Steve

And In addition, the minimum of one staff member (includes any staff member including proprietor, operations manager and animal attendants)must be onsite at the business for every 100 fertile animals (or equivalent)housed in the business overnight. For example, 80 females, 5 males, 10 litters with their mothers and 5 litters without their mothers is equivalent to 100 fertile adults and requires one full-time staff member overnight. Theoretically it could be up to 100 litters per one staff over night! = Up to 1200 counted as 100!

That's what happens when a COP is written by a pencil pusher who has never managed breeding animals. And they tell us its for the dogs - what a joke.

Do the sums - could be hundreds equivalent to 25 fertile animals. The minimum of one full-time staff member (includes any staff member including proprietor, operations manager and animal attendants)must be onsite at the business for every 25 fertile animals (or equivalent)housed in the business during business hours. The staffing ratio must be maintained 7 days per week. A single fertile animal equivalent is: • any animal over the age of 16 weeks • a litter and its mother while the litter remains housed with its mother • a litter no longer residing with its mother, but under the age of 16 weeks. For example, 14 females, 3 males, 6 litters residing with their mothers, and 2 litters without their mothers is equivalent to 25 fertile animals and require one full-time staff member during business hours. This would be over 100 dogs on the property at any given time and counted as only 25 if they were a breed like a Maremma that has a dozen a litter!

In my experience its a heritable factor. Yes you can have every pup in a litter with one.

Yep but I don't think they are even close to getting it. Poor dogs.

O.k. Ive sent you off two samples but they are custom blends based on what you have said about your dog Ive used all natural ingredients but steered away from flower parts - stuck with roots and bark instructions on how to use included. Good luck and let me know how it goes.

prime example - bet he is feeding them out of bowls too. http://www.dolforums.com.au/topic/259842-no-permits-for-puppy-farm/

It also seems that the dogs were removed back in July and recent raids confirmed only 4 dogs were there - 3 fertile - looks like he may not even need a permit anyway. that appears to be how he is complying.

He only had 9 adult dogs on his property - makes you realise that making everyone only have ten isnt going to stop people like this. http://www.geelongadvertiser.com.au/news/geelong/animals-seized-in-farm-raid-at-little-river-as-owner-vows-to-stop-breeding-dogs/story-fnjuhovy-1227090900428

The RSPCA said the property did not appear to meet thestandards of a breeding facility, but that no violations under animal crueltylaws had been identified. It did find minor health problems. Authorities attended the puppy farm last year afterreceiving a tip-off, but it has continued to operate, with puppies advertisedonline this year as being of ''show quality''. The RSPCA and council officers attended again in May.Despite the council initially confirming it was investigating the property for''not having the appropriate permits ... and failing to comply with therequired code of practice'', last month it said the property had ''fullycomplied'' with regulations. The council has refused to say how it complied or whether further action would be taken. Wonder how the age got to see the RSPCA vet report? No point in having the laws if they dont police them and use what they can to prosecute - hard to follow them.

http://www.theage.com.au/victoria/puppy-farm-owner-to-be-prosecuted-after-raid-20141014-115uka.html http://www.theage.com.au/victoria/illegal-puppy-farm-continued-to-operate-despite-reports-to-rspca-wyndham-council-20140617-zs9lx.html http://www.theage.com.au/victoria/diseased-injured-dogs-rescued-from-puppy-farm-20140721-zt6x3.html

Just saw that ad - they have a member number in it too. might be good to dob em in tomorrow.

Its Dogs SA .

Look I really think these guys are in for some big shocks and if they do last the distance it’s going to be tough and slow. For me much of what they say shows a lack of knowledge and naivety. It’s also contradictory but will fill a niche market especially when what is being planned behind the scenes with animal welfare is put into action in the next 12 months. Personally I’d rather see breeders who think this way in their own group rather than operating on their own with no third party accountability or staying in a CC and breaching the codes until they get caught. No point for me in someone ticking all of the boxes, getting a vet to look at your property once a year, showing or any other activity and breeding any dogs regardless of what your goals are etc – with or without papers - if a major part of it isn’t about how they feel about the dogs they own, their base philosophies and what they are and are not prepared to compromise on. One thing that you can absolutely be sure of with a purebred is that what is required to own it and live with it and manage it is predictable. Without a standard or mating one purebred to a different breed it’s difficult to see how anyone would think that this is showing that a breeder cares about the survival and protection of a breed. The other is that purebred breeders are not supposed to be only interested in the outcome for the dogs in a current litter. Their interests and goals include how what they breed today will impact on what comes later for generations long after they pack up their whelping boxes. People who buy my puppies know that I use a registered pedigree to help me select and keep records on what I’m breeding to try to avoid things I can’t test for and to focus on what is best for my dogs and their breed. They know that their registered pedigree isn’t just a record of who the ancestors are but an indication that for generations the people breeding them gave a toss for what they are taking home in their arms today. What I do and think is different to them and it’s a good opportunity for us to say so and explain why. We don’t need to say they are wrong or get involved in having to make them look bad or defending ourselves. It’s just not what we do because we don’t think its what is best for the dogs or any breed into the future.

Yes but that's happening now because the councils are ticking off on them - and by approving them legitimising them and making them appear ethical - its nothing to do with a bit of paper to say who the parents were.

Its not up to the buyer - in Australia you cant represent something you are selling as something its not.

Yep I wish - its about bloody time.

yep Shame shame shame

But why does it have to be they will mislead people - surely when a breeder sells a pup they have to represent them for what they are anyway.

Mine do. Sadly, as you know, you're the exception that proves the rule. Not any more - lots of breeders and owners are registering their dogs with us from here and other countries including yours in order to do exactly that.

ROFL - well, the Wegies do come in all sorts of colours And they do tend to think they're dogs :D . There are registries for cats that may be able to help. Some encourage new breeds and have registries for experimental breedings etc. Sorry, Steve - that was a private joke. AFAIK RJ's cat is a registered purebred (with the main 'official' registry - as mine are :laugh:

ROFL - well, the Wegies do come in all sorts of colours And they do tend to think they're dogs :D . There are registries for cats that may be able to help. Some encourage new breeds and have registries for experimental breedings etc.

I think they are about to get a fast education and embark on a steep learning curve. They have made assumptions which will soon be proven wrong. They are no threat to ANKC registered breeders and their dogs.

Most pedigrees including ANKC pedigrees list the breed of every dog in the pedigree.

you have to understand that anyone can and many do provide pedigree papers for mutts - this is simply a third party offering accountability and registering the pedigree just as you register the birth of a child with a third party regardless of its heritage.