rajacadoo Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 I dont want to be seen as 'bagging out' the breed, but isnt their a thing called Cocker Rage Syndrome/Disease ??? Is that what the article that sandgrubber posted is aluding too ??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poodlefan Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 (edited) I am not attacking cocker spaniels, so there is no need to defend. However, it is incorrect to say that temperament is 99% training. If breeders are not willing to admit that bad temperament flaws can run in lines and stop breeding from dogs with bad temperament, breeds will deteriorate. I'm thinking of a reasonably popular stud dog, I won't mention the breed, but not a cocker, whose second, off-the-books call name was A##-hole, and who was known to throw stubborn and troublesome pups. In my book, that dog should have been neutered faster than a dog with 3/3 elbows. You have attacked them before in the BLS thread!! I have never met a bad cocker. Only way for there to be one is bad breed like with every breed!!!!! Or people being nasty to them so once again like every breed!! They have one of the best temperaments you could want in a dog I have met more aggressive labs than cockers 2 bad labs and no bad cockers There's good and bad in every breed and to suggest that there are no Cockers of undesireable temperament is a nonsense. That doesn't make the entire breed 'bad' but it does suggest that some careful research (as the OP is doing) is called for. Almost any breed that has been extremely popular at some point will have its issues and Cockers share that with quite a few other dog breeds. Based on what I've seen, I'd not buy a dog from a breeder that isn't hip scoring and PRA testing. Word of mouth from people who own stable, non-aggressive dogs would be my recommendation. A trainer I highly respect describes Cockers as "wolves in sheeps clothing". I think that some of them are far too much dog for their owners and they need boundaries like any other dog. They are a gundog, not a lap dog. I think many of the issues I've seen in Cockers relate to making that gundog an unexercised, unstimulated, undisciplined couch potato but not all of them. Edited October 11, 2011 by poodlefan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silverblue Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 Hi, I have been breeding Cockers for years now, Haven't had any nasties as yet, apart from 1 cranky old girl who in her older age has deceided children are not to be trusted. However, In my role as groomer I cringe when asked to do Cockers, not so much that they are agressive, but more of a pain. I have a few contacts in SA, & I happen to know of a litter due soon, PM me if you want further info. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
claireybell Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 All breeds have good and bad temperament dogs. Cockers used to have a very bad rap sone years ago due to irresponsible breeding however this seems to have been bred out now. Sandgrubber I'm not sure why you are so against cockers, is there a reason? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Florise Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 Thanks guys. LOL Cockerlover, this will be their fourth Cocker so I think they really are addicted. They have already gotten in contact with their old girl's breeder but unfortunately their bitch had a phantom. Hence why they asked if I could help find someone. Will pass on what health tests need to be done and all your info - unfortunately meeting the parents might be hard as there don't appear to be any litters in SA at the moment, hence why we're relying on word of mouth a little. why don't they ask their old girl's breeder for recommendations? She/he may know people who are breeding with similar lines. Most breeders fly pups interstate without a problem, so why not try breed clubs in other states. Word of mouth is always best though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ellie Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 I've had Cockers for 40+ years and have yet to see one with a bad temperament. Not to say that they don't exist, just that I must have been extremely fortunate As mentioned by Cockerlover, they were very popular in the 60's and 70's (can't speak for the 50's, wasn't around then) and some were bred irresponsibly for a quick buck and with little consideration for temperament. Yes, they do require boundaries. I have one here who tests my patience regularly. As with any other breed, potential puppy buyers need to research carefully (as the OP is clearly doing) to ensure they end up with a delightful, healthy puppy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Atanquin Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 Whiskedaway please let us know how their search is going, and what colour do they like :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darkrai Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 have yet met an aggressive one... Fat.. lazy... hyperactive... ones yeah lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Double-trouble Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 They are a gundog, not a lap dog. Oh please don't tell my two that Poodlefan. All they want to do is cuddle up and weLOVE it!! Mine are same age from 2 different breeders and we couldn't ask for 2 more cuddly and affectionate dogs...no aggression here. Can only speak from our own experience and all 3 have been delightful. We found contacting breeders and discussing the breed with them to be extremely helpful.Good luck with finding the right cocker whiskedaway I'm sure you will. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Atanquin Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 I am not attacking cocker spaniels, so there is no need to defend. However, it is incorrect to say that temperament is 99% training. If breeders are not willing to admit that bad temperament flaws can run in lines and stop breeding from dogs with bad temperament, breeds will deteriorate. I'm thinking of a reasonably popular stud dog, I won't mention the breed, but not a cocker, whose second, off-the-books call name was A##-hole, and who was known to throw stubborn and troublesome pups. In my book, that dog should have been neutered faster than a dog with 3/3 elbows. You have attacked them before in the BLS thread!! I have never met a bad cocker. Only way for there to be one is bad breed like with every breed!!!!! Or people being nasty to them so once again like every breed!! They have one of the best temperaments you could want in a dog I have met more aggressive labs than cockers 2 bad labs and no bad cockers There's good and bad in every breed and to suggest that there are no Cockers of undesireable temperament is a nonsense. That doesn't make the entire breed 'bad' but it does suggest that some careful research (as the OP is doing) is called for. Almost any breed that has been extremely popular at some point will have its issues and Cockers share that with quite a few other dog breeds. Based on what I've seen, I'd not buy a dog from a breeder that isn't hip scoring and PRA testing. Word of mouth from people who own stable, non-aggressive dogs would be my recommendation. A trainer I highly respect describes Cockers as "wolves in sheeps clothing". I think that some of them are far too much dog for their owners and they need boundaries like any other dog. They are a gundog, not a lap dog. I think many of the issues I've seen in Cockers relate to making that gundog an unexercised, unstimulated, undisciplined couch potato but not all of them. i did not say there where no nasty cockers just that I had never met one. im also not to sure about the lap dog bit Zorro would cuddle allday if he could!!! if im sitting on the floor he has to be in my lap right in the way lol oh and the picture is look i get when i say no not that it last long he will walk away flop on to the floor and do a little cry so he ends up on my lap anyway Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poodlefan Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 i did not say there where no nasty cockers just that I had never met one. im also not to sure about the lap dog bit Zorro would cuddle allday if he could!!! if im sitting on the floor he has to be in my lap right in the way lol oh and the picture is look i get when i say no not that it last long he will walk away flop on to the floor and do a little cry so he ends up on my lap anyway Gundogs need exercise (a lot of it) and a job to do. Lapdogs jobs are to be .. lapdogs. I would argue that Cockers need exercise and something to do to be 'happy'. Where they sit when they aren't working is another matter. ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Atanquin Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 oh he gets exercise all right but nothing wrong with all day cuddles on the couch when its raining ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ceilidh Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 aaah, amazing, I just knew "Rage" would be brought up in relation to cockers. Do some research, rage is NOT common and possibly related to epaleptic (sp) fits. It is also more prevalent in other breeds. People confuse the term rage with a bad temperament. Yes back in the late 1800s breeders were trying to cement the solid gold colour and inbred and inbred to get the colour and forgot about everything else, consequently they ended up with some shocking temperaments, HOWEVER, by the 1900s they had worked to fix the temperament problem and nowadays, mostly, cockers are sweet, well tempered dogs. Like every other breed, without exception, there will be the odd dog with a bad temperament. This is when some people will say RAGE RAGE RAGE! But no, it is, unfortunately, a bad temperament. I have viscious bitches! When they are coming into season they hate each other until they are actually in when they love each other, especially to hump! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whiskedaway Posted October 11, 2011 Author Share Posted October 11, 2011 Thanks for all your help guys. They have approached one of the breeders who was recommended to me and are getting a girl from their litter that was born two days ago. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
megan_ Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 We got defensive because the op wanted info on breeders and her relatives have had them before and sansgrubber brought a topic that was not really needed and I have known sansgrubber to bring up topics on cockers like that before even when cockers where not part of the topic Sandgrubber said that people should research lines because SOME lines of cockers have temp problems. Do you advise against this? Are all lines free from aggression? Must be the first breed to have that... Having never met a nasty cocker does not mean they don't exist. After all, if I said I'd only met nasty chi's and therefore all chi's are nasty and be roasted on this forum. I think perhaps some suggestions for the OP on great lines, great breeders etc would be helpful? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lappiemum Posted October 11, 2011 Share Posted October 11, 2011 Hey WA - hope things go well with the new puppy for your Aunt and Uncle. I actually have a work collegue in WA who is a cocker breeder and showie (she just did very well at the Perth Royal!) , but no idea of litters. She would probably know about whats happening in the breed, so if you need any info let me know and I'll get in contact with her for you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Atanquin Posted October 12, 2011 Share Posted October 12, 2011 Thanks for all your help guys. They have approached one of the breeders who was recommended to me and are getting a girl from their litter that was born two days ago. Aww what colour if you don't mind me asking? They must be excited Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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