Jay57 Posted July 26, 2013 Share Posted July 26, 2013 If you bought a 12 week old puppy from New Zealand for the purpose of stud duties when he is old enough, he arrives a little traumatised from the trip, but starts to settle down nicely, a week later he is examined by your own vet who states that his testes are not there and he has no scrotum, you contact the breeder in question whose only reply is , they were both there when he was exported over, he must be holding them up, would you play the waiting game and see what develops , the pup will be getting another vet's opinion next Wednesday, the vet that examined the puppy has put it in writing and sent his opinion of the puppy to the Breeder , what would be the obligations of the breeder in these circumstances and what would you do as a breeder if it was a pup bred by you Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rebanne Posted July 26, 2013 Share Posted July 26, 2013 (edited) I wouldn't have sent a pup over unless both testicles were down and documented by the vet in the pre flight vet check. If I was 100% sure they were there before he went over I would counsel waiting but only a week or two. I would then pay for an ultrasound to see where they are. If they didn't come down I would refund the purchase price upon proof of desexing. Wouldn't be inclined to refund airfare etc but would depend on what agreement you had. ETA I would also pay for the desexing. But as you can see by my edit, these things require time to think about. Edited July 26, 2013 by Rebanne Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sandra777 Posted July 26, 2013 Share Posted July 26, 2013 I wouldn't send a male pup without two fully descended testicles and I would have a vet certificate before the pup left to that effect. Pup at 12 weeks with no testicles would have no part of my breeding programme. DOES the breeder have a vet certificate of entirety? Like the UK system - they can't get the export clearance without 2 testicles :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay57 Posted July 26, 2013 Author Share Posted July 26, 2013 Thank you Rebanne and Sandra for your replies, there is nothing on his vet check for export that he had 2 testicles, on contact with the New Zealand vet he has no documentation except on his own records that he was checked twice and had both testes, he said he is not obligated to supply on his export health check that he has 2 testes, breeder still claims he is holding them up, not sure what that is , but surely he would not hold them up for a week, he is contacting the breeder in question to see what can be worked out , I have never heard of a male dog not having a scrotum? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
persephone Posted July 26, 2013 Share Posted July 26, 2013 I have never heard of a male dog not having a scrotum? A scrotum is only stretched skin when there are testicles 'down' .. puppies with no descended testicles have no need for a scrotum . AFAIK , Dogs can have testicles that retreat when the dog is cold/stressed etc ... , esp young dogs, where the inguinal ring is still open Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Salukifan Posted July 26, 2013 Share Posted July 26, 2013 If the pup turns out to have retained testicles, then my view is that you are entitled to a refund or a replacement. Of course the cost of the pup are not the only costs involved with importing so who would pay those is less clear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alyosha Posted July 26, 2013 Share Posted July 26, 2013 I would first get pup very warm and very relaxed and check again. At 12 weeks they could be still mobile... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay57 Posted July 26, 2013 Author Share Posted July 26, 2013 If the pup turns out to have retained testicles, then my view is that you are entitled to a refund or a replacement. Of course the cost of the pup are not the only costs involved with importing so who would pay those is less clear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay57 Posted July 26, 2013 Author Share Posted July 26, 2013 The puppy has been here for a week so he is now 13 weeks old, he is kept inside and is nice and warm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay57 Posted July 26, 2013 Author Share Posted July 26, 2013 If the pup turns out to have retained testicles, then my view is that you are entitled to a refund or a replacement. Of course the cost of the pup are not the only costs involved with importing so who would pay those is less clear. I know, there was his air fare, then Qantas take a fee for handling on pick up from the airport and also had to pay customs 10% of the purchase price for the puppy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cowanbree Posted July 26, 2013 Share Posted July 26, 2013 (edited) I have had that happen to me here. Relax, give it a couple of weeks and when he settles in and relaxes I am sure they will be fine. Personally in my breed I don't overly worry about it until 6mths. If I have felt them, they will be fine. I have also had an import go wrong for a different reason and I was very happy to be offered a replacement puppy with me paying the additional travel etc costs. The choice and risk of importing a puppy was my choice and there is a very long journey between a young puppy with show potential and a fully grown show quality dog. I know in my own kennel I end up pet homing over half of the puppies I run on. Edited July 26, 2013 by cowanbree Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
persephone Posted July 26, 2013 Share Posted July 26, 2013 is it a quick maturing breed , or a larger slow maturing one ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mini girl Posted July 26, 2013 Share Posted July 26, 2013 Some years back my son bought a male from interstate for breeding - the vet told him it did not have testicles down at about 12 weeks - he told the breeder and she was surprised but offered to take the pup back and give him another - and go 50 50 on the transport - which did happen but when the pup was returned to her its testicles were found to be where they should be - makes me think perhaps the stress of travel in a plane etc could have something to do with it - perhaps wait and as already said keep warm and and then re-check. If still not there the breeder should at least refund purchase pice but that does not cover the flight etc for getting him over from NZ - but then if you sold him as a pet desexed or signed contract that he would be you may not be too much out of pocket - these things are always a drama. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay57 Posted July 26, 2013 Author Share Posted July 26, 2013 He is a little Jack Russell Terrier, he is going for an ultra sound next week , and a second opinion, so here is hoping as he is a dear little fellow, I think that is part of the drama as you get attached to them very quickly Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Christina Posted July 26, 2013 Share Posted July 26, 2013 Hopefully they will drop back down. I would think the vet would be telling the truth. Wait & see. The breeder obligations & what actually happens are 2 variable things. As a breeder I take back any animal the owner is not happy with no matter what the reason. I like to know my dogs are happy & settled in suitable homes & that the new owners are happy too. If there was no problem with the dog I would try to get the owner to pay the transport costs but would pay them myself if I was worried about the dog & where they may send it. It may work out for you yet. Haven't ever heard of this happening. Keep us posted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WreckitWhippet Posted July 27, 2013 Share Posted July 27, 2013 If you haven't seen them both by now, I'd be asking for a refund. A dog at 13 weeks with no testicles is not a breeding prospect and not one that I'd include in my lines, even if they did come down later. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dancinbcs Posted July 27, 2013 Share Posted July 27, 2013 I remember a very well known vet and exhibitor telling me this happened to a puppy he sent from Australia to NZ. It was definitely entire when it left and not when it arrived. Apparently the stress of the flight can cause this to happen. Sometimes they come back down and sometimes not and it is no different to anything else going wrong with the development of a "show potential" puppy and is not the fault of the breeder who sent him in good faith. What happens now depends on if the testicles come back down or not in the next few weeks and what guarantee you had worked out with the breeder. In most cases if the dog does not turn out as required the is returned or the owner can sell it as a pet and possibly get a refund of any price difference from the breeder. The cost of transport is up to the purchaser who made that decision to import. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mini girl Posted July 28, 2013 Share Posted July 28, 2013 He is a little Jack Russell Terrier, he is going for an ultra sound next week , and a second opinion, so here is hoping as he is a dear little fellow, I think that is part of the drama as you get attached to them very quickly Hope you get the result you are hoping for - yes they have a way of making you love them - but that is what puppies are like - good luck be interested to hear the outcome. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay57 Posted July 31, 2013 Author Share Posted July 31, 2013 2 nd opinion today , both are there , not completely down, Vet thinks he is a slow maturer, and his testes are small, but he will be okay for breeding, going to check him again in 2 weeks, so looking better than it did last week Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WreckitWhippet Posted August 2, 2013 Share Posted August 2, 2013 2 nd opinion today , both are there , not completely down, Vet thinks he is a slow maturer, and his testes are small, but he will be okay for breeding, going to check him again in 2 weeks, so looking better than it did last week that should ring alarm bells Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts