asal

It isn't just the animal rights people though. A lot of breeders seem want to foster attitude that you can't breed on anything other than a small scale and do it well. When I have said on this forum that there is a place for good, ethical, registered breeders breeding sound, healthy, typey pure bred puppies for companion homes - testing them occassionally in the show ring but without the show ring being the whole point of breeding - it has been breeders on here who have howled me down and said I support puppy farmers and am anti registered breeder. I have found as much dispute amongst the registered breeder community on this issue as within the broader community. So no, it isn't time I did any such thing. All the DoL breeders have managed to do for me on the issue is cause confusion, I'm not going to be answering any call to arms from them any time soon. yes the majority of leaders of the unethical kill squads tend to be liddle old ladies with a small number. they THINK their shit dont stink and anyone who dont fit their mould needs to be eradicated and are too self possessed to twig they too are in the kill list once the dogs of war are unleashed as they too cant guarantee they will never get a problem pup so bingo.....unethical after all but hey no sheep in to top paddock so no hope of getting through to them n think about it, how many dog breeders even rate a bitch by her ability to self whelp AND raise her pups herself? so few even give that a thought so many generations of ceasered pups that a vet on the payroll is a must for so many breeds now, is that really on the ethical radar? used to be considered important to the early breeders but then there wasnt a vet at nearly every interesction like today. but what about those out west of the divide??? any bitch sold that direction from such breeding is facing an uncertain future unless desexed. detest the garden knome but that was one point it raised i agree with

It isn't just the animal rights people though. A lot of breeders seem want to foster attitude that you can't breed on anything other than a small scale and do it well. When I have said on this forum that there is a place for good, ethical, registered breeders breeding sound, healthy, typey pure bred puppies for companion homes - testing them occassionally in the show ring but without the show ring being the whole point of breeding - it has been breeders on here who have howled me down and said I support puppy farmers and am anti registered breeder. I have found as much dispute amongst the registered breeder community on this issue as within the broader community. So no, it isn't time I did any such thing. All the DoL breeders have managed to do for me on the issue is cause confusion, I'm not going to be answering any call to arms from them any time soon. yes the majority of leaders of the unethical kill squads tend to be liddle old ladies with a small number. they THINK their shit dont stink and anyone who dont fit their mould needs to be eradicated and are too self possessed to twig they too are in the kill list once the dogs of war are unleashed as they too cant guarantee they will never get a problem pup so bingo.....unethical after all but hey no sheep in to top paddock so no hope of getting through to them

Recently hubby and I purchased a Show Puppy, my mother was horrified that we werent getting her desexed, she accused us of wanting to breed her to make money off her suffering and pain. In her eyes people who breed any dog deserve to be hung drawn and quartered. I asked her where do you think your pet came from??? A cornflake packet????? Needless to say she did not like my comment and I did try to get her to see reason but as hubby says...someone let the gate open in the top paddock and let all the sheep out. so you might as well bang your head against a brick wall for all the good my reasoning did. She still thinks that we will be churning out puppy litters galore and that hubby and i will be rich. see, you mum is being ethical. and theres an awful lot of sheep no longer in the "top paddock" anymore

n there u have it in a nutshell. the ethicals with one brood are not the people who make the real contribution to a breed it is the people like your friend and they will no longer be permitted, it is comming , really it has come. and this thread alone proves it

exactly. been through the mill recently re that "show" pup. gee 8 weeks its spot on. 8 months the rest of the dogs great like two challenges. BUT the adult bottom teeth come in slanting forward n it wasnt the "general public" telling the owner who "has shown for decades" another breed. that blue papers mean guarantee its going to be showable n make champion n to get her money back. n one of the rat pack told me, never sells a MR until its adults are through and capable of winning? so if even the showies are saying any MR has to be capable of winning challenges or the breeders unethical if they dont take it back.. what else can u expect from joe public? can you guarantee how your childs adult teeth are going to come through ? even if your parents died of old age and your nothing worse wrong with you than wear n tear, can u really in all honesty guaratee your own offspring a lifetime heath guarantee????? yet thats what puppy buyers are asking for and expecting now. as i told one guy. u want a lifetime guarateee? then go to the breeders who are offering it. whats the odds they will be even members 5 or 6 years down the track when the chooks come home to roost? only recently my vet gave a pup all clear, clients vet, screamed youve been ripped off puppy has heart murmer... major embarassing... yesterday 3rd vaccination nnnnnnn three different vets cant find a thing? the last one my vet picked up a suspicius murmer gave her to a reli, shes 3 now and perfect.... but if the vets cant even agree what hope for us mugs? perhaps its true, only unethical breeders get any imperfects? which like the backyard term.......means? we all have backyards..... sooo just who is going to be left when every backyarder u unethical is gone? but hey who wants to be realistic its a perfect world for the ethical........ isnt it?

MY point exactly, sparkycat. I am apalled that some posters here are of the opinion that it is "vexatious" to report a puppy miller, I would have thought that breeders...esp from this forum would have been up in arms about puppy farmers but instead all kinds of excuses are being entered into as a means to defend them, go figure you are not looking at how IT IS. yes its been said for decades puppy farmers are evil, must be eliminated. she is being a good girl, she has reacted like programmed. but? so far it is not illegal to breed, it wont be long before it is though. and reporting to the rspca to "eliminate" has also been going on for decades. that doesnt make it right to use them to destroy the lives of someone you either never met. or have decided u dont like but thats what IT IS. they might be all she thinks they are, BUT they might also not be. but it is now evil to breed unless you intend to keep the pups, even more evil to breed many breeds, even more evil it thats possible to cross breeds.nn the show fraternity are forgetting there are those who firmly believe its evil to breed for wins regardless of health issues. n so the witch hunt widens and who will be left? since so many have so many different perceptions, the answer looks like being, not many n since welfare groups dont breed, wonder where the future pet is going to come from? clones?

Yep. melodrama sells. as for the golden retriever being safe? considering had to hold a hose at full bore into the face of my neighbours to stop the attack when his idiot owner phoned me and asked would i please help her as he had brought home a goats head and she didnt want to kids to come home from school and see that. n she couldnt bring herself to touch it to put in the wheelie bin ... please could u do it? what the bitch didnt tell me was the mongrel was attacking her when she tried to pick it up. so muggins goes over. picks up the head, chucks it in n realises the dogs comming for me n he aint bluffing hate to think of what might have been if i hadnt been near the tap and had time to flick it full on and half drown the mongrel as he came for me. yep, hose on full bore stright to the nose does help deter em somewhat. although had to back to the door n inside to escape him till he calmed down. she then explained "hes very food protective" when i asked her what on earth brought that on? as for letting a dog that size free roam of the streets...... sheesh anyway as for cattle dogs, i grew up where every second house had one and nver been bitten in my life. but one of my pet hates is so many bred that never were registered and so many select em for how savage they are and proud of it? these are the moran minds that brought in the pit bulls. even scarier so have to have it. its the people like that are the problem not the poor dogs, they are the victums of this mindset

totally unacceptable doing that to wild ones. the trained goats are amazing. n if u want to win a sannan or anglo nubian wether is the way to go. the size these guys can grow to is astounding

What would you do then to get the terrier to let go? Maybe use the hose so not only would he have to deal with the dog bite but he would have shrinkage also - ouchy Urm I probably wouldnt have done anything to make the little terrier let go. I would have let him go for his life on the chipolata. You could at least offer the terrier a hot dog bun and some sauce to put the frankfurter in to make it a complete meal for the little mite decades ago in bankstown some poor kid wanted to go desperately, foolish one decided to stand facing a fence thinking no one could see he was busy. unfortunately there was a dog on the other side of the fence,nn yep he bit it off. that was one case of poor kid. so peeing at someones fence can be disastarous.

It prolly wasn't large enough for the dog to get a good grip on! so true, was waiting at traffic lights once and this guy on the footpath just opened his coat and had nothing on. at first thought was what the never having seen a "flasher" before, one look and was rolling with laughter. gee if u want to flaunt something at least have something :D :D by the time the police arrived was gone... poor diddums

trouble is the darned things migrate too. n make a beeline for the dogs water too, as wires said, snakes have to drink too

knew a vet who lived out wellington way, their property had heaps of snakes apparently. soo she solved the problem by having two stud toms and think it as 7 females to keep up the numbers. she alwasy kept 40 min as she had 6 kids and she said no snakes ever got near her house thanks to the cats. n sure enough while we were having lunch out at the edge of the paddock was a ring of cats highly interested in something n sure enough was a snake in trouble. trouble is i love our wrens, havnt had any but a house cat for years so have 2 flocks of em

never saw any of it but goats certainly can be trained to harness. uncle had one broken to ride as well. ok big sannan though. some of em grow huge. theres a pic floating round somewhere of a singer sewing machine salesman who had a goat team in the 1900's think there were 6 or 8 in the team reckoned in the pick they never got stuck no matter how deep the sand or mud well found this one http://www.dropbears.com/gallery/burketown...y_Photo_009.htm n this, the cart is a beauty from what u can see of it http://nla.gov.au/nla.pic-an24381796 no singer team yet

U know its funny, a gynacologist killed my twins with a lethal dose of a drug banned from administration to pregnant women, and covered his tracks to the best of his ability, ie, your version of events does not match that of the hospital staff and records, as well as cancelling twice our requests for an autopsy until 13 weeks after their deaths. only after their death did we learn he had been under investigation for months yet still practicing?????? BUT constatant and continual correspondance with medical and govt departments did get accountability put into law. how many of u remember the headlines that if the law was passed gynacologists would retire? we called it the twins law. we lost our boys but at least other parents who suffered the same heartbreak could know that now they could be held accountable. but no such luck for victums like stringy is available for those rolled over by the rspca yet? will it ever be is the question. keep my richard amery letter framed. its a classic of lied to and wont believe it

WOW and this from australias most tragic victum of trial by media what a lesson this lady can teach us http://www.sosnews.org/newsfront/?p=577

digest this one for starters. how poor Judy isnt up for hundreds of thousands like ruth. http://sosnews.org/pdf/The-Ruth-Downey-Inquisition.pdf the megalong one has its own website but havnt found it yet but heres some of the info anyway http://www.sosnews.org/newsfront/?p=391

just had the same thing happen, one a three yr old the other 5 and three times her size. the three yr old flattened her ears and told the older mare move or ill double barrel u. older girl pinned ears and backed up double barrelling. the idiot 3 yr old did the same . so bum to bum gattling guns. n so quick there wasnt a thing i could do to intervene. nxt thing the 3 yr old is hopping on 3 legs and ho so sorry for herself. she has two full hoofprints on her and luckily no broken bones but lame for a week. i doubt she has learned her lesson as she was busy threatening again over the fence yesterday?

exactly and it aint going to get any better. the only people who are not tarred and feathered by someone have been either extremely lucky or no ones decided they dont like em yet. as for the cc's doing the "accredition" thing. i rang and asked why is this being done. to be told after the "pedigree dogs exposed" fallout and this being done in the uk and recommendations that an accreditation schem be implemented that the canine councils "have to be seen to be doing something" or if they do not show they are making an effort then the rspca and governement will legislate and take all rights away from the canine councils or words to that effect. bit like showing the horse the whip n if it doesnt move then it gets it, doesnt it? so now we have two classes of membership. member and probably puppy farmer,, or toe the line and get "accredited" more income at lease and they seem to need it considering all the money being wasted in the past and now this double posting over the couchman issue .. again wasted money to my mind. soo the guy is now to be persecuted because he supplies catalogues for dog shows? n either did it out of the goodness of his heart and absorbed all costs or is a crim? get real well from the letter i read in the last mail said out and paid for by the dogs nsw, more money wasted to my mind anyway. hes now no longer going to serve on the show council... so who loses out. not him more time for his own use instead of helping the dog world. so who really loses out folks? n yet the directors of the rscpa are solicitors that are raking in hundreds of thousands per year in legal fees closer to one million, nearly 300,000 alone in the ruth downey case. n someone is taking this guy to task for the costs of paper and printing??????? yep, anyone with a dog that becomes a member of a canine body, u dont have to be mad but sure has to help.

Sure but what have they done wrong exactly? The OP hasnt even been on the property - she's only driven by it. think about it. the mentality is if you breed to sell not keep you are a puppy farmer. puppy farmers are trash, puppy farmers must be stopped. ive heard it for 30 years. the minset has been acomplished she is doing what was going to be achieved. so dont be suprised surely? unless you keep your pups your a sitting duck for this thinking now

what is really concerning me is this 6 years before an accurate diagnosis? there can be an awful lot of puppies born of later posative parents? wonder if they are taking dna profiles to compare to mri's to see if there are any patterns to show any common matches anywhere?

I saw this stuff being discussed on a snake forum and they were laughing their heads off, said the guy will sell em as mice, rat, cane toad, snake , flying fox u name it, repeller. if youve got the money and want something repelled he will sell u one was what they were saying. well they did say more not not what id repeat here.

our family have actively been involved in assisting researchers in many fields knowing the value to the wider community so i am in favour of discovering tests but so many do not seem to understand the ones markers have been found for are just the tip of a gainormous iceberg. there is soooo much more waiting to be discovered it will petrify most as for the ongoing work on HD the results there are far from encouraging, i have friends who had spend thousands if not tens of thousands in ensuring using only the best of the best and its still turning up affected puppies... its no way as clear a path to its reduction let alone erradication as was first thought sadly

n even weirder, my boy who had two chances of being a carrier if not scids himself n peg at birth had sired some 27 foals from the same n related mares n never produced one in his lifetime. ditto for the sids carrier son. life truely is a lottery, they are long dead so i will never know if they did carry it. someone in queensland knows. because i sent samples from every one i own at my own cost to help the research being done into finding a dna marker. they found it, they know the results for every one of my horses yet chose not only not to let me know. but what really disgusted me, the technology was sold to an american company that charges and arm and a leg for the test. and even had the patent extented so they can still keep the monopoly for a test discovered in australia yet the profits go overseas, really makes u wonder why ?

and sadder for those who have ones from what they were told were free lines are discovering all these decades later. that aint necessarily so. these people didnt get their horses scids tested, why should they. clear lines. one lady was completely unaware that her mare was a full sister to a stallion that sired 16 scids foals in just one foal drop. amazing how few people knew it. was prattling on how that sire closed an entire stud that year, the principles were so devestated they gave up and sold em all. never realised how few people knew why? in my case i happened to have been there two weeks running. first visit. paddocks full of happy foals, second week not one on the place they had all been found to be homozygus and were put down. the odds against that happening would have to have been enormous considering the chances of any carrier to carrier is 25% homozygus then multiply that by 16 and you had more odds of winning lotto wouldnt u?

been through it with SCIDS. my first two stallions one was from a known SCIDS mare the other his dad was a known SCIDS carrier as was his dams sire. soo talk about automatically tarred an feathered. while others with unknown status families preeened themselves and told all and sundry, "our lines are clear" and the known families were decimated to the point of extinction. yet for some curious reason carrier status somehow seemed linked to something that people were selecting for? it was never figured out what? the the number of colts selected to be sires that turned out to be carriers was way way higher than the population average. quite strange. n in its case long as u never put carrier to carrier it could never surface anyway. n talk about self limiting. a scids didnt make it past 16 weeks so no such thing as an homozygus scids. although in humans they discovered bone marrow transplants could give them a normal life. not discovered before the famous boy in the plastic bubble died unfortunately.