Merlin01 Posted October 2, 2005 Share Posted October 2, 2005 (edited) Hi all, Im looking to buy an Alaskan Malamute, not for show but just as a pet. He's only 5 weeks old so I cant pick him up for another week, but I'm concerned about his nose and its exposure to our harsh Australian summer sun. The owner implied that this will "probably" go away, but after a little searching online I found this: "Snow Nose or Bad Pigmentation? Snow Nose is described as a pink/reddish marking on the black nose. It is commonly experienced amongst the northern breeds. Snow Nose can disappear over the warmer months and reappear over the winter months. There is nothing wrong with snow nose. Bad pigmentation occasionally occurs within specimens of the breed. The pigmentation area generally occurs around the face and is best described as being pinkish skin and it can, in some cases, detract from the dogs’ appearance. The main problem with this pigmentation is the threat of sun cancer occurring to the area as the pink skin is more at risk of sunburn. It is advisable to cover the affected area with sun screen regularly to protect the dog from this threat of cancer. It is possible to correct pigmentation problems with tattooing and there is a relatively new procedure where a vegetable dye is injected into the area and spread to cover the pigmentation." I just dont know if the $650 is worth the worry of my new best friend contracting cancer every summer. If anyone has a dog with this problem could you give me your opinion/suggestions? Thanks. I hope to provide a picture below. Edited October 2, 2005 by Merlin01 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shekhina Posted October 2, 2005 Share Posted October 2, 2005 Hmm...I would say if you have your heart set on the dog then just make sure you're very strict with applying sun cream to his nose every day. Is this puppy from a registered breeder? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ellz Posted October 2, 2005 Share Posted October 2, 2005 (edited) I personally would not class this as snow nose. To me it simply looks like poor/incomplete pigmentation. ETA: If this person is a registered breeder then they are breaching the ANKC Code Of Ethics if they allow the puppy to leave home prior to 8 weeks. In some breeds at 5 weeks, the pigmentation could still be incomplete and it may fill in. Other breeds incomplete pigmentation is a fault at a young age. If you are really concerned about the pigmentation issue, I would be leaving the puppy with the breeder until it is at LEAST 8 weeks of age to see what develops in that time frame. Edited October 2, 2005 by ellz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Merlin01 Posted October 2, 2005 Author Share Posted October 2, 2005 Is this puppy from a registered breeder? No shekhina, not a registered breeder......no papers etc. ETA: If this person is a registered breeder then they are breaching the ANKC Code Of Ethics if they allow the puppy to leave home prior to 8 weeks.In some breeds at 5 weeks, the pigmentation could still be incomplete and it may fill in. Other breeds incomplete pigmentation is a fault at a young age. If you are really concerned about the pigmentation issue, I would be leaving the puppy with the breeder until it is at LEAST 8 weeks of age to see what develops in that time frame. @ellz - Do you think the pup would be better off developing social/pack behavior for an extra couple of weeks regardless of the pigment issue? I thought 6wks was an "acceptable" minimum. Thanks for your thoughts guys. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toohey Posted October 2, 2005 Share Posted October 2, 2005 Hi merlin and welcome to the forum, just curious, is there any reason why you are not buying a pup from registered breeder? Are you aware of the benefits of buying from a registered and reputable breeder? I can't help with the nose question, but 8 weeks is the accepted age for pups to go to new homes and it is against the code of ethics of the canine council if breeders do not comply with this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sas Posted October 2, 2005 Share Posted October 2, 2005 If you have fallen in love with this puppy just make sure you apply a product like zinc (what the crickers were) on puppies nose. And it's not just in summer, UV rays are all year round. You certainly can take pup home at 6 weeks if she isn't from a registered breeder, however if you can arrange not to pick her up until 8 weeks you will benefit from that, it will give her an additional 2 weeks to learn things from her mum and litter mates such as bite inhibition, toileting, socialisation and she'll also be at a more stable stage to take at 8 weeks. An additional 2 weeks with mum can mean a lot for the pup :D Have you considered buying from a registered breeder where you can get a health gaurantee and see the parents? I'm pretty sure if you have a look around you should be able to get a registered pet quality puppy for the price you are alreeady paying. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Merlin01 Posted October 3, 2005 Author Share Posted October 3, 2005 RE: Reg. Breeders I have been in the Market for about 6 weeks and seen 3 different litters of Mals, none of which were from reg. breeders. From this last litter I viewed I was just drawn to the owners’ attitude and know without a doubt they want what’s best for the dogs in no uncertain terms. ie. turning away yobbos, hour+ interview with me before considering my interest, wanting to keep up to date with the pups progress/life, providing me with quality information/vet documentation and the dietary likes/dislikes of my pup exclusively, and arranging the Father to be brought over so I could view him as well (Mother is onsite). It's these things alone that I had not witnessed with other breeders that made me cross the line from adoring the pup to registering interest to buy. They were a bit tentative about letting him go at 6wks though, and now from your advice on here I can understand why. I will ask to put it off for an extra 2 weeks and let him develop socially to what is accepted as the norm by the professionals. Thanks for all your help, it's been invaluable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Animal House Posted October 3, 2005 Share Posted October 3, 2005 Hi, You might like to check out this page, its a list of breeders of Alaskan Malamutes, personally If I was getting a purebred dog, I would certainly only buy from a registered breeder, and even then you should do your homework. :D http://www.dogzonline.com.au/breeds/commun...sk_malamute.asp 8 weeks is much better for the pup,and the owner. Breeders who arent registered may have something to hide. You want to know that the parents have been health checked, that there are no genetic or behavioural issues with both parents (which you dont really know just from seeing the dog). And most, if not all registered breeders are trying to improve the breed, and only sell quality, healthy pups. Unfortunately dogs without papers (even as a pet) you really dont know what you are buying. A pup with that pigmentation on his/her nose is up for a lifetime of daily sunscreen or having the nose tattooed. Good Luck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mita Posted October 3, 2005 Share Posted October 3, 2005 I couldn't comment on the pup in the pic. But when we adopted an 8 yr old tibbie who'd been in Canberra, she had white sections on her nose (it was July). Our vet, who'd worked in northern USA, said it was 'Winter Nose', & would go away. Within her first year here in Queensland, her nose was all black....& has been since. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lappie_Girl Posted October 3, 2005 Share Posted October 3, 2005 This is my fella with a "snow nose" In summer you may find the nose will go darker. My fella will not suffer too much in summer as the top of his nose is still black. But saying that I still apply zinc every morning. I bought my guy from a registered breeder and he was not discounted for this reason. I would be asking yourself if buying from an unregistered breeder is something you really want to do. Most "snow noses" are not a fault in show circles. And thus does not reduce the vaule of the dog. Cheers Kat Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Merlin01 Posted October 3, 2005 Author Share Posted October 3, 2005 But saying that I still apply zinc every morning. Hi Kat, Is the zinc still there when you get home?? I'm just curious because Mal's can have a habbit of being diggers from what Ive read, so how durable is the zinc? Does your pooch lick/moisten/remove it with its tounge or do they dislike the taste? Thanks for your interest/knowledge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kelpiecuddles Posted October 3, 2005 Share Posted October 3, 2005 Hi Merlin, Regardless of whether you continue with the purchase of this pup I would find out first if the parents have had all the relevent health checks. Not sure what Mal's need but I would imagine hip/elbow scores would be right up there. Maybe a mal person could confirm what is recommended? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Merlin01 Posted October 3, 2005 Author Share Posted October 3, 2005 I would imagine hip/elbow scores would be right up there. I believe hip dysplasia can be a problem with them. I saw the almost 3yr old Mother and she didn’t show any signs of movement problems (lying down/getting up/running around etc) I am viewing the Father next Saturday. I imagine the only way to get hip/elbow scores would be via X-ray?? Do you know what that generally costs? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MissMonaro Posted October 4, 2005 Share Posted October 4, 2005 she didn’t show any signs of movement problems Dont be fooled by the things that you cannot see !! I know of a bitch that has what is classed as moderate hip dysplasia. She shows no signs at all. Runs, jumps, swims, everything. To the naked eye you would not even know. I have seen the x-rays and that shows a whole different picture. BTW...you cannot have the pup hip and elbow scored as it is too young. The parents need to be done. This costs upwards of $250 and more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miranda Posted October 4, 2005 Share Posted October 4, 2005 A dog may appear to have normal movement, but can still have hip dysplasia. Just because it can move around, jump, get up and down etc. doesn't mean that its hips are normal. A dog with HD may show no signs at all until it starts to age and arthritis sets in causing pain and discomfort. Alaskan Malamutes are a large breed and are routinely x-rayed for hip and elbow dysplasia, a reputable breeder wouldn't dream of breeding from a dog that hadn't been scored. If the sire and dam of the litter haven't been scored I certainly wouldn't be buying a puppy. The fact that you don't want a show dog is irrelevant, show dog or pet every dog deserves a long and healthy life free from pain and if you are buying a puppy from unscored parents you have no way of knowing if your puppy is likely to develop HD or ED. HD can occur in a litter where both parents have normal hips, but it is much less likely. Registered breeders often have hip and elbow scores for dogs way back in the puppy's pedigree as well as for the sire and dam so they can also guarantee the hips of previous generations. I have no doubt that the people you are thinking of buying from love their dogs and want their puppies to go to good homes etc., but if they are not x-raying their breeding stock they aren't doing the right thing. They may be ignorant or they may just be unwilling to spend the money, but they certainly don't have the long term welfare of their puppies as a priority. It doesn't matter how well you screen your buyers, how much dietary advice you give, how much you want to be informed of the puppy's progress, if you are not x-raying you are NOT a responsible breeder. $650 is a lot of money to pay for an unregistered puppy from unscored parents, if I were you I would forget about this litter and buy from a registered breeder Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kelpiecuddles Posted October 4, 2005 Share Posted October 4, 2005 Miranda is right merlin. As heartbreaking as it might be to walk away from this adorable litter of pups hip dysplasia is not something you want to be dealing with in the future if you can help it. My aunties golden retriever developed this when she got old and had to be put down as she couldn't squat properly to pee, for 6 months they would go out with her and help hold her back end steady just so that she could go to the toilet, trust me when I say that seeing your dog like that in the future will be much more heart breaking than walking away from this litter and finding a breeder with hip scored parents (and probably for a similar price) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
espinay2 Posted October 4, 2005 Share Posted October 4, 2005 I imagine the only way to get hip/elbow scores would be via X-ray?? Both the dog and the bitch used for breeding need to have their hips and elbows x-rayed and the x-ray films submitted by the vet for assessment by a trained assessor. This assessor then provides a report which details what they see in the x-ray and provides a 'score'. This report and score give the breeder information on the hip and elbow health of the dogs to be bred which may cause problems for those particular dogs as it matures and which may be passed down to their pups (causing them to have problems either eariler or later in life). For the breeder to assess correctly the genetic joint health of the dogs they are breeding, it is actually even better if possible to have the scores on more than just the two dogs being bred but to have the information for as many dogs as possible in the pedigree going back as far as they can (as well as info on the siblings in the pedigree). this will give an even more complete picture of what may be inherited by the pups. IMO having the scores for the sire and dam is the minimum I would accept for any breed prone to joint problems. It is no guarantee, but can provide at least some assistance towards ensuring any dog bred from them has a better chance of being pain free throughout its life and not lumbered by a incapcitiating (and often costly) condition. Here is info on the HD scheme run by the Alaskan Malamute Club Victoria: http://www.users.bigpond.com/amcv/HD%20Program.htm For info on Malamute health, this looks a good comprehensive website: http://www.malamutehealth.org/ As for the nose, it looks to me like incomplete pigment. It may colour over and it may not. Only time will tell. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lappie_Girl Posted October 4, 2005 Share Posted October 4, 2005 Merlin01 - I have used zinc on my pup since he was tiny. I use the waterproof stuff. Seems to last but when he digs it doesn't last as long. He doesn't like the taste so doesn't lick it off. Kat Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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