Sheridan Posted August 17, 2012 Share Posted August 17, 2012 I agree the time has come for basic standards and policy to be put in place. At the very least a consumer or even a shelter can pick reputable groups from the rest. Maybe not Nic... think PIAA and their "accredited" pet shops, kennels, etc... Policy looks great on paper only... T. If ethical rescues are directly involved in the drafting process, the results would be very different, I'd imagine. Comparing a group representing rescue and a group representing an unethical means of selling animals is like comparing apples and oranges- one is already working only in the interests of profit whereas the other is working with welfare in mind. Being accredited really shouldn't be as simple as paying a yearly membership fee. Most rescues are pretty transparent on the policies and if you know a group's policies and whether or not they conform to the accepted standard, selecting members really isn't that hard. Edited for typos There is nothing to stop ethical rescues getting together and forming their own overarching organisation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tdierikx Posted August 17, 2012 Share Posted August 17, 2012 If PR are acting as middle man to potential adopters so they can get a dog out cheaper than normal pound sale cost - and that dog is picked up straight from the pound by said adopter without actually being handled by a PR member - who is ultimately liable if that dog then bites or attacks a person or another animal? You can bet your bottom dollar PR would be farming that sort of headache straight back to the pound... What I can't get my head around is the apparent lack of caring as to what happens to the animal once they've "saved" it from the pounds they are entrenched at - they really don't seem to understand the damage being done out there... to the people they are sending dogs to, or the actual dogs themselves who end up being dumped at other pounds or euthanaised due to their obvious issues (or acts). To our credit - the reputable rescue community are helping some of the people and animals out there who have been stung by PR's tactics... although I think PR probably see that help as proof of their own legitimacy... *sigh* In all honesty, I think that if the reputable rescues lend their assistance in the form of telling people who have been left high and dry exactly which authorities to go to about their dealings with PR, then we may see some action to stop them. If they are committing fraud in the form of taking monies with no accountability, then the Charities Dept or Dept of Racing and Gaming should be alerted (often) - if they are passing unsuitable animals on to unsuspecting adopters or foster carers and lying about said animals' temperaments, then NSW Fair Trading or CTTT would be the departments to go to, as we all must ensure that the "goods" we sell are of the quality advertised, etc... As for the intimidation tactics employed by PR and their hangers on - there are laws against some of the things I've heard them accused of... take screenshots of any online attacks, dates and times and names involved if the abuse is by phone, etc... and report the bastards to the Police. The time of circling the wagons is past... it's time to bring out the big guns and take the battle to them really... T. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tdierikx Posted August 17, 2012 Share Posted August 17, 2012 There is nothing to stop ethical rescues getting together and forming their own overarching organisation. ... except the fact that the majority of rescues I know of can't agree on a common set of policies or procedures... *grin* T. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Her Majesty Dogmad Posted August 17, 2012 Share Posted August 17, 2012 Only lowlifes use intimidation and abuse tactics to get what they want, it speaks volumes about the type of people that are involved in running or support this organisation doesn't it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Her Majesty Dogmad Posted August 17, 2012 Share Posted August 17, 2012 (edited) There is nothing to stop ethical rescues getting together and forming their own overarching organisation. ... except the fact that the majority of rescues I know of can't agree on a common set of policies or procedures... *grin* T. Not only that T but I believe some rescues are "in bed" with them ... no amount of money or promises would induce me or the ethical rescuers I know to profit from such an organisation Edited August 17, 2012 by dogmad Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sheridan Posted August 17, 2012 Share Posted August 17, 2012 There is nothing to stop ethical rescues getting together and forming their own overarching organisation. ... except the fact that the majority of rescues I know of can't agree on a common set of policies or procedures... *grin* T. Why do you need to? If you can agree on what makes an ethical rescue (and there seems to be enough people here that do) then what difference does it make if you don't have an exact same set of common policies and procedures? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nic.B Posted August 17, 2012 Share Posted August 17, 2012 There is nothing to stop ethical rescues getting together and forming their own overarching organisation. ... except the fact that the majority of rescues I know of can't agree on a common set of policies or procedures... *grin* T. Why do you need to? If you can agree on what makes an ethical rescue (and there seems to be enough people here that do) then what difference does it make if you don't have an exact same set of common policies and procedures? I agree. Working out policies, procedures and a minimum standard of care is the least of our worries atm! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JRT RESCUE Posted August 17, 2012 Share Posted August 17, 2012 Well I must say I have seen another side of PR tonight. Most of us get a email from HP with the dogs in need and during this week I replied to them stating that I would take one of the Jacks. Tonight I received an email from PR thanking me for doing that and in turn now they can list on their site that I am taking the said dog and if anybody wants to donate etc for this dog my contact details are on there. I then emailed back to them about a boy I had seen on their facebook which I know has been rescued by another group and that group is boarding the dog for 9 days until transport can be arranged and that any help they could do would be appreciated I am sure by that group. Another email to state that a donation of a good amount has now been sent to the group that has rescued the dog. Although we are all ready to pick fault I also think when it is done right then that should be acknowledged too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nic.B Posted August 17, 2012 Share Posted August 17, 2012 I would love to share your enthusiasm Jill though they have no choice. There are a number of authorities hot on their tail and they know it. I wonder if Melanie Norman pays the $2000 in vet bills for the dog which was attacked recently by a dog chipped to her which she refuses to pay? I spoke with this lady today and she has been through hell and back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cryptic Posted August 17, 2012 Share Posted August 17, 2012 I would love to share your enthusiasm Jill though they have no choice. There are a number of authorities hot on their tail and they know it. I wonder if Melanie Norman pays the $2000 in vet bills for the dog which was attacked recently by a dog chipped to her which she refuses to pay? I spoke with this lady today and she has been through hell and back. I wonder if this dog has also been sent to Victoria like they usually do when the heat gets too much . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tdierikx Posted August 17, 2012 Share Posted August 17, 2012 Well I must say I have seen another side of PR tonight. Most of us get a email from HP with the dogs in need and during this week I replied to them stating that I would take one of the Jacks. Tonight I received an email from PR thanking me for doing that and in turn now they can list on their site that I am taking the said dog and if anybody wants to donate etc for this dog my contact details are on there. I then emailed back to them about a boy I had seen on their facebook which I know has been rescued by another group and that group is boarding the dog for 9 days until transport can be arranged and that any help they could do would be appreciated I am sure by that group. Another email to state that a donation of a good amount has now been sent to the group that has rescued the dog. Although we are all ready to pick fault I also think when it is done right then that should be acknowledged too. NOOOO!!!! Allowing them to "assist" you is affirming their legitimacy... I wouldn't accept anything from them until they start getting all the other things right with their practices. I know it's tempting to want to tap into their obviously huge money raising capabilities, but do we really want to climb onto that particular bandwagon? T. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
juice Posted August 17, 2012 Share Posted August 17, 2012 Call me cynical Jill, but i think they have done it to save their own skin. It wil look good on their page, nothing more. They are nothing more than a scam, taking money for dogs they don't have, putting dodgy dogs back out there, they need stopping......soon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sheridan Posted August 17, 2012 Share Posted August 17, 2012 My question is has this happened previously or just since the criticism here? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tdierikx Posted August 17, 2012 Share Posted August 17, 2012 There are a couple of smaller rescues who have affiliated themselves with PR and are happily taking financial assistance from them Sheridan. Until their practices are amended though, no reputable and ethical rescue want to deal with them - and all criticism or questioning of said practices is met with bullying and intimidation... some on a rather frightening scale... The rescue community has worked long and hard to be recognised as a valid and viable source of a new pet for Joe Public... and PR's current tactics and practices can and will destroy that reputation for ALL rescue. Bad news travels a heck of a lot faster than good news... T. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Her Majesty Dogmad Posted August 17, 2012 Share Posted August 17, 2012 (edited) Well I must say I have seen another side of PR tonight. Most of us get a email from HP with the dogs in need and during this week I replied to them stating that I would take one of the Jacks. Tonight I received an email from PR thanking me for doing that and in turn now they can list on their site that I am taking the said dog and if anybody wants to donate etc for this dog my contact details are on there. I then emailed back to them about a boy I had seen on their facebook which I know has been rescued by another group and that group is boarding the dog for 9 days until transport can be arranged and that any help they could do would be appreciated I am sure by that group. Another email to state that a donation of a good amount has now been sent to the group that has rescued the dog. Although we are all ready to pick fault I also think when it is done right then that should be acknowledged too. Leopards don't change their spots Jill, I'm sorry to say. They will be busy reading this - I can smell them from here, they stink. Part of their belief is that it is easy to rescue small dogs, anyone can do that. They are something special because they take the dogs noone else will - the human and dog aggressive large dogs. Perhaps they also take large dogs that are sick? Take a dog like that and you need to be very, very careful, you need to get vet treatment for sick dogs and sometimes it's not a quick fix which wouldn't suit their way of operating as the dog has to be sent or shoved somewhere quickly so they can cope with the next euth list dogs. Instead, for them and their dumb supporters, they all pat themselves on the back because the dog hasn't had the green dream. No, instead it has gone somewhere interstate or is sitting in a kennel. It is an accident waiting to happen in many cases. Edited August 17, 2012 by dogmad Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nic.B Posted August 17, 2012 Share Posted August 17, 2012 My question is has this happened previously or just since the criticism here? Only very recently Sheridan, up until now they have been scathing of other rescues as no one will work with them. As T has said, a small handful of rescues have always recieved financial benefits as they tow the line with pound rounds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nic.B Posted August 17, 2012 Share Posted August 17, 2012 I would love to share your enthusiasm Jill though they have no choice. There are a number of authorities hot on their tail and they know it. I wonder if Melanie Norman pays the $2000 in vet bills for the dog which was attacked recently by a dog chipped to her which she refuses to pay? I spoke with this lady today and she has been through hell and back. I wonder if this dog has also been sent to Victoria like they usually do when the heat gets too much . The attack happened in VIC, the dog was sent from a pound in NSW to VIC. Unbelieveable Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JRT RESCUE Posted August 17, 2012 Share Posted August 17, 2012 I understand what you are saying but if people have donated to this dog then the group that rescued it should be getting the funds, isn't this what we all have been complaining about and now they have done it, they still are not right, sorry but we can't have it both ways. We want them to change their ways, how can they if we are all going to stand our ground and not acknowledge when a thing has been done right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Her Majesty Dogmad Posted August 17, 2012 Share Posted August 17, 2012 (edited) I understand what you are saying but if people have donated to this dog then the group that rescued it should be getting the funds, isn't this what we all have been complaining about and now they have done it, they still are not right, sorry but we can't have it both ways. We want them to change their ways, how can they if we are all going to stand our ground and not acknowledge when a thing has been done right. I don't think that is what we are saying. They are soliciting for money for dogs they aren't rescuing. The proof of that is that they don't forward the money to the rescue group who has taken the dog. That's not their aim. Collecting the money is. If they wanted the money to go to the rescue group who have taken the dog then why don't they ask their followers to send the money direct to the group concerned? I wouldn't want their money, ever. It is tainted. Edited August 17, 2012 by dogmad Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sheridan Posted August 18, 2012 Share Posted August 18, 2012 (edited) Well, my observation of their FB page (and I say hi to them if they're reading this) is that they appear to give the impression of acting as go-betweens, agents if you will, between the pound and a potential adopter. e.g. I read one that gave the impression of dog in pound, person expresses interest in dog, they get dog out, then adopt dog out. Some of the dogs on the HP website seem to be quite cheap. If a dog costs $40 at HP, how much do Pound Rounds then adopt the dog out for? The same amount? Or have I got the wrong impression of what happens? Edited August 18, 2012 by Sheridan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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