sheena Posted April 19, 2014 Share Posted April 19, 2014 (edited) You say she will do everything when you are away from the other dogs....have you tried taking her far enough away to where she is comfortable & very gradually bringing her in towards the main group If you have clicker trained her, you could also try LAT (Look At That Game). Basically, its counter-conditioning her to what ever has her stressed out. You start away from the other group, where she is comfortable & happy to work with you & as soon as she looks in the direction of the stressor, you click & she turns back to you for the treat. Soon it will become a game to her & instead of getting stressed, she will perform it as a trick, she looks at the stressor, you click & she gets treated. You gradually move in closer to the stressor, playing the game. If she looks at the stressor & you click, but she doesn't hear the clicker or is late responding, then it means you have gone too quickly & you need to move back out more. It wont happen all in one session, but if you take it slow over several sessions & don't go too far, too soon...it will more than likely work There are plenty of people here on DOL that have used LAT to counter-condition their dogs. :) Including myself. Edited April 19, 2014 by sheena Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
emilymarston Posted April 19, 2014 Author Share Posted April 19, 2014 You say she will do everything when you are away from the other dogs....have you tried taking her far enough away to where she is comfortable & very gradually bringing her in towards the main group If you have clicker trained her, you could also try LAT (Look At That Game). Basically, its counter-conditioning her to what ever has her stressed out. You start away from the other group, where she is comfortable & happy to work with you & as soon as she looks in the direction of the stressor, you click & she turns back to you for the treat. Soon it will become a game to her & instead of getting stressed, she will perform it as a trick, she looks at the stressor, you click & she gets treated. You gradually move in closer to the stressor, playing the game. If she looks at the stressor & you click, but she doesn't hear the clicker or is late responding, then it means you have gone too quickly & you need to move back out more. It wont happen all in one session, but if you take it slow over several sessions & don't go too far, too soon...it will more than likely work There are plenty of people here on DOL that have used LAT to counter-condition their dogs. :) Including myself. That sounds like a good idea! I'll have to try it out :) thanks! don't know how the instructors will like clicker training at their club, seeing as they use negative reinforcement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sheena Posted April 19, 2014 Share Posted April 19, 2014 You say she will do everything when you are away from the other dogs....have you tried taking her far enough away to where she is comfortable & very gradually bringing her in towards the main group If you have clicker trained her, you could also try LAT (Look At That Game). Basically, its counter-conditioning her to what ever has her stressed out. You start away from the other group, where she is comfortable & happy to work with you & as soon as she looks in the direction of the stressor, you click & she turns back to you for the treat. Soon it will become a game to her & instead of getting stressed, she will perform it as a trick, she looks at the stressor, you click & she gets treated. You gradually move in closer to the stressor, playing the game. If she looks at the stressor & you click, but she doesn't hear the clicker or is late responding, then it means you have gone too quickly & you need to move back out more. It wont happen all in one session, but if you take it slow over several sessions & don't go too far, too soon...it will more than likely work There are plenty of people here on DOL that have used LAT to counter-condition their dogs. :) Including myself. That sounds like a good idea! I'll have to try it out :) thanks! don't know how the instructors will like clicker training at their club, seeing as they use negative reinforcement. No wonder she is shutting down....If I were you then, I would be 'ing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mita Posted April 19, 2014 Share Posted April 19, 2014 They have looong memories! Drop the obedience aspect and just have FUN in class! Yes to this. In fact, a BIG yes, to this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
emilymarston Posted April 25, 2014 Author Share Posted April 25, 2014 (edited) Bonnie and I will be attending (not competing) at the Action Dogs trial at KCC park tomorrow!! Is there anything I should know, or do, before I go and watch the dogs? I'd like to do a bit of training with Bonnie around the other dogs to help her get used to the environment. And also, it just happens that Bonnie's half aunty will be competing at the trial! I'm so excited! So if you happen to see a shaved black cocker spaniel, it's probably going to be Bonnie :) Edited April 25, 2014 by allyandbonnie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
emilymarston Posted April 25, 2014 Author Share Posted April 25, 2014 You say she will do everything when you are away from the other dogs....have you tried taking her far enough away to where she is comfortable & very gradually bringing her in towards the main group If you have clicker trained her, you could also try LAT (Look At That Game). Basically, its counter-conditioning her to what ever has her stressed out. You start away from the other group, where she is comfortable & happy to work with you & as soon as she looks in the direction of the stressor, you click & she turns back to you for the treat. Soon it will become a game to her & instead of getting stressed, she will perform it as a trick, she looks at the stressor, you click & she gets treated. You gradually move in closer to the stressor, playing the game. If she looks at the stressor & you click, but she doesn't hear the clicker or is late responding, then it means you have gone too quickly & you need to move back out more. It wont happen all in one session, but if you take it slow over several sessions & don't go too far, too soon...it will more than likely work There are plenty of people here on DOL that have used LAT to counter-condition their dogs. :) Including myself. That sounds like a good idea! I'll have to try it out :) thanks! don't know how the instructors will like clicker training at their club, seeing as they use negative reinforcement. No wonder she is shutting down....If I were you then, I would be 'ing That plays a big part of it. We (Bonnie and I) hate negative reinforcement. But this club is the only one my parents agreed to take me to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J... Posted April 25, 2014 Share Posted April 25, 2014 Bonnie and I will be attending (not competing) at the Action Dogs trial at KCC park tomorrow!! Is there anything I should know, or do, before I go and watch the dogs? I'd like to do a bit of training with Bonnie around the other dogs to help her get used to the environment. I'm going to assume you've never been to a trial at all :) Keep your dog on a short lead and under control, stay out of people's way when they are warming up their dogs or running from ring to ring etc. Don't let your dog approach other dogs without permission, or play with or approach the toys and food containers that are scattered outside of ring exits. Squeaky toys are frowned upon, as are thrown toys around the rings. There is some great people in agility in Vic, but trialling puts pressure on people in different ways and someone who is normally lovely may not react well to a non-trialler getting in their way or distracting their dog :) There will be triallers like me who have a warm up jump or a pool noodle for warming up dogs around the very outside of the exhibition area, follow their lead on distance etc from the competition area on a good distance to work your dog at. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Spotted Devil Posted April 27, 2014 Share Posted April 27, 2014 Bonnie and I will be attending (not competing) at the Action Dogs trial at KCC park tomorrow!! Is there anything I should know, or do, before I go and watch the dogs? I'd like to do a bit of training with Bonnie around the other dogs to help her get used to the environment. And also, it just happens that Bonnie's half aunty will be competing at the trial! I'm so excited! So if you happen to see a shaved black cocker spaniel, it's probably going to be Bonnie :) Great to meet you and Bonnie yesterday! I hope you had a great time and enjoyed watching the rings. Sorry I didn't get a chance to chat more - it's always a bit busy! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
emilymarston Posted April 27, 2014 Author Share Posted April 27, 2014 Great to meet you and Bonnie yesterday! I hope you had a great time and enjoyed watching the rings. Sorry I didn't get a chance to chat more - it's always a bit busy! We had an amazing time! The dogs were just so amazing to watch live, as compared to a computer screen. Someone had set up a few weaves and jumps behind the rings, me and Bonnie had a little bit of training on them. Bonnie and I loved it! she wasn't fazed by the other dogs around us and handled the jumps like a pro! she's still skipping poles, but she was happy and excited to weave. We shouldn't have used the equipment without asking, but the temptation was too much :) a big thanks to who ever left them out! It was really nice to watch all the dogs, especially the little cocker spaniel. I loved your run with your dalmatian in the far right ring!! it was awesome!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
emilymarston Posted April 27, 2014 Author Share Posted April 27, 2014 I went to obedience class today. Little to no improvement. I sort of forgot to change up our training during class, so of course Bonnie didn't enjoy it. But I did notice that she perked up towards the end, whether she was excited to leave or excited to work, I have no idea. But it was a slight improvement! I tried to talk about Bonnie with the instructor, about how she acts differently in class. And he said that all dogs are like that, and he called Bonnie schizophrenic. He said I needed to train out of home more often (even though I spent most of yesterday at a trial training Bonnie). Where we train isn't the problem, it's how and why we train... So hopefully next class I'll talk about it again. I didn't get to say everything I wanted to this time, because he cut me off almost mid-sentence. But hopefully it'll all get sorted next time. Thanks again for all the help everyone! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris the Rebel Wolf Posted April 27, 2014 Share Posted April 27, 2014 (edited) I didn't get to say everything I wanted to this time, because he cut me off almost mid-sentence. He sounds like an idiot not to put too fine a point on it. This may have been suggested before, I only read the first page and this one, but can you arrive 45-30 minutes earlier and start training before others arrive, and see how Bonnie does? Edited to specify whom I'm considering an idiot Edited April 27, 2014 by Chris the Rebel Wolf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
emilymarston Posted April 27, 2014 Author Share Posted April 27, 2014 I didn't get to say everything I wanted to this time, because he cut me off almost mid-sentence. He sounds like an idiot not to put too fine a point on it. This may have been suggested before, I only read the first page and this one, but can you arrive 45-30 minutes earlier and start training before others arrive, and see how Bonnie does? Edited to specify whom I'm considering an idiot Yeah. I did that at today's lesson and it didn't help at all. I arrived about 15 minutes early. I was pulling out all her favourite tricks, but she just looked so sad and didn't want to work. The minute the instructor called all the dogs in to conclude the lesson, Bonnie got excited. She knew we were leaving. I did some tricks with her then in front of the class and instructor, and she was great! Not worried about the other dogs and people around her at all. Bonnie was almost barking in anticipation of a reward, which happened to be the same treats she refused to eat for most of the lesson. So I'm still confused about poor old Bonnie. But I will be talking to the instructor again (sadly he's the only one taking class 3, so I'll have to talk to him) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steph M Posted April 27, 2014 Share Posted April 27, 2014 If I had a bigger car I'd offer to pick up and drop you off at werribee, this guy sounds like a wanker! Sadly the Fiesta isn't built for more than two people! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VizslaMomma Posted April 28, 2014 Share Posted April 28, 2014 I tried to talk about Bonnie with the instructor, about how she acts differently in class. And he said that all dogs are like that, and he called Bonnie schizophrenic. He said I needed to train out of home more often (even though I spent most of yesterday at a trial training Bonnie). Where we train isn't the problem, it's how and why we train... Thanks again for all the help everyone! He sounds well off. His rapport seems very lacking with you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
emilymarston Posted April 28, 2014 Author Share Posted April 28, 2014 If I had a bigger car I'd offer to pick up and drop you off at werribee, this guy sounds like a wanker! Sadly the Fiesta isn't built for more than two people! Do Werribee offer agility classes? My mum said she'd be happy to take me there. But I don't want to go through another round of obedience classes before starting agility. also do they use positive reinforcement and clicker training? It would be great if I am allowed to bring along my clicker to training, Bonnie gets super motivated with clicks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steph M Posted April 28, 2014 Share Posted April 28, 2014 They sure do, but you'd have to talk to them about an assessment, I'm.sure they'd be happy to move you up but would need to assess her I guess? Email them and ask, Sue has answered a few of.my emails and is a great help. Clickers are welcome, we got told to use whatever works.l be it toys, food or games. Its all positive, encouraged to treat for everything and the focus is on fun and having a good time. I've been caught out getting frustrated before and the instructors are great and will come up and have a laugh and make a suggestion or just laugh at your dog being a jerk, as mine sometimes does... there's also a social walk along the river before classes which might be good.for her, or you can go off and have a walk on your own before. Give them an.email.or pop.in on a Saturday morning for a chat perhaps. Let me know if you do, I'll.come say hi! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
emilymarston Posted April 28, 2014 Author Share Posted April 28, 2014 They sure do, but you'd have to talk to them about an assessment, I'm.sure they'd be happy to move you up but would need to assess her I guess? Email them and ask, Sue has answered a few of.my emails and is a great help. Clickers are welcome, we got told to use whatever works.l be it toys, food or games. Its all positive, encouraged to treat for everything and the focus is on fun and having a good time. I've been caught out getting frustrated before and the instructors are great and will come up and have a laugh and make a suggestion or just laugh at your dog being a jerk, as mine sometimes does... there's also a social walk along the river before classes which might be good.for her, or you can go off and have a walk on your own before. Give them an.email.or pop.in on a Saturday morning for a chat perhaps. Let me know if you do, I'll.come say hi! Is the training on a Saturday morning? if so I won't be able to make it Werribee sounded so good! guess I'll have to stay where I am for the moment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris the Rebel Wolf Posted April 28, 2014 Share Posted April 28, 2014 Good luck, sounds like you might need it with Mr Idiot Instructor. Maybe it would be worthwhile talking to a separate trainer in your area about Bonnie's moods? I'm interested... in what would happen if you went there on a non class day, did the training, and see if she focuses well. If she does, maybe visit that area if possible so she grows more confident on her own, first? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
emilymarston Posted April 28, 2014 Author Share Posted April 28, 2014 Good luck, sounds like you might need it with Mr Idiot Instructor. Maybe it would be worthwhile talking to a separate trainer in your area about Bonnie's moods? I'm interested... in what would happen if you went there on a non class day, did the training, and see if she focuses well. If she does, maybe visit that area if possible so she grows more confident on her own, first? I've tried that and she was fine! we can work right next to the other dogs pretty well, but only once the class is over. once the class is over, Bonnie just switches on and wants to work. I was going all these awesome tricks meters away from the other dogs and trainers straight after our last class ended. it's just during the actual class when she plays up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kallistar Posted April 28, 2014 Share Posted April 28, 2014 They sure do, but you'd have to talk to them about an assessment, I'm.sure they'd be happy to move you up but would need to assess her I guess? Email them and ask, Sue has answered a few of.my emails and is a great help. Clickers are welcome, we got told to use whatever works.l be it toys, food or games. Its all positive, encouraged to treat for everything and the focus is on fun and having a good time. I've been caught out getting frustrated before and the instructors are great and will come up and have a laugh and make a suggestion or just laugh at your dog being a jerk, as mine sometimes does... there's also a social walk along the river before classes which might be good.for her, or you can go off and have a walk on your own before. Give them an.email.or pop.in on a Saturday morning for a chat perhaps. Let me know if you do, I'll.come say hi! Steph, Werribee ODC now is back to it's proper training time of Saturday afternoons :) and just in case you are wondering why I know this, its because I am a member there too Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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