tdierikx

So PR are warehousing animals in kennels too? What's the point in getting an animal out of the pound only to have it languish in kennels for an indeterminate length of time? Especially if the dogs would be far better off being given their wings due to issues that make them a danger to people and/or other animals... T.

dogmad - there is a little dog in HP listed as a Chi X that looks to me like it may have some Iggy in it - THSC21?? - it's the one that keeps getting its jumper/coat off right near where the public enters the kennel area. Sort of a salt and pepper greyish colouring. Sweet little thing... I saw it while I was there today - came up to the front of the kennel and licked my fingers and seemed to just want some cuddles. Pretty happy despite being in a pound and refusing to wear its jumpers. They do have lots of bedding in a bucket bed, so it won't freeze... T.

Just out of curiosity Jill, how much money have they offered you for taking the dog in question? And how much have they offered to the other place where there are kenneled dogs? PM would be fine... I think you have missed my point completely though... the odd gesture like they have offered to you are not regular occurrences - and this one in particular seems very much like a reaction to the current debate regarding their practices. It smacks of "shut up" money from this side of the fence... The fact that PR have the same or more access to the lists at HP that the rest of us have means that they can see exactly which dogs have saves on them. If I (who knows very little about the inner workings of HP) can find out exactly which group has put a save on which dog, then surely PR can do the same... yet they spruik many dogs already safe as being in grave danger of pts. It just seems a little odd that they have just now decided to offer one group (you) some money for one dog on the current list... what about all of the other dogs that have saves on them? T.

Marley and Me... or Red Dog... Both are written in such a way that it reminds us exactly why dogs are "man's best friend"... ... oh and any MIMS manual I can get my hands on... *grin* T.

Jill - just because they gave you some money for the dog you were already committed to taking, doesn't make them "good guys" in any sense of the word... It's in no way addressing the myriad of other issues raised in this and many other threads on the topic. PR have the same access to the pound as the rest of us - they can see which dogs are marked as safe - one phonecall or email to find out which group took them on is all it would take to then be able to forward any donations taken for the dog in question, yes? Once they have the name of the group taking the dog, then it's easy enough to find a contact number or email in order to offer the funds... but it ain't happening unless there is dissent in the ranks like this thread - and basically it looks like they are offering you money to stop being "against" them... and it also looks like it's working... One "right" deed certainly doesn't negate the many bad ones being done by this group in the name of "saving" dogs... If all they did was fundraise and provide ethical/actual help to other rescues, then they'd be a massive boon to the rescue community - let's face it, they are bloody good at that aspect of the game - but I simply cannot reconcile the occasional few dollars going where the donators think it's going with the immense harm they are doing to the rescue "brand" by their rehoming practices. T.

Yeeehaaaa! Go Rusty boy!!! Good things DO come to those who wait... *grin* T.

Until the rest of the stuff they are doing changes for the better, I wouldn't accept one red cent from them - no matter how much they offer. I would feel that it was "Judas" money. Successful rescue isn't measured by how many we can save/rehome, but by how well we do it. Getting a dog out of a Sydney pound, rehoming it irresponsibly interstate, and having it die in a different pound after it does damage to a person or other animal... just isn't rescue in any sense of the word. T.

Oh my!! Curly is certainly a stunning little chap, isn't he? They both look as cheeky as in the video... lol! T.

There are a couple of smaller rescues who have affiliated themselves with PR and are happily taking financial assistance from them Sheridan. Until their practices are amended though, no reputable and ethical rescue want to deal with them - and all criticism or questioning of said practices is met with bullying and intimidation... some on a rather frightening scale... The rescue community has worked long and hard to be recognised as a valid and viable source of a new pet for Joe Public... and PR's current tactics and practices can and will destroy that reputation for ALL rescue. Bad news travels a heck of a lot faster than good news... T.

I used to think crates were cruel... until I had occasion to need to use one... My dogs love theirs, and all my fosters are crate trained too. I wouldn't ever be without a few in different sizes now. T.

NOOOO!!!! Allowing them to "assist" you is affirming their legitimacy... I wouldn't accept anything from them until they start getting all the other things right with their practices. I know it's tempting to want to tap into their obviously huge money raising capabilities, but do we really want to climb onto that particular bandwagon? T.

... except the fact that the majority of rescues I know of can't agree on a common set of policies or procedures... *grin* T.

If PR are acting as middle man to potential adopters so they can get a dog out cheaper than normal pound sale cost - and that dog is picked up straight from the pound by said adopter without actually being handled by a PR member - who is ultimately liable if that dog then bites or attacks a person or another animal? You can bet your bottom dollar PR would be farming that sort of headache straight back to the pound... What I can't get my head around is the apparent lack of caring as to what happens to the animal once they've "saved" it from the pounds they are entrenched at - they really don't seem to understand the damage being done out there... to the people they are sending dogs to, or the actual dogs themselves who end up being dumped at other pounds or euthanaised due to their obvious issues (or acts). To our credit - the reputable rescue community are helping some of the people and animals out there who have been stung by PR's tactics... although I think PR probably see that help as proof of their own legitimacy... *sigh* In all honesty, I think that if the reputable rescues lend their assistance in the form of telling people who have been left high and dry exactly which authorities to go to about their dealings with PR, then we may see some action to stop them. If they are committing fraud in the form of taking monies with no accountability, then the Charities Dept or Dept of Racing and Gaming should be alerted (often) - if they are passing unsuitable animals on to unsuspecting adopters or foster carers and lying about said animals' temperaments, then NSW Fair Trading or CTTT would be the departments to go to, as we all must ensure that the "goods" we sell are of the quality advertised, etc... As for the intimidation tactics employed by PR and their hangers on - there are laws against some of the things I've heard them accused of... take screenshots of any online attacks, dates and times and names involved if the abuse is by phone, etc... and report the bastards to the Police. The time of circling the wagons is past... it's time to bring out the big guns and take the battle to them really... T.

Wei Nott? *grin* T.

I shouldn't have watched that.... it's a bit distressing... ... but agree that it was the quickest and most effective course of action the cop could take at the time. T.

Does HP desex before release? Or does rescue get them undesexed and the onus is on them to desex? Just wondering about the animals whisked off interstate so rapidly - are they desexed first by PR or not? T.

How do they do desexing and vaccination, worming etc for $150? I'd be theorising that maybe it isn't done at all in many cases... T.

Maybe not Nic... think PIAA and their "accredited" pet shops, kennels, etc... Policy looks great on paper only... T.

Theoretically, every time a pound releases an animal to anyone, the liability for it if it causes carnage is theirs. PR are banking on this fact - especially if they are sending new owners directly to the pound to pick up the animal they are purchasing through PR. Nice little money spinner for PR by the way - in most cases they are getting the animal from the pound for little money or nothing in some cases, then charging new owners for it and having said new owners pick up straight from the pound. As for the animals being sent interstate - where is the backup for new owners or "foster carers" when said animal is not desexed, and they can't get PR to follow through on that either? From what I can see, all PR do when contacted about issues with a rehomed (or "fostered") dog is give the contact details of some other rescue groups to ask for assistance. That - or they delete any references from their Facebook pages and pretend everything is all sweetness and light. Seriously, the only way I can see PR being slowed down at all is for one of the pounds they source dogs from to be sued by a disgruntled recipient of an unsuitable animal. That would make the pound a lot less inclined to work with PR due to possible "splash back" when the poo hits the fan. Unfortunately it may also have the effect of said pound stopping it's association with ALL rescue. Once bitten and all that... *sigh* Regulation of rescue isn't going to solve the issue either - there's virtually no policing of current laws and statutes, so adding new laws and statutes would really be pointless IMHO. T.

Spot on there Panto! T.

Hmmm... we have a couple of pups that may fit the bill... Matilda ia a Kelpie and is about 4 months old, and Ty is Kelpie/BC/Aussie/ACD and 3 months... probably a bit younger than what you are looking for, but both are crate trained and play nice with others. We also have Lola (I call her Shadow) - a black Labrador cross (possibly a smidge of Kelpie) who is 5 months old. Also crate trained and plays well with others. Then there is Pumpkin - looks like an ACD/Corgi cross and has blue eyes - very energetic and willing to please - she is about 9 months old. T.

I hope the person who bought the dog from PR takes legal action against Melanie Norman, this could be one way for her to be investigated and stopped from doing what she is doing. Maree CPR The problem here is that the pound released said dog to the "rescue" (read PR) - PR would legally pass the buck to the council/pound for releasing the dog in the first place. What PR are offering the pounds is something that impacts favourably on their kill stats... WE all know that those unsuitable animals eventually end up in some other council area to be destroyed (in many cases interstate), but I'm not sure that the pounds that are working closely with PR are seeing that far down the track - it's only THEIR OWN stats that they are focusing on - and until someone higher up the food chain makes a complaint, I don't see things changing very much in the near future. Maybe the DLG might be interested in checking up on PR's activities - there will be a huge number of animals that have been released under PR's 16D - can PR authenticate exactly where all of those dogs have been sent? All the DLG need to do is an audit of PR's 16D releases... T.

The pound is happy to allow listings here on DOL... but PR keep taking the photos and using them on their Facebook pages and adding false "temp notes" to them - then asking donations for said dogs. T.

What a smart boy! Was that his first time with the Brick? T.

The general thinking from these cowboy types is that the ethical established groups aren't doing it fast enough... dogs are dying in the pounds while they wait for ethical groups to "save" them... didn't you know that by now? (tongue firmly in cheek with that last comment) Does anyone know how the PR process works? Does the new "foster carer" (let's cut through the crap and just call them the new owner, shall we) pay PR any money for the dogs they are given? What liability does the pound have when placing "reclaim/rescue only" dogs? If that dog goes on to harm humans or other animals, who is legally then at fault? A case could be made by any decent lawyer that the responsibility is that of the council/pound for releasing an animal that had those tendencies - at least that's what PR would assert if legally challenged on that point. Pounds also have the ability to exercise discretion over who they release animals to - 16D or not. A 16D does not automatically mean that the pound HAS to release animals to a group. The fact that other established and ethical rescues are increasingly being called upon to help clean up the messes made by PR - not to mention the evidence showing that people are being sent unsuitable animals willy-nilly, often to areas that are not tolerant of the breed types being sent there, and in a few cases ending up with the animals being euthanaised in interstate pounds, etc... kind of indicates that this group is not one the pounds should be wanting to have a close relationship with. I can see the attraction from the councils for working with PR - lets face it, they are getting a lot of dogs out of the pounds they are using to date - and the councils' "rehoming rate" is looking better... not to mention that they are having to dispose of less animals after euthing them, etc. What attraction is in it for them if they stop releasing animals to groups like PR? If PR are sending large numbers of dogs interstate, by the time problems arise, they are then the responsibility of some other council area, right? Make no bones about it - PR have obviously thought out their plans/strategy very well, and it's probably going to be extremely hard to slow them down, let alone stop them. What I don't understand is how they reconcile all the bad things that have happened to date - when they purport to care so much about the fate of animals in pounds. It's almost as if the only goal is to get animals out of a couple of Sydney pounds - with no thought about their fate once out of those pounds... very strange!! T.