Simply Grand

Thanks mita, that makes sense. I'm glad it worked! I was interested in showdog's response because I've seen people say on here that they don't allow or don't accept barking and I always wonder about what that actually means. Obviously you can't just say to a dog "that's not acceptable" and have them not do something, there has to be some kind of action to communicate what you do and don't want to the dog. Very easy going out & coming home isn't turned into a drama of giving treats,toys or anything that sets up a routine of them nowing. We work from home ,they have our attention all day every day BUT when we go out they know the its no big deal. There not greeted like its the last time they will ever see us again ,life is normal from day 1 through to old age . We create the bad habits & accept them until things go pear shaped ,i prefer to set them up from puppies & my dogs sleep on the bed . We get people who pick up there dosg from grooming ,just 2 hrs & when they collect them the owners go crazy making such a big deal out of being left,dogs bark,wet themselves & go bonkers then after a few mins it drives the owners crazy so then there telling them off . We will tell people hey its not the dogs fault that you encouraged a reaction then now its no fun its the dogs fault I wonder whether it is that easy when it comes to dogs that have a really strong barking instinct or tendency. I'm not saying I don't believe it is that easy, just that I genuinely don't know. My Sheltie is a BARKY dog. His first reaction to any stimulus at all is to bark and he's been like that since he learned to bark according to his breeder. She told me that in passing when I picked him up and not having had a barky dog before I didn't realise the implications. If left to his own devices he would seriously bark when he's excited, nervous, startled, waiting for food, playing with another dog, sees a bird, hears the wind, hears the neighbours gate, hears another dog, sees another dog/cat/horse/anything on tv, plays fetch, needs to go out to toilet, and sometimes apparently just because he hasn't said anything for a while. He has learnt a "shh" cue, he will 'hold it in' for food and treats because he's learnt I won't give him anything if he isn't quiet, he'll stop if i interrupt him with his name if he seems to be barking at nothing and he wears a citronella bark collar at home now so rarely barks there any more but the instinct is still there, he's just able to control it when asked now. I'd be very interested to start over with him (obviously i can't) now that I have a lot more knowledge and have experienced just what it's like to live with a really barky dog so would be very aware of what I was doing with him right from the beginning. I do definitely think it would make a big difference to have the dog from day 1. As I said, he was already a barker before he even came to me and although I expect I could have changed things if I'd gotten onto him just a bit earlier having him learn to bark and presumably be around other barking dogs initially put us behind the 8 ball I suspect.

Oh I've only just been pointed in the direction of this thread. I don't always look at Rainbow Brodge as its so sad but I wanted to offer my condolences Scootaloo. What a sad loss, thinking of you and your family I used Revolution on Quinn and Riley (Sheltie) before I knew much about MDR1 and have used it when I've spotted a flea or two since then, thinking it would be fine but you've cemented in my mind that I must do the sensitivity test ASAP, before they get any further treatments. Hopefully it's some small comfort that Robo's loss may save someone else by prompting us all to be extra diligent. Run free beautiful boy

Showdog, how do you teach them that barking is not accepted?

I think my family have given up on me finding a partner, and they've come to be quite relieved that I only have three dogs and not more :laugh: ETA - VM, I like the sound of the arrangement at your house :)

According to Terri's flow chart model, which I think is great, you could stop at the first 'No' - you don't need to take her. I think most dogs would be much happier at home in their own space than crated at someone else's house or in public with people or dogs approaching them. The idea of a crate is that the dog is in it's own quiet space, not having people rest their feet on the crate or other dogs pee on it while they are in there and can't get away. A reactive dog expecially would be much better safely at home where unpredictable things can't happen.

Something in macadamias is very toxic to dogs. I think other nuts are ok but they just pass through. Riley and Quinn stole a bag of blanched almonds once and had almond poops for the next few days. Yesterday I was eating pistachios and wouldn't give them any so Quinn pounced on the bowl of shells. I took as many as I could away but she crunched a few, I can't imagine they were very tasty! As far as fruits go, I give apple, pear, peach (cut off the stone). I keep meaning to try banana as I've heard so many dogs love it. They love carrot and often get a carrot as a chew treat instead of a rawhide. Denali, it's funny but green beans are about the only thing Quinn won't eat! She's a total garbage guts and even though last time I was snacking on green beans she kept asking for them when I gave them to her she'd chew a few times then spit them out :laugh:

Santa's looking very um... laid back :laugh:

Oh she's beautiful, look at that pretty face I have to say my dogs are the best therapy I've found for mental health issues, they give me a focus, relax me and make me smile :)

Better Late, I'm not sure exactly where they are but DOLers Cosmolo, Nekhbet and Erny are all trainers in Vic. I'm sure they'd be willing to recommend someone if they don't work in your area too. I expect K9 Pro know people in Vic also and would be happy to advise if you asked them :)

That sounds great Better Late :) definitely take your time to think about it but it sounds very exciting!

I agree Aussie, plenty of strays in ACT that would be pretty easily found if you were looking as well as quite a few where the owner is actually contacted but doesn't bother to turn up to collect it

It took me aaaages to remember what CAT stood for, it just wouldn't stick in my brain for some reason. BTW, it's Constructional Aggression Treatment.

Terri, sounds like Didi is improving I really like BAT, I think it's really useful and you should definitely keep it up but don't forget the idea is it is actually to teach the dog that they have options and can make their own decisions in situations that worry them. It will certainly increase her trust in you also but you want to make sure that she voluntarily performs a behaviour that is preferable to getting into reactive mode before you reward by moving away and reinforce with food or whatever other reward you're using. The timing is really tricky because you are looking for such a split second actions at first, like just glancing away from the stimulus for a moment but once you get the hang of it I think it's helpful. I know I've said before that you don' t generally want reactive dogs making decisions for themselves but as you progress and when you have that bond with the dog the next step is to start to teach them that they can make decisions but only certain appropriate decisions. So you give them back enough control to build their confidence but not enough to put themselves in negative situations where they resort to reacting like they are used to. Sorry, hope that all makes some sense!

That's a real shame. The ACT Companion Animals Act stipulates a 72 hour period between surrender and when the animal becomes the property of the organisation it's surrendered to.

I've just seen this too, so sorry huski. Run free little Cherry

Definitely a good idea to arrange some training with a good behaviourist straight up :) As we know, all dogs respond well to clear leadership from us but with reactive dogs especially it's vital. That doesn't mean being hard on them or proving you are "alpha" but it does mean being really consistent and alert to what's going on around the dog. Most are reactive because of either fear or a negative association with the things that trigger them and learning how to teach them to look to you to decide what they should do in every situation, build trust in them that you will keep them safe and conditioning more positive associations will be invaluable. Good luck Better Late, can't wait to hear how you go :)

Is there no legal requirement for a cooling off period after surrender in Vic?

I suspected the guy believed he had some right to the dog and that the neighbours had agreed with him and therefore let him in through their yard. The whole thing sounds like a mess. Poor Linc

I use the liquid stuff on Saxon, with his floppy, hairy ears. Squirt it in and squish it around. And also unscented baby wipes to wipe the pinna (outside skin bit) on all the dogs.

I liked those two too, and the puppy in the water bowl. The others, yeah no! There was some SERIOUS back off growling going on in some of those, and people putting their faces right in front of the dogs

Oh if I was in any position to take on a kitty I would be begging for Rambo He's such a dog lover, he'd be perfect for here. My guys love cats but are yet to live with one that actually wants to be friends with them. Quinn in particular loves kittens, she likes to mother them :)

Yep she is about 10cm taller at the shoulder, but he is 2 kg heavier, but has a lot less fur. He practically has no undercoat where as she is like a Malamute Oh cool. I think I'd assumed he was the bigger one in pics where they weren't obviously in boy or girl clothes before but I can tell them apart more now and noticed she seemed taller than him :)

Is Dee bigger than Zeph Grumpette?

Ok so it sounds like she may not be confident enough to react externally when he isn't there to support her. It could be having two different effects internally. It could be that with the choice taken away from her she is actually more relaxed - as in "well I can't fight these things that worry me so I may as well try and just accept them" Alternatively she could be feeling very uncomfortable and shutting down to some degree just waiting for the situation to be over. Either way I think it's a really good opportunity for you to condition a different mind set for her. So because she isn't in that over threshold exploding mind set you can actually get through to her and teach her some new associations and behaviours. You should be making all the decisions for her so she learns that whether Sonny is there or not you will be in charge of the situation and she does not need to make decisions for herself. Once she gets that you'll be better placed to stop her from reacting when Sonny is there and if she gains more confidence on her own. So lots of training stops during outings, you decide when she can stop and sniff and how long for, you decide that some dogs won't be approached at all, some you'll go near but keep walking and others you may greet but keep it super short, give her lots of positive feedback and food/toy rewards and you decide when to move on with a cheerful "let's go" or something before she has any negative experiences. You don't want her deciding for herself whether or not she interacts with other dogs whether its friendly or not, and you always want to be rewarding her in some way for following your lead. She should start to learn that you won't put her in dangerous situations and will get her out of things if necessary then start to trust you when you tell her she doesn't need to react :)

I'd suggest either she is more confident when Sonny is there and therefore more willing to react OR she is protective of Sonny and feels she has to defend him. Other option is that he actually stresses her so she's closer to threshold when he's around so it takes less to push her over. I know Riley has always been much less likely to react when he is at a distance from me and I believe it's because he's less confident when he's not near someone he knows will (in his mind) back him up. What is the interaction between the two of them usually like BCC?