Building Tugging

[Kavik]

At the moment I am not using tug as a reward for anything as his response is not consistent enough yet - I can't be sure he will take the tug after an exercise, even at home. I normally reward exercises by either throwing a squeaky toy or food, depending on the exercise (throw toy for movement, food for stationary exercises).

I am hoping to be able to get more consistency in his response for tugging before I use it as a reward in training.

Problem is that if you are just going through the motions for tugging...it is hard for you to find it rewarding or fun & this will impact Kaos.

The reason I sometimes suggest to people to only use a tug as a reward is that it allows the transfer of genuine emotion/arousal/adrenalin you feel to the dog.

If you are just standing there trying to get him to tug, while feeling down & pressured b/c you just want your dog to tug well, you are often not much fun.

If otoh, you get your dog really revved up & ask for something you know that they will do brilliantly, it is impossible for you not to feel on top of the world. When you reward with the tug for a job well done, you are happy & most importantly, you are sincere.

My dogs are happy to tug whenever & wherever, but their tugging when I am over the moon with their performance is at a whole nother level. They are at their best when we are both full of adrenalin. I wish I could just summon that kind of adrenalin in myself at will...but I have never been able to do it.

There is no theory behind this...just something I have always felt.

You are right - it is more a problem with me How do I change that? He is fine if I am confident he will tug - like in the yard when I can get him feralled up first (and for some reason when I go to change the laundry he gets really excited and wants to play ), but if I am worried he might not tug - he won't.

Hopefully by the time I get the next dog I will be able to feel more comfortable with it and can make tugging the best game for both of us.

[sas]

I'm happy to send you a fur tug to see if that will assist at all.

[shoemonster]

Kavik, I was the same, I would get embarrased in public if Ed didnt want to tug, and therefore my own energy was lacking, I started TID with a prey toy, but with the camera, and the pressure I put on myself to get it right, it turned him off tugging and he seemed quite anxious alot of the time, so I did the course with food instead

Now my confidence and Ed's has grown heaps and he will tug reliably in alot of places, he's like a different dog, and I'm definately a different person

[Kavik]

It is good to know I'm not alone shoemonster

Well done for overcoming it and getting confidence and tugging for both of you

Now to figure out how to do it myself!

[shoemonster]

Yeah thats the hard part! Lots of videos sent to Steve did it for me lol!

Actually, maybe that could help you, if you can video yourself doing it (if you arent already) you might pick up on the different things you do when it works and doesnt work

Video yourself with the intention of showing us (to put pressure on yourself) in the back yard and see if the tug still goes well, then you will know if its purely the location or if its your nerves!

[Kavik]

I'm happy to send you a fur tug to see if that will assist at all.

Thank you sas

I suspect it is not the tug but the silly duffer on the other end that is the problem ;)

He does really like tugs that have fur in them though

[Kavik]

Yeah thats the hard part! Lots of videos sent to Steve did it for me lol!

Actually, maybe that could help you, if you can video yourself doing it (if you arent already) you might pick up on the different things you do when it works and doesnt work

Video yourself with the intention of showing us (to put pressure on yourself) in the back yard and see if the tug still goes well, then you will know if its purely the location or if its your nerves!

I think it is primarily my nerves, partly location (and due to my nerves ;) ). I have gotten him tugging at training a couple of times, and a trial once or twice, but not for very long. With VERY interesting tugs

[bedazzledx2]

I was set the challenge (thanks Caffy ) of training my foody dog to tug in the presence of food. Big deal for him as he looooves food and will turn his nose up at any toy when treats are on offer. I took up the challenge and decided to shape it. Fairly clinical with no cheer-leading other than genuine praise when he gave me the behaviour I wanted. Sniff the tug..."yes" treat. (clicker was too awkward in this situation) mouth on the tug...."yes" treat. Then go for duration. Build it to a full on tug. The big test was to tug for breakfast. He wanted to bail but I am a bit bloody minded and insisted on the tug until I gave the release for brekky. That was a real breakthrough This started about 10 days ago and I now have a full on tug with food in view. Loooovvveee shaping!!!!!!!!

Yeah thats the hard part! Lots of videos sent to Steve did it for me lol!

Actually, maybe that could help you, if you can video yourself doing it (if you arent already) you might pick up on the different things you do when it works and doesnt work

Video yourself with the intention of showing us (to put pressure on yourself) in the back yard and see if the tug still goes well, then you will know if its purely the location or if its your nerves!

I think it is primarily my nerves, partly location (and due to my nerves ). I have gotten him tugging at training a couple of times, and a trial once or twice, but not for very long. With VERY interesting tugs

[Mrs Rusty Bucket]

http://www.youtube.com/clickerdogs#p/a/u/1/yzqs54qMgQA

That's Susan Garrett's version.

Essentially you have to be really excited about the toy.

A few other tips - repeats of what others have said here already -

quit before the dog is ready to quit.

don't let the dog play with anything else. Hide all the other toys (I hope your furniture / garden is up for this - or there must be a better way)

have a trigger word, that you use to start the game.

trigger, geddit, - tug tug tug - give

trigger, geddit, tug tug tug - give

and keep it short.

My first tug session was three solid minutes and I was sore for days. And my dog only likes to play tug sometimes but when she likes to play - oh boy does she play.

We're currently working on retrieve cos I can't do the 2x2 weave games - or most of the other garrett stuff unless she will chase and fetch and tug her toy.

we've got chase and chew down.

[Kavik]

http://www.youtube.com/clickerdogs#p/a/u/1/yzqs54qMgQA

That's Susan Garrett's version.

Essentially you have to be really excited about the toy.

I've seen that video before, it is so hillarious and true

It is hard for me to be that uninhibited though

[Kavik]

With dog training, I tend to stress 'down' which makes it hard. At work I often stress 'up' and run around like a maniac and can't sit still but always look for something to do

[Vickie]

With dog training, I tend to stress 'down' which makes it hard. At work I often stress 'up' and run around like a maniac and can't sit still but always look for something to do

Do you have any ideas about what causes your stress with dog training? Seems to me that maybe if you can break down the source of your stress, you can possibly reduce some of it.

From an outsiders perspective, you have a very fun, high drive and intelligent dog in Kaos. You have done a good job with his training, your handling is always improving & you are increasingly successful with him in the ring.

I suspect you are very hard on yourself & want more with him...right now! We all want more than what we have in terms of better performance & increased success, but sometimes it is good to stop & smell the flowers & take joy in how far we have come. You and Kaos have come so far already and both of you are continuing to improve. The (agility) world is your oyster right now.

[Kavik]

With stress and training, I think I just get self conscious. I can be a stressy person in general, there is nothing in particular.

Kaos is an awesome dog and we have lots of fun training and competing

I would like to figure out the tugging thing also for future reference for my next dog. It would always be good to have more choice in rewards I figure since I have three dogs, two with plenty of drive, and none of them tug reliably, I must be the problem Since it probably is a self conscious/stress problem on my part, it would be fantastic to fix even just for me personally (since Kaos has heaps of fun chasing his toy as a reward).

[Aidan3]

I suggest you wear one of those boiler suits that Schutzhund trainers are sometimes fond of. Problem solved.

[corvus]

You could always reward yourself. Chocolate for every time you tug and forgot to feel self-conscious. But then, it should be rewarding in itself. A good tug session is so much fun! I love it when Erik hurls himself at his tug toy and swings around on it. When it gets that fun I'm all like "Who was watching?? Did you see that!"

[Tassie]

With stress and training, I think I just get self conscious. I can be a stressy person in general, there is nothing in particular.

Kaos is an awesome dog and we have lots of fun training and competing

I would like to figure out the tugging thing also for future reference for my next dog. It would always be good to have more choice in rewards I figure since I have three dogs, two with plenty of drive, and none of them tug reliably, I must be the problem Since it probably is a self conscious/stress problem on my part, it would be fantastic to fix even just for me personally (since Kaos has heaps of fun chasing his toy as a reward).

I find what I tend to do is kind of 'act' one of the gurus - in my case, I'll be 'acting' Susan Garrett (or Greg Derrett, or Mary Ray) - so sort of copying what they do - if that makes sense. It sounds a bit corny, but it can help to deal with the self-consciousness thing if you're 'being' someone else.

One of the things I try to teach people in my puppy classes at club is to act and sound like a crazy person without caring what other people think when they're doing stuff with their pup. If it floats your dog's boat, then it's good.

[Kavik]

You could always reward yourself. Chocolate for every time you tug and forgot to feel self-conscious. But then, it should be rewarding in itself. A good tug session is so much fun! I love it when Erik hurls himself at his tug toy and swings around on it. When it gets that fun I'm all like "Who was watching?? Did you see that!"

Thanks for that I LOVE chocolate :D

[Lablover]

I figure since I have three dogs, two with plenty of drive, and none of them tug reliably, I must be the problem

What are they like with food? Is focus, motivation and control achieved?

Some dogs simply are not .......................tuggers.

[Kavik]

I figure since I have three dogs, two with plenty of drive, and none of them tug reliably, I must be the problem

What are they like with food? Is focus, motivation and control achieved?

Some dogs simply are not .......................tuggers.

All the dogs work well for food, and Zoe and Kaos love thrown toys (Zoe likes balls and Kaos likes a squeaky toy).

[corvus]

Maybe you could do a toy on a rope. That way you can incorporate throwing the toy with tug afterwards.