asal

There were no DNA tests completed on any of the dogs. The parents must have passed the visual identification and there was a stat dec completed by the parents owner/"breeder" stating the dogs breeds. exactly, and parentage verification is recognised world wide. so clearned parents, meant parentage verification proved beyond all let alone 'reasonable doubt" that they were NOT pit bulls. the failure of even the vets involved to tell the owners and breeder of theses pups this is tragic. no way they should have been put down.

I think people are only now realising that the Vic legislation isn't about whether a dog is a pitbull or not - dogs are deemed restricted based on how they look, regardless of parentage. The fact that these dogs aren't pitbulls means nothing according to the law. The ONLY exception being pedigreed Amstaffs (so, under the law, if you have a pedigreed SBT that met the checklist your dog could be seized and put down too). The sad irony of this all is that people will soon learn to hide their bull breed dogs, not take them out and socialise them (for fear of getting them seized) and we'll land up with more unsocialised, dangerous dogs. I do not understand what you just said? are you saying if a dog is already registered as a Amstaff it is safe. but if your dog is a pedigreed staffodshire bull terrier, that is deemed to look like a pit bull? it can be seized and put down? was only speaking to a lady recently whose child was mauled at a show by an Amstaff and still undergoing surgery years later for the damage inflicted, not counting the mental damage to a young child now terrified of any bull looking breed. I remember when the first Pit's and ?Amstaff's? arrived on our shores, especially remember seeing ads for dual registered Amstaffs/pit bull's available for stud and sale in america. It was pretty obvious to even one who had never seen either in the flesh, in america they are one and the same. This lady told me she firmly believes the same thing. I am constantly amazed how many people i meet who tell me their dog is a staffie and blind freddy can see there isnt a drop of staffie in their pittie. ive know staffies since i was a kid they are as different as chalk and cheeze to a pitti and or an amstaff. think i need to now don flamesuit. considering how many aussies think they are not the one breed with two interchangable lables. spotted this add for a kennel,, note size and breeds suitablbe for Deluxe wooden dog kennel house [small dog] Was: $149.99 Now: $109.99 Code: PWH113a Suitable for small dogs such as Staffordshire bull terriers, Beagles, Japanese spitz etc. Please contact us on 02-90299385 to find out when new stock is coming in yet i bought a Large sized one, second hand from a chap who explained his staffy had grown to large for it. my heart missed a terrified beat when i met his "staffy"??? Yes he was cute and goofy, but when he can stand and look you just about in the eye? an english staffie??????????????????????????? last I looked there is a huge difference in length of leg (let alone sheer size) between Amstaff/Pitty's and the "real", short legged, much smaller English Staffies Deluxe wooden dog kennel house [Large dog] Was: $199.99 Now: $159.99 Code: PWH113c Suitable for large sized dogs such as German shephreds, Rottweilers etc. Availability: IN STOCK

I am very puzzled in that earlier it states the owner of the parents verified they bred the two pups and the parent are not considered to be pit bulls? surely then why wasnt the opportunity taken to dna verify the parentage of the two dogs? they did not need to be a test for pit bull even if one was available. what they did have was the fact the parents were deemed to not be pit bull, therefore parentage verification is a proven reliable test. why was that not done? no way the council could have put them down with a proven parentage dna test????? i do not understand didnt anyone tell the puppies owners that this is a hundred percent accurate test? fathers are doing paternity testing on their children these days so they dont discover they are paying to raise some one elses child.. knew a chap who discovered years down the track only one of 'his' three children was actualy his.. not a happy camper at all. if its valid for humans it is just as valid for dogs. no australian stud book throughbred 'ASB'can be registed until its first been parentage verified. these dogs should have been done and thus saved..... as i said...why were their owners not told?

my suspicion, pup for starters isnt 'tiny' its at least 12 weeks or more...thats a seriously long set of legs. the adult has played this game before and knows whats expected. looking how long the muzzle is doesnt look like that dogs pup but a different breed or x

ok? so without using a calculator on average the numbers bred has just about halved between 1986 to 1211? despite the actual available wanting a pet to have, population just about doubling?

Steve thinks it's unlikely as his behaviour was quite good the whole time, but he can't be 100% sure. Okay, makes you wonder though doesn't it. A dog that was quite a bit older when he showed aggression, then within 12 months has to be euthed due to his symptoms. RIP Buster, thank goodness you had a chance. that rings a bell with us. we had a border collie that suddenly, just had to get out. like climbing a 7 foot fence and attacking passers by. never actually bit but certainly charging and snapping at them. then came home one day and he was out again, went for me and didnt recognise me till i yelled at him. then he stopped and just stood there as if uttlerly confused. took him to the vet and he found a tumour, he put him down as he considered he would become increasingly dangerous as a result. cant remember his age, we were teens at the time so suspect around 10.

LOL somehow i dont think opening the door was the inten of his/her game. the object was to catch the kong on the handle so he could play tug of war with it. one smart doggie thats for sure.. he was sure wondering why the door opened though

thats not "just reality" IT IS REALITY. gee i would totlly freak if my child brought me home a nicely rotting carcase after she had rolled in it?

A vet is a business like anything else and there are plenty of businesses who can't legally charge when the job is unsuccessful and have to absorb their losses, why is a vet exempt from the same rules of business is what people are referring to? But what is 'successful'? To me, successful is doing what the owner requests. If you take an animal that has been hit by a car to the vet and ask them to do everything they can, which they do but the animal doesn't make it, surely they have done what was asked of them, by giving whatever treatment they possibly could at the time? One has to be realistic in that nothing lives forever. So to say that you shouldn't have to pay if the Vet was unsuccessful in keeping an animal alive is crazy. LOL never forget taking our dog neiger to the vets after a horse had kicked his head in. we were so shocked we certainly left him there in the belief the only option was putting him down. imagine the shock when the next day a thrilled vet phoned to say.eurika we saved him...2 hours picking bone fragments out of his head and a hole the size of a 20 cent piece. he lived another 8 happy years before developing a tumour. there are many wonderful vets. even downright amazing ones. dont forget that

wouldnt anyone wanting to import a neddy be flocking for only 1,800 delivered from england to australia? how many people remember if its too good to be true....it aint

Cameroon. eh? wonder if it was the same chap who was selling 16 hand black fresian gelding free to good home. all you have to pay was the shipping. only wanted 1,800 for shipping from england to australia. a forum spotted the add and after stringing him along some puter wizz worked outfrom what ive no idea. he wasnt in australia and wanted his darling rehomed in his new wonderfull country as he said. his computer was in where? cameroon lol when he was asked how was the weather in cameroon never replied to anymore emails re the giveaway

was taking out some cold broccoli and cauliflower for the chooks. or so i thought. Phil took one sniff and ate the lot :laugh:

I was moving mats today so who has to jump on as Im pulling it along? wondered why it was getting so heavy. all up i had 3 passengers enjoying the ride :laugh:

excellent point. AND a few reminders that they do regular inspections themselves whenever a complaint is made and have for decades.... I dont see that has ever been mentioned for the public to be aware of either. these are points that need to be out there... not kept inhouse. so that only registered breeders know. public perception is being manipulated by the anti lobbyist and so far our leaders have not been very vocal in reminding them and the press what they REALLY do do. asal, this last sentence makes no sense whatsoever. Please explain. That Dogs NSW. (for example) if they receive a complaint about any breeder send out a representative to inspect their dogs and how they are kept. How many people think this is only done by the rspca or animal welfare??? If a breeder did fail the inspection they can be told if not fixed in a defined time their membership can be cancelled. In the case of an animal welfare group you have 2 weeks to rectify the problem or face prosecution. I read that in the Newsletter the RSPCA publishes itself, in the Winter Edition of 1999 a lady was charged for not fleaing her dog during the two weeks she was given to rectify the problem. and was charged and convicted. I read it while i waited for them to bring in Stringy for me to take back home after his 13 days of testing for conditons he didnt have. for not complying with whatever he was seized over in the 2 weeks between the no information visit and seizing him 2 weeks later. Interesting to say the least that a lady who had a flea smothered dog was left still in charge of said dog and told to flea it yet i was told nothing whatsoever when i was inspected. As I keep saying like a broken record. you cant fix what you dont know is broken. as it was my dog had been fleaed only 48 hours before he was seized and according to their list of costs included flea treatment for dog that certainly had no fleas when he was taken and could have had serious adverse effects with a second dose on such a small 1.2 kg dog. I know after a altercation with another breeder, they rang all of them on a fortnightly basis for something like 6 months, in the end even the rspca said one more call and we will be charging them with stalking. dont know if they were told the same thing, but the complaints stopped, certainly learned how the system worked. one of the reasons i knew instantly when insp donnelly rolled up a few years later and refused to tell me what the complaint was, that he was breaking the law then and there, then when leaving just as determined not to tell me anything he thought needed improving or if he was satisfied or not. you cant fix whats broken if you cant find out can you? so I knew before he left that day I was being set up. for exactly what did happen. Although it was stressful being stalked by that other person, they did do me a favour in that as a result i knew how the system is supposed to work.

spotted on another forum (Quote) Found Female Cairn terrier Will be taking vet tomorrow. To check if microchiped If you are the owner Please describe dog And will give contact number to dog owner. Someone must own this lovely dog. The people who found her took her to vets today. She's not microchipped nor been desexed. She ever has exscaped from home or even out of car or ute. She is a young dog, very happy at finders place. Please if you know anyone who's lost a cairn terrier or similar please post with description of dog. I'm happy to say this young girl owners have been found. It's believed she escaped yard as inappropriate fencing was up. Owners will rectify. (Quote) now I wonder why I suspect it was not bred by a registered breeder.

I was reading a statics of australia. we have over 23,019,000 million people in this country as at 1st Jan 12. and as steve said there are only 4,500 odd registered purebred dog owners in this country. That mean that only 0.02% of the population are mebers of their Canine councle. just because some 4,500 people are registered members of all the state canine bodies does not mean they all breed, many are members because they want to show. or are thinking of breeding. some are members because they used to breed and or show and like to keep getting their newsletters. I remember there used to be a yearly list of how many puppies were registered in any given year. anyone know where these figures can be accessed? How many million dogs and cats does the rescues say they get every year? Somehow it doesn't seem to be of interest the attacks re legistation are being aimed at what was already a minority group and now is nearing extiction as others are suggesting. ? I causes one to wonder why there is such focus on the minority.

yes many breeds are incrediably good at it not just great danes. we discovered our border collie x (i suspect) kelpie could track anyone we set him too purely by accident. mum was asking where my brother was and scamp got so excited he began wining to us to follow him and he led us straight to him... we discovered we could name whoever he knew and he would nose down follow them regardless of where they had gone. it was only a step from that to show him a scent and ask him to follow. we had a ball with that dog. gave hide and seek a whole new dimension.

excellent point. AND a few reminders that they do regular inspections themselves whenever a complaint is made and have for decades.... I dont see that has ever been mentioned for the public to be aware of either. these are points that need to be out there... not kept inhouse. so that only registered breeders know. public perception is being manipulated by the anti lobbyist and so far our leaders have not been very vocal in reminding them and the press what they REALLY do do.

I learned that you can address mail to, the chairman and directors at [email protected] and received this reply "Thank you for your correspondence below which will be placed on the agenda for the Board’s consideration at their meeting 11 April 2012. Regards " so folks who else is going to get cracking?

if its worth a thread could some one else do it? i did swear i was giving this up. it makes me sick to my stomach remembering and knowing how vuneralbe we all still are. think 12 years of trying its someone elses turn to shoot for the stars as impossible it still seems to achieve

This seems a bit OT for this thread? some one suggested a petiton of our own... im suggesting one requesing its about time re the the issue of NO avenue of appeal even after over 12 years of such power was already in place in 1999 and before. that is a very loooong time lag

"as for the "nothing to fear from" "as outlined in the Code of Practice etc" none of the 21 needle insertions or tests conducted were for even one single condition that breeched said Code of practice? so how does such adherance protect in that instance.....NONE whatsoever." every one of which came back with a negative.

Although it might be a very good idea to copy and print this letter. for the next time someone finds a really true case and is told "there is nothing they can do, the law as it stands has their hands tied" this letter clearly states, all the inspector has to do is "decide" n its all over red rover. to quote someone else.

read the above and take careful note. the lack of communication referred to is the fact that the owner was NEVER told the nature of the complaint. until this letter arrived some two years and many letters after the event. when an inspector arrives you have two weeks to fix the problem. you cannot fix something if the inspector will not tell you what it is. but if it is not done in the required 2 weeks they then can seize whatever has not been fixed. as for the "without proper records" the inspector was given the vets name, number and address but chose never to contact the dogs vet before seizure. as for the "nothing to fear from" "as outlined in the Code of Practice etc" none of the 21 needle insertions or tests conducted were for even one single condition that breeched said Code of practice? so how does such adherance protect in that instance.....NONE whatsoever. wheres your petition folks? whose next? as it stands if you try to stop them taking or in Ruth Daltons case try to stop them the police office told to restrain can get a medal for doing his duty in a dangerous situation. no avenue of appeal, no one you can call for a seond opinion...not even the dogs nsw liason office Alan Candlish could find out the nature of the complaint during the two weeks he tried and failed to get an answer.. from where we stook the was no lack of communication on our side. as Mr Amery seems to be suggesting in his letter?

Minister for Agriculture Minister for Land and Water Conservation (99541) Dear Ms H 14 JUN 2001 Thank you for your letter of 30 April 2001 regarding the seizure of your dog ‘Stringy’ by the RSPCA. This whole incident has clearly been distressing for you. However, it would seem that the appearance of your dog breeding establishment and several of your animals attracted the attention of at least one other breeder who was concerned about the reputation of the industry, the conduct of your business and the welfare of some of your dogs. The RSPCA is obliged to investigate genuine complaints regarding animal welfare and to pursue what they believe to be the most reasonable course of action given the circumstances. You indicated that two dogs appeared to be in less than satisfactory condition. Without proper records of your own or your veterinarian, showing that Stringy was under veterinary care, the inspectors could only rely on their own judgement. In this case Inspector Donnelly decided that Stringy’s best interests would be served by a proper veterinary examination and diagnostic work up at the RSPCA shelter. Whilst this whole incident has been aggravated by an unfortunate sequence of events and poor communication on both sides, I see no need for continuing bitterness over this issue. Springy has been returned and has now undergone a proper diagnostic work up, you have not been charged with any offences, and as a gesture of good will the RSPCA has removed kennel charges from your bill I do not feel that the RSPCA has acted outside the law or unreasonably in this matter. If you conduct your business as outlined in the Code of Practice for dog breeding establishments you will have nothing to fear from further visits from RSPCA inspectors. Thanks you for expressing your concerns. Yours sincerely RICHARD AMERY MP MINISTER FOR AGRICULTURE MINISTER FOR LAND AND WATER CONSERVATION LEVEL 17 “PARKVIEW” 157 LIVERPOOL STREET SYDNEY NSW 2000 AUSTRALIA PO BOX K220 HAYMARKET 1240 AUSTRALIA TELEPHONE 02 9372 0123 FACSIMILE 02 9372 0199 INTERNET http://www.minister.agric.nsw.gov.auEMAIL-ministers.office@agric.nsw.gov.au