Cosmolo

Yep- sorry Kelpie i, totally my fault saying one thing in my head and typing something different. Interesting discussion nonetheless! I am yet to see one of the dogs, the other we are dealing with genetic predisposition to sep anxiety but the dogs are well managed now without drugs but with some natural supplements, and plenty of exercise and mental stimulation amongst other things! Drugs were discussed too but not necesary at this stage. Not a rescue dog and high level anxiety unfortunately. Agree with your last sentence Kelpie i

I wonder about the effects with dogs that are reactive outside the home vs sep anxiety? The reduction in stress/ stress hormones would occur if i kept my reactive dog at home because i am removing the trigger for the responses that lead to the stress. But how does this help sep anxiety of the owner still leaves the house- therefore the trigger is still present and responses could be heightened due to the increase in energy/ lack of stimulation?

Oops- yes my mistake, my brain thought i had written it! In both cases it has been separation anxiety, will edit now

Thanks Kelpie i. I understand those concepts but what confuses me is how to apply them to pure and raw separation anxiety- not general anxiety if that makes sense? And if we did that- wouldn't we just be switching from physical to mental stimulation because it would be mentally stimulating to the dog to be taught how to switch from brain to brain? Therefore different to eliminating all exercise? Nanna- i think thats great information and would definitely help with dogs that are reactive when out and about. But surely if applying the theory to separation anxiety, that would require the owner to not leave the house for a week rather than eliminating exercise for the week?

ML- yes i think thats the theory. I'm just not sure why mental stimulation would not be suggested to tire the dog rather than no exercise. With the dogs who i know have tried it, it creates unbearable activity levels and an increase in anxiety in the short term- the owners give up after a week or so because the dog has been so much worse and so out of control. I think its different if the dog who's being exercised is engaging in drive activities and has other problems that relate to the same drive if you know what i mean.

Can you explain Jules P? Genuinely interested- i have spelled horses before, is that sort of what you mean? I had a horse with general anxiety and spelling him and 'letting him be a horse' was helpful (until i started to work him again lol) but bit different from separation anxiety. Instruction was clearly no physical exercise, not no off leash or no ball throwing etc. No walks or jogging with owner- dogs in question were also well behaved on walks so there was no anxiety issue or high arousal levels on walks. ETA in all cases- dogs behaviour has worsened considerably

Yes that is what the title says I have heard a theory a few times now (re told to me by clients who were told by another trainer) relating to reducing/ eliminating an anxious dogs exercise so that they don't get too fit. The suggestion is that owners (with their highly anxious dogs) cease all exercise for minimum 2 weeks and then resume in in small doses infrequently. Does anyone else think this is crazy? Or can anybody explain the logic behind it as i may be wrong and it may be a great tool? Mental stimulation was not discussed in any of these examples so the reduced physical exertion is not being replaced in whole or part by games/ tricks/ obedience etc. ETA- referring to separation anxiety, not general anxiety

Does anyone know of anyone in Melbourne that has experience in training alert dogs (not Assistance dogs) Skills such as responding to panic attacks, preventing self harm etc would be whats required.

As i said, i don't use the e collar stim before the command as i don't want the stim to become the command and i believe it limits how much you can teach. If you use the stim in advance for 2 different commands i think you can create confusion and a little unnecesary stress. I also think its more likely to create a velcro dog indefinitely. JMO

When do you apply the stim? I know some people do it before the comand is given, i always do it after the command. The idea is to teach the dog that the stim occurs when there is non compliance to a command- not just when the dog is away from you. Thats why its important to reward the dog for being away from you when they are doing things you want them to be able to do- sniffing, playing etc. I have never had a dog after e collar training not leave my side (or owners side) as thats not my aim. I find it normal for dogs to get slightly sticky for a short period of time until they learn that other behaviours away from you are also fine. I have had the same thing happen when using other techniques (without aversives) so this is not exclusive to e collars or aversives.

Congrats on your pup! We do run puppy school at PETstock South Melbourne. I am not sure of any in Newport or Port Melbourne.

A) Give it time, some dogs do become sticky to start but in my experience this doesn't last long B) Make sure she wears the collar at other times when you're not training C) Do some sessions where you give no commands and don't make each situation predictable, ie- practice recalls in different situations and remove or change the predictors of the command where possible- eg the tie out for sit etc- remove or do a totally different exercise on the tie out for 1 week. Do you have a release word?

Thats great Kelpie i. I have been doing puppy school at one for a few years and had dealings with a few others that were a bit different.

Maybe they have changed but i know that some stores did not insist on formal qualifications previously.

I know some- not all of the trainers are NDTF qualified

Thanks for the info- any idea why?

Not sure about that one but most of them are run by trainers from Righteous Pups

Please don't use a halti for a lunging dog- if you don't know how to use it correctly you could end up damaging your dogs neck. Talk to the instructors at obedience- they can see whats actually happening and try to come up with a strategy to suit you and your dog. Alot will come down to your handling and timing so regardless of the training equipment you use, you'll need to be shown how to use it correctly.

Have the obedience instructors suggested a particular method? What have you tried already? What equipment do you walk/ train her on?

have pm'd you

Hi Paul What is WRK- is it a wholesaler, do they have a shop front? Do you have a contact number for them? I contacted masterpet but you need to have a shop front to be able to buy anything from them, which we don't have

Thanks Monelite- thats great. didn't realise there were other brands of german made chains. So hesitant to try others without knowing they are just as good! Thanks ETA do they have a website?

Crazy puppy- in all honesty, no matter what you do you're going to wonder if you did the right thing so if you are comfortable with the decision (and i know you've done plenty of research and reading) go for it. From all of us here- we wish you the best and hope Max has a speedy recovery. Please keep us updated. One question- what have they old you the recovery entails? Will he need to be crated? Days/ weeks/ months?

Our regular supplier has just discountinued the sprenger chains. Can anyone let me know a good place to get them from- preferably wholesale? We will be buying in bulk and don't want to pay retail prices for them. Thanks in advance!

I think those icons sum it up..