Rspca Investigates Dog Squad's 'cruelty'

[phatdex]

RSPCA investigates dog squad's 'cruelty'

By Rhett Watson

August 18, 2006 02:00am

THE RSPCA is investigating the NSW Police dog squad over its use of electric collars and also firing revolvers near their animals to test them for sensitivity.

Police had to suspend part of the training for new dogs after a complaint the noise sensitivity test could cause the dogs psychological problems.

It is also under pressure to get rid of electric collars, which send a jolt of electricity into the dogs and are considered so cruel they are illegal in NSW, South Australia and the ACT.

NSW Police is fighting the RSPCA on the basis it believes it is exempt from the law governing the collars.

But the dog squad has drawn the ire of certain dog breeders and trainers, who disagree with the squad's recruitment tests and training in general.

At least three have told The Daily Telegraph they will no longer supply dogs to the police.

"The collar was used for the first time this year as a last resort to correct the behaviour of two highly experienced operational police dogs," a police spokesman said.

"Had the re-training not been successful, these dogs would have been destroyed. Police dogs are highly trained to exacting standards and can not simply be 're-homed' or placed in the general community."

Lisa Boyle, who has professionally bred and trained patrol dogs for more than 15 years, alleges a $5000 German shepherd she supplied police in May was returned with psychological problems after a sensitivity test.

"They handed me back a dog with serious problems and said 'We don't want him any more'," she said.

"That's okay if he's a pet and you're going to keep him but I do this for a living."

Another breeder, who has supplied Queensland and Fijian police, said he had demanded the return of his dogs only months ago after hearing how the squad tested new recruits.

WTF? E - collar, firing gun near a dog? Good grief the RSPCA has nothing better to do!

[MonElite]

They should stop cars firing back as well. That is a noice as well.

And oh how about stoping storms with thunders, arent many dogs petrified of them?

Lets give RSPCA some more ideas.

;)

[Jefe's owners]

And then they will go after prong collars..... bastards.... they should start at the vets that sell check chains and haltis.... those are far more damaging to the dogs than other training tools

Edited August 18, 2006 by Jefe's owners

[ish]

Even show GSDs have to be gun sure - are they going to go around to shows and fine everyone for subjecting the poor dogs to starting pistols?

The $5000 GSD who sustained 'psychological problems' must've had good nerves.

Is it correct in saying e collars are illegal in NSW? I thought they were ok there, but not in Vic?

[Nekhbet]

I thought they were OK in Vic AND NSW. The prosecution comes if actual pain or harm comes to the animal??

better start hiding my equiptment ...

[MonElite]

Recently there was a person in NSW prosecuted for using a n ecollar. so just happends the dog was a dobie so news traveled fast in "our" little world.

The court case was dismissed and owner of the dog got off with no fine.

[jaybeece]

Even show GSDs have to be gun sure - are they going to go around to shows and fine everyone for subjecting the poor dogs to starting pistols?

The $5000 GSD who sustained 'psychological problems' must've had good nerves.

Is it correct in saying e collars are illegal in NSW? I thought they were ok there, but not in Vic?

I would have thought that a $5k GSD would have a stronger nerve than that, it's a bad reflection on the breeding, not the training methods. I mean, they're police dogs, the last thing the police need is for the dog to go to pieces if a shot is fired. Makes perfect sense to test them in this manner.

I think e-collars are allowed in NSW only under cetain conditions- ie. if recommended by a vet or behaviouralist.

[Jeff Jones]

the rspca 3 years ago also wanted sirens on dog squad cars to be removed as it ads stress to a dog....

[RealityBites]

My god!! What IS the world coming too??!! Hmmm maybe if they asked half a dozen police dogs to come out and show what their training is like under a whole heap of circumstances compared to what the average pet owner's dog is like under the same circumstances, then then RSPCA can decide which one poses more of a danger to the public and which one is better trained! The rspca are idiots.

[lab and poodle]

"The rspca are idiots."

I have no respect for the ideas on both sides of this debate. It all sucks to me on one side an sounds like knee jerk on the other side.I think it is time to have a dam good look at what a police dog is requred to do, why it is required to do it, and how best that may be achieved. It might be a good idea to have a look across the Tasman at a police force that uses a much higher per capita ratio of dogs, have been using them for much longer and see how they do it differently. I personally have no ideas how it should be done, but I am always sceptical of TINA arguements. (THere is no alternative).

Meanwhile I'll chuck a few pennies the RSPCA even though I don't agree with some of what they say, even though I think there PR is crap, even though they aren't radical enough for me. They do do some good things.

[Herr Rottweiler]

exactly! What is this world comming to! Introduce a new law, people make a little fuss then roll over on it, make a new law etc.

The dog training world is pitiful with all the half cocked mums clubs and the laws that keep getting introduced are a appauling.

Political correctness is rife in the world and it's making people nervous and mistrusting of one another

[petmezz]

so dose this mean that the RSPCA is going to stop the temproment test that dogsNSW have secured the rights to to test pitbull types and possably other dogs?? as it dose specifiy reaction to a gun being fired from a hidded area.

ge the RSPCA needs to be regulated, and get some sence involved in their decishions. soon they will fine you for saying NO to your dog, imagine the amount of problems then.

[Kavik]

I know Lisa and I was there when the police were selecting dogs from her to train. I also remember seeing her later and her commenting on how one was returned and was not in the same condition as she sent it. I don't think she would exaggerate this. Her dogs are not soft . . .

[KOE]

What next cant they find any more dog breeds to pick on

My 3 gsds go to the gun club and we stand about 2 foot away from the firing and they love watching fireworks so I can not see how shoting a gun can scare them, unless they are nervy to begin with or they have had a fright about something elsa.

go figure the RSPCA havent they got better things to worry about like cruelty to animals.

[lab and poodle]

[The dog training world is pitiful with all the "half cocked mums clubs" and the laws that keep getting introduced are a appauling.

Political correctness is rife in the world and it's making people nervous and mistrusting of one another

"half cocked mums clubs"

So these are much worse are they than grumpy so and so's that don't like the world changing in a way not to their liking doing it for a bob?

Frankly there isn't enought respect and courtesy towards different cultures, ages, and people. If this makes some people who lack these graces nervous, all the better.

As far as animal laws in this state are concerned, if you can't drive a big Mack Truck through them, then you need a different pair of spectacles. I think they need a lot of tightening, the sooner the better. You wont want to know how , so I wont tell you.

[snobbybobby]

RSPCA investigates dog squad's 'cruelty'

By Rhett Watson

August 18, 2006 02:00am

THE RSPCA is investigating the NSW Police dog squad over its use of electric collars and also firing revolvers near their animals to test them for sensitivity.

Police had to suspend part of the training for new dogs after a complaint the noise sensitivity test could cause the dogs psychological problems.

It is also under pressure to get rid of electric collars, which send a jolt of electricity into the dogs and are considered so cruel they are illegal in NSW, South Australia and the ACT.

NSW Police is fighting the RSPCA on the basis it believes it is exempt from the law governing the collars.

But the dog squad has drawn the ire of certain dog breeders and trainers, who disagree with the squad's recruitment tests and training in general.

At least three have told The Daily Telegraph they will no longer supply dogs to the police.

"The collar was used for the first time this year as a last resort to correct the behaviour of two highly experienced operational police dogs," a police spokesman said.

"Had the re-training not been successful, these dogs would have been destroyed. Police dogs are highly trained to exacting standards and can not simply be 're-homed' or placed in the general community."

Lisa Boyle, who has professionally bred and trained patrol dogs for more than 15 years, alleges a $5000 German shepherd she supplied police in May was returned with psychological problems after a sensitivity test.

"They handed me back a dog with serious problems and said 'We don't want him any more'," she said.

"That's okay if he's a pet and you're going to keep him but I do this for a living."

Another breeder, who has supplied Queensland and Fijian police, said he had demanded the return of his dogs only months ago after hearing how the squad tested new recruits.

WTF? E - collar, firing gun near a dog? Good grief the RSPCA has nothing better to do!

[Herr Rottweiler]

[The dog training world is pitiful with all the "half cocked mums clubs" and the laws that keep getting introduced are a appauling.

Political correctness is rife in the world and it's making people nervous and mistrusting of one another

"half cocked mums clubs"

So these are much worse are they than grumpy so and so's that don't like the world changing in a way not to their liking doing it for a bob?

Frankly there isn't enought respect and courtesy towards different cultures, ages, and people. If this makes some people who lack these graces nervous, all the better.

As far as animal laws in this state are concerned, if you can't drive a big Mack Truck through them, then you need a different pair of spectacles. I think they need a lot of tightening, the sooner the better. You wont want to know how , so I wont tell you.

[Nekhbet]

lab n poodle what more tightening do you want for our dog laws? That we lose all dogs that are too scary to the average joe shmo? That if its not fluffy or some cutesy breed then it gets the chop and caged for life? Get real. Thats plain cruel to restrict a dog like that for its natural life.

In victoria they have limited what training a civilian can do. They have limited the equiptment we can use. They have limited where we can go with out dogs. Now they are sniffing to limit our BREEDS.

Try owning a working animal ... I have a working line Malinois. I also have a male DDB who, despite have the ferocity of a fruit fly, is feared by over half the people that meet him. The country is stupid, instead of education about what is actually required for RESPONSIBLE dog ownership they tighten the noose on dog owners then have a go at their dogs.

The 'holes' come from lack of inforcement. Ring the council. They dont care. Ring RSPCA. They dont care unless its a high profile media worthy issue. You can make all the laws in the world but if no one enforces them things will continue on the downhill slide.

RSPCA can take a flying leap.

Edited August 20, 2006 by Nekhbet

[Herr Rottweiler]

Nekhbet, you're wasting a good argument!

[lab and poodle]

Nekhbet

You have made so many assumptions about what I might think and be and what my attitudes are I can't almost be bothered trying to explain it to you. A hint is I truely only dislike two breeds of dog, one of which is a designer dog thats usually white, fluffy and often has poor temperament? Another is that both of my dogs do tracking? Another that my old dog did real life honest to god hunting with me? That I titled my old dog in tracking and obedience? That I plan to do the same with my poodle? That my old boy's temperament is as hard ass as you get for a Lab? Who do you want to ask about that? It is very different to how you worded your response. If the tenor of you response is any guide, the sooner the RSPCA and the law makers move against the gadgets and ironmongery that seem an often unnceessarily cruel part of some dog trainers armory the better. I have moved away from such a training approach , and I just don't buy the "my dog is so tough and is a working dog " excuse any more.

If you have managed to annoy me, and I am very sympathetic to keeping all breeds and encouraging owners to train and work them, then what do you think your attitude is doing to your fellow citizens? You called them "average joe shmo" and belittled their responses towards "scary dogs?" They vote too you know.