Gayle.

OK, I'm intrigued. How exactly do you demonstrate kibble? I've seen people demonstrating cooking appliances, food mixes, baked goods etc, but I have never seen anyone demonstrate kibble. Do you invite dogs along to taste it or something? Or have your own dog there with you?

One thing I've noticed with Uncle Albers is that if you soak it in water, it doesn't visibly swell.....it just gets soft on the outside. I tried soaking it for my oldie, thinking she'd prefer it like that and was surprised that it didn't double in volume like other kibble does. I hope Hamlet's OK.

I was reading a cook book once called "Maggies' Harvest" by Maggie Beer, and she mentions in the book how incredibly cheap offal is in Australia. Apparently most Aussies won't eat it and the butchers just bag it up and sell it off cheap. According to Maggie, offal is a delicacy in Europe and priced to match. I don't plan on eating any of it.....bleeeerrrrghhhh....but I'm happy for the woofers it's so cheap. $1 for 600g of any meat is a pretty good deal.

What is lambs fry? Is it liver? I got a 600g pack for $1 on Friday night and popped it in the freezer until today. I partially thawed it, chopped it up into smaller pieces and put it back in smaller bags to mix with other stuff. I gave the dogs a few pieces each and they gobbled it down so it's obviously tasty for them.

Either will be good, just buy a variety and the dogs will love the change from boring old kibble. Raw meaty bones will give their teeth and jaws the job they were designed to do......rip and tear at meat and crunch raw bones. Avoid the weight bearing bones (marrow bones) as they are too dense for the dogs to eat and the marrow is very high in fat. Pop into the raw food chit chat thread for some great info on what to feed.

Both the breeders I bought my dogs from started them off on a raw diet when they weaned them. And both recommended that they continue to be fed raw most of the time. So I just continued on with how they'd been brought up before I got them.....small chicken pieces when they were little, easy to manage lamb offcuts (ribs are fabulous for chewing, teething babies) and plenty of other tasty stuff. Each time I take them to the vet for a checkup, the vet comments on how wonderfully healthy they look and how beautiful their coats are. Tonight we had chicken kiev for dinner and husband and I aren't too well right now (he has man flu, I just have a common cold, he is dying, I'm getting up at 5.30am to go to work tomorrow) so we didn't really feel like eating much. I cut up the leftovers and added them to the dogs bowls for an extra dinner treat, and Benson very carefully took the cooked chicken kiev pieces in his mouth and laid them carefully beside his bowl and tucked into his raw necks! LOL! He did eat it later, but he really wanted his proper meal first!

I don't chop much at all. I buy chicken frames and other pieces and just bag them up in meal sized portions. I buy trays of lamb offcuts and just freeze the whole lot. The ones from Safeway will do two dogs for their main meal and a bit left over for breakfast the next morning. Most mornings they have a chicken drumstick each for brekky, but if they'd had Safeway lamb the night before, I reserve a meaty bone each for them from the pack. They get their veges, eggs, offal and other bits and pieces mixed with raw roo mince or any other mince that's on special. I make up about 6kg at a time (takes me about an hour), and bag it up in meal sized portions in freezer bags. They get a mince meal about 3 times a week. Because I work fulltime but want to feed raw, I try and make it as easy for myself as possible and as tasty and interesting for the dogs as I can. I have been buying dried liver treats that someone from my obedience club makes, and use that for training so that also makes up part of their offal portion. Whenever I see chicken pieces on special, I load up. Whenever I'm near a butchers I check out their bones and offcuts and see what's cheap for the dogs. They get apples to munch on sometimes (Benson loves them, Dusty is ho-hum about them), and if they're cheap (not much recently!) I'll grate them up to add to their mince mix. They also get some table scraps, although not too much and it's more as a treat rather than an integral part of their diet. But if I'm cooking sausages or steak, sometimes I reserve a little bit just for them. And I'm sure they'd appreciate the taste of finely cooked rump steak if they'd just slow down and chew it well. Oh, and something I try and add to their mince mix once it's in their bowls, is a splash of oil.....rice bran or flaxseed. It seems to give their coats a nice shine.

It's the chicken drumstick with thigh still attached.

If you're feeding it daily, you'd only need a really small amount.....less than 5% of the total.

Have you tried lamb brisket bones? They are the rib cage of the sheep, so not weight bearing and not hard. My dogs love them and have no problems eating them. On Friday nights I do my shopping so they both get a large chicken maryland each. I don't cut it up, just give it to them and it takes them ages to get through it. They have to work out the best way to eat it and the best place to start, so it gives their brains a bit of a workout too. Avindie, completely off topic, but I love your dogs. Are they minis or normal size?

What else are you feeding? My dogs diet is balanced over time, not each and every meal and it's balanced by variety. Australian Shepherds can have a sensitivity to Ivermectin so mine get medicated very carefully, with much consulting of the ingredients on the pack. Intestinal worms, about every 3 months. Heartworms, never. We don't have heartworm here so I don't medicate for it. If we go out of the area, I make sure they have plenty of insect repellent on.

My cats eat Hills Science Diet and it's American. Not too many Aussie made products, but Uncle Albers and The Great Barko are and they are very good.

But I am a hopeless trainer, and my daughter is even worse. I mean....we are really bad. After 2 years in regular obedience classes and loads and loads of practise, Benson still can't heel properly and it's not his fault. It's mine. And Dusty (my daughters obedience dog) only works for food and only when she can see it. They are stuck in class one and don't look likely to be promoted any time soon. So if either of us can teach a dog to speak on command, any one of you guys, who are awesome trainers, should be able to do it then build on it to get the exercise correct.

Could it just be a combination of old age and the cold weather catching up with him? I have a 15yo Lhasa Apso and she sleeps about 22 hours a day when I'm home. She's been sleeping more since the weather turned cold....I think she's just conserving energy. She's healthy enough, just old but it's come on slowly rather than suddenly. With my previous dog, she just got old suddenly and went from being spritely and active to elderly seemingly overnight.

Benson can speak on command. He can't do much else well, but he does this VERY well, and it was so absolutely easy to teach (and we don't use a clicker) that I'm surprised it's a UD exercise. In fact, my 15yo daughter taught him in about 3 minutes. Now we're trying to teach him to "speak softly".

Oh good, I'm not tragic after all! We have a really nice side by side fridge/freezer in the kitchen but for buying up on specials for the dogs it just didn't cut it cos I never had enough room. But now I have a whole freezer just for their food (and a few loaves of bread) and it's awesome cos I can buy as much as I want and know I can easily store it. A few months ago, I would have thought no, I'll just keep some dry on hand for emergencies but really, they have so little of it at the moment, and if I forget to defrost meat, I can always mix up a meal of tinned fish, eggs, cheese and grated veges for them. That take but a few minutes and it's nutritious and a change from their usual.

I have found our local Safeway the best source of lamb offcuts. They bundle them into packs around 1.5kgs ($2.99kg) and combine a heap of different sized offcuts. One pack does my two for dinner, and I keep aside a big chunk each for their brekky the next morning. They seem to have a lot of meat on their offucts, unlike Coles who seem fond of packaging bone and fat and charging $4 kg for it! This is a sad fact of my life.......my husband and kids organised a new chest freezer for me for Mothers Day, and I was so excited because I now had freezer space to buy raw dog food in bulk. Isn't that a tragic thing to get excited over? I am gradually phasing out kibble and they are now down to 1 meal a week, I just need to finish off the current bag and I don't think I'll buy anymore.

Mine won't eat liver or kidney on it's own, so I chop it up and mix it up with mince, veges, eggs etc. But if the pieces are too big, Dusty will pick them out and lay them on the floor beside her bowl, so they have to be finely chopped. I thought I could get away with just halving or quartering chicken livers, but I can't.

The Sale one was July 4th. They only have one a year. I was under the impression they are only held in the very cold months so as not to put undue stress on the dogs. I doubt you'd find one being held in November.

Speaking for myself here, and in my experience only. Your mileage may vary. QUESTIONS 1. What is my relationship with the breed? (ie breeder, first time owner etc) Owner of a dog and a bitch, occasional exhibitor. 2. Where and why was the breed first developed? Developed in the US as an allround stock dog. 3. How common is it in Australia? Become better known, but in my experience they are still relatively unknown by the general public. Most people think they are a border collie or similar. People who are involved in dog-related activities recognise them though. 4. What is the average lifespan? The oldest I've heard of is 16, around 12-15 is about average I think. Mine are only 2 and 1 so here's hoping for many more years pleasure from their company. 5. What is the general temperament/personality? Differs from dog to dog. My boy is laid back, friendly to everyone, nosy about what's going on and very much an independent thinker. Easy to get along with and he's a real clown. Loves doing stuff with his people and is always up for a game, a walk, a run alongside the bike, a swim....but just as happy to lay by my feet and veg out. My girl is also laid back, but quite wary around strangers and is very protective of what she considers her space. She will and does growl readily at strangers approaching the house or the car and is our early warning system that someone's at the door. She is very, very attached to me.....definitely a one-person dog, although she adores my daughter and husband, she quite happily ditches them for my company. Highly intelligent, happy enough to do stuff with us, but if she could just be with me 24 hours a day, glued to my side, she'd be ecstatic. She likes being walked and playing games, but she just as happy not to as long as she's with me. They are both happy, affectionate dogs, one is outgoing the other is not quite so much but she does make friends and then showers them with kisses when she sees them. And she doesn't forget her friends. 6. How much daily exercise is needed for the average adult? A long walk and some free running or running by a bike would be ideal. Mind exercise is just as important and mine love games where they have to figure things out, and also love a bit of obedience work. Frisbee is the game of choice here, and my boy enjoys scent games where I hide a treat and he has to find it. 7. Is it a breed that a first time dog owner could easily cope with? If the pup is chosen carefully for temperament, yes. A first time dog owner could easily cope with either of mine as long as they're prepared to set boundaries and put in the exercise and training required for a happy dog. 8. Can solo dogs of this breed easily occupy themselves for long periods? Mine have never been solo dogs as we have another older dog. I think they could cope with being alone while an owner is at work if thought is put into toys to leave for them, a variety that's changed regularly, and plenty of company and activities when their person is home. 9. How much grooming is required? A good brush once a week, a semi regular trim of paws and behind ears (although some don't get quite as woolly as others behind the ears), and a bath when possible. Mine get bathed about once a fortnight in summer and less often in winter, but that's probably more than they need. They drop coat twice a year and need to have their dead coat stripped or combed out but this is quite easy to do. 10. Is it too boisterous for very small children or for infirm people (unless the dog is well trained)? Mine have not been around small children or elderly people. I think Benson would be a bit too boisterous as he can be over-friendly. Dusty would just deafen them with her barking. But brought up with littlies and trained to keep 4 on the floor, I think they'd be fine. 11. Are there any common hereditary problems a puppy buyer should be aware of? Hip dysplasia and collie eye anomaly are two that come to mind. Parents should be screened and current certificates sighted. Also pups should have eyes and ears tested. Ivermectin sensitivity is something to be very aware of as the vets I've seen don't know about it and need to be told. 12. When buying a puppy, what are the things you should ask of the breeder? (eg what health tests have been done (if applicable) and what is an acceptable result to those tests so the buyer has an idea of what the result should be) Ask about current diet, as they can be sensitive to an abrupt change in diet. See above for health testing. Also a general chat about what you're plans are for the pup and how you see the adult dog fitting into your life. When we bought our boy, we wanted a pup to accompany us on photography trips, and to be able to cope with lots of different sights and sounds without being scared or nervous. The breeder chose a pup for us and he turned out to be just what we wanted. Nothing fazes him, he takes everything in his stride and enjoys all the new experiences we've been able to provide him with.

Do you realise that on a lot of forums, you'd get banned with a topic title like that!

Now I never realised American cockers had fluffy faces! I thought they had naturally short haired heads like my guys do. So, you learn something new every day. Gorgeous doggie, by the way, Ellz!

I work fulltime (how do you support yourself if you don't work?) and I spend plenty of time doing things with my dogs when they're not sleeping.

Apparently that's what mother cats do with their favourite kittens. Chew the whiskers down so the kitten doesn't leave the "nest". Totally OT as far as dogs whiskers go, but here's my little story of cats whiskers: We got Sophie as a 10 week old kitten, a gorgeous little pedigree brown Burmese. We were so thrilled with her that within weeks of bringing her home, we'd put in a request to her breeder for a brown boy, preferably from the same parents. Six months later, we got our wish and when he was 11 weeks old, we brought Bruno home. Sophie adored him from the outset and lavished him with love. She was completely besotted with him, and it was so cute to watch. When he was about 4 months old, we went away for a weekend and left the cats in the care of my older kids (they were aged about 22 and 17). When we got home, the cats were very happy to see us, but Bruno looked a bit strange.....he had no whiskers on his face. I reamed into the kids, thinking they must have let him get near the stove or something (he was a bugger of a kitten for getting into mischief and he hasn't changed) but they swore up and down they'd watched him very carefully. From then on, every time his whiskers started to grow a bit, they'd mysteriously vanish. Then one day I saw Sophie chewing them off. Mystery solved. When I told their breeder what she was doing, and told her it started when we'd gone away for a weekend and left the cats at home she said Sophie must have been a bit upset that we'd gone, so chewed Bruno's whiskers off so he wouldn't leave as well! Poor Bru didn't have a full set of whiskers til he was about 18 months old and she finally stopped her motherly ways with him. Ummm...but having no whiskers didn't slow him down, he was still like a little brown monkey, getting into absolutely everything.

Natures Gift, although it's been a very long time since my guys had a can. But my son was feeding his kelpie-x pup Chum and she had the runs....and was producing large amounts, so I gave him so Natures Gift to try as well as a bad of Uncle Albers as both are within his modest budget, and puppy's runs cleared up in a few days and she looks fabulous.