expected waiting times,or direct them to other breeders,as well i also put in suitable times to contact me by phone.Most phone calls generally last around an hour,they are the ones i know who are serious,and i prefer people to ask heaps of questions-its called RESEARCH! We do it as breeders,so why shouldnt a potential puppy owner?

My definition of time waster is someone who says to definately put them on the waiting list,pup gets to 6 weeks and you ask for the deposit,and they tell you they bought a diff breed,or cant afford it or whatever.

I dont think its rude to tell people that there is a waiting list with a lengthy time frame,and if they cant wait-to try a different breeder.

[centitout]

Showdog, thank for setting me straight on this. I honestly didn't know, and when unsure, you go to the supposed experts. What the vet was concerned about was that the entire litter was involved and I didn't want possible ongoing problems.

So how did you find out an entire litter was affected-did the breeder tell you?Just interested ,not flaming you

The breeder told me.

Well then they were being honest,and like others,a bite can change in a few days and either remain bad,or right itself.

[arawnhaus]

Another is other breeders calling up acting like a puppy purchaser to see what others are doing etc......

[twodoggies2001]

Showdog, thank for setting me straight on this. I honestly didn't know, and when unsure, you go to the supposed experts. What the vet was concerned about was that the entire litter was involved and I didn't want possible ongoing problems.

So how did you find out an entire litter was affected-did the breeder tell you?Just interested ,not flaming you

The breeder told me.

Well then they were being honest,and like others,a bite can change in a few days and either remain bad,or right itself.

I wasn't disputing that, and I was grateful for her honesty, and I did what I felt was right for us in these circumstance at the time. As you have probably read previously, I didn't know that bites could change so quickly. I learn something new every day. My concern at the time was that it was the entire litter.

[whippets]

Another is other breeders calling up acting like a puppy purchaser to see what others are doing etc......

ah yeah I've had that

GET A LIFE is all I can say.

[ellz]

Can't remember which post it was and haven't got time to go trawling back through them all, but was thinking about this thread overnight (as you do) and something occurred to me. It rang a couple of bells at the time but I couldn't work out why.........

It was about a car saleyard and how the people there are trained to deal with "tyrekickers" but still treat them all the same.

Dog breeders are NOT car salesmen and I'd be appalled if they were suddenly perceived as having to BE like a car salesman. Breeding animals of any kind is so much unlike retail sales that it is like comparing apples and oranges as any reputable and responsible breeder would and should know!

Only the enquiring party will truly know whether or not they are a tyrekicker or time waster when enquiring about a dog or a litter of puppies and the breeder/seller has to make their mind up from an initial enquiry. If a person is so offended at seeing "No time wasters" in an ad, then they more than likely won't bother to enquire and the seller has lost a potential sale. I'm sure the seller is aware of that and can probably sleep very soundly at night!

[Greytmate]

Can't remember which post it was and haven't got time to go trawling back through them all, but was thinking about this thread overnight (as you do) and something occurred to me. It rang a couple of bells at the time but I couldn't work out why.........

It was about a car saleyard and how the people there are trained to deal with "tyrekickers" but still treat them all the same.

Dog breeders are NOT car salesmen and I'd be appalled if they were suddenly perceived as having to BE like a car salesman. Breeding animals of any kind is so much unlike retail sales that it is like comparing apples and oranges as any reputable and responsible breeder would and should know!

Only the enquiring party will truly know whether or not they are a tyrekicker or time waster when enquiring about a dog or a litter of puppies and the breeder/seller has to make their mind up from an initial enquiry. If a person is so offended at seeing "No time wasters" in an ad, then they more than likely won't bother to enquire and the seller has lost a potential sale. I'm sure the seller is aware of that and can probably sleep very soundly at night!

Selling dogs is different than selling cars, but the same sales techniques (qualifying) can be used to minimise having time wasted by people that are not serious buyers.

Simply stating "No Time Wasters" is not an effective way to sell dogs (which is the whole point of advertising them, yes?). Being able to qualify customers well is an advantage to anyone selling anything of high value. (which I assume the dogs are)

It is quite rude of you to complain about what I have said, when you cannot even be bothered to go back and read what was said and why. It was not to say that dog breeders should be perceived as car salesmen (which would be dumb considering the bad image car salesmen have), it was to encourage sellers to brush up on sales skills to avoid having their precious dog-breeding time wasted by people that are not going to buy a dog.

[ellz]

Public forum.....multiple page thread....topic been in and out of my mind all night. My SINCEREST apologies for not going back through every single post so as to appease your sensibilities!

[Greytmate]

Public forum.....multiple page thread....topic been in and out of my mind all night. My SINCEREST apologies for not going back through every single post so as to appease your sensibilities!

Learn to use the search function. It is very simple to use, and you will avoid getting confused about what has been said. I don't expect you to appease my sensibilities, I just think it is rude to complain about what others say without really reading what they wrote.

Edited May 3, 2010 by Greytmate