Guest crickets Posted January 13, 2013 Share Posted January 13, 2013 (edited) The PIAA as I understand it is a private organisation with voluntary membership. As well as being able to say you are a member and be able to use the logo, you do get access to discounts & advice on things like industry specific insurance etc and in the case of the grooming industry, most (not all) of the competitions , trade shows and seminars are organised by the PIAA and members get discounts to enter/attend these events. I guess the same can be said for the pet shop & boarding membership base etc etc Personally I would not join the PIAA to save my life, as they openly support wholesale breeding for the pet market (puppy farms)..and the sale of puppies in pet shops. Edited January 13, 2013 by crickets Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ownedbyapuli Posted January 13, 2013 Share Posted January 13, 2013 I am so sorry I cant imagine how terrible you feel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ownedbyapuli Posted January 13, 2013 Share Posted January 13, 2013 I am so so sorry that this has happened to you & your Buddy. I have groomed dogs professionally for over 25 yrs now and still our industry is completely unregulated. ANYONE can put out their shingle & claim to be a dog groomer. There is no excuse for these tragedies. Just none. Why the hell anyone still uses a choker/slip collar on the inside of a grooming shop is beyond me. There are so many better & more professional ways to tether a dog. & of course the number one safety element in grooming is NEVER leave a dog unattended on a table, tethered or not...just NEVER do it. I have so much more to say on this subject which I am incredibly passionate about but for now I just will say again how awfully sorry I am to hear what you have been put through. :mad [/quote Do you have a salon here in SA? If a groomer is not supposed to use a choker slip knot what are they supposed to use? This is out of interest cos I have a Puli and he is taken to the groomers and I just want to make sure this does not happen to my fur son. Maybe I just wont take him anymore and learn to do it myself. I am absolutely terrified now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robbi Posted January 13, 2013 Share Posted January 13, 2013 Rest in peace Buddy. I have no words that can help take away your pain Cazz but my heartfelt condolences to you at this tragic time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Katdogs Posted January 13, 2013 Share Posted January 13, 2013 If it's the groomer I'm thinking of, can someone update the True Local listing for it? So far it has brilliant reviews... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest crickets Posted January 13, 2013 Share Posted January 13, 2013 I am so so sorry that this has happened to you & your Buddy. I have groomed dogs professionally for over 25 yrs now and still our industry is completely unregulated. ANYONE can put out their shingle & claim to be a dog groomer. There is no excuse for these tragedies. Just none. Why the hell anyone still uses a choker/slip collar on the inside of a grooming shop is beyond me. There are so many better & more professional ways to tether a dog. & of course the number one safety element in grooming is NEVER leave a dog unattended on a table, tethered or not...just NEVER do it. I have so much more to say on this subject which I am incredibly passionate about but for now I just will say again how awfully sorry I am to hear what you have been put through. :mad Do you have a salon here in SA? If a groomer is not supposed to use a choker slip knot what are they supposed to use? This is out of interest cos I have a Puli and he is taken to the groomers and I just want to make sure this does not happen to my fur son. Maybe I just wont take him anymore and learn to do it myself. I am absolutely terrified now. I'll leave it for crickets to answer your questions but I just wanted to say that I know her and she grooms my boy and I trust her completely. :) Thank you Snook! Ownedbyapuli.... Yes I own/operate a salon in SA. I use this tethering system exclusively in my salon. When I refer to groomers not using check/slip collars I am referring to the traditional chain link style 'choker chain' . They have NO place in a dog grooming shop imho. I also would advise groomers against using the fabric alternatives made in the same style, although they are marginally better as they can be cut through with scissors in an emergency. These are just my opinions based & formed over many years of handling many dogs, doing things to them that they often don't like or are poorly trained for. Imho grooming tethers are necessary in pet grooming but safer choices are available these days and I only hope such avoidable tragedies as happened to Buddy & his family can serve as a reminder & wake up call for all groomers to review their equipment & practices. Please don't be scared of going back to the groomer. If your groomer runs an open salon & is happy for owners to see/inspect the grooming & holding areas then you probably have a good groomer. Ask them for a look around the salon. Express your concerns. If they haven't heard about Buddy they should be as shocked as any good groomer & usher you through for a look in an instant to calm your fears! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rascalmyshadow Posted January 14, 2013 Share Posted January 14, 2013 Can other groomers explain to me why tethering is necessary at all??? I have never needed to use any form of one in 18 years I put my table in a corner and use my body to block dogs from jumping, I never take a hand off the dog the whole time I'm working on it. I also groom cats and rabbits without a problem. I think a huge majority of groomers severely lack handling skills and because they want to make as much $$$ as possible they don't work slowly and calmly and get to know every individual dogs needs. I also think too many groomers are very quick to use muzzles when there's no need of they just had half a brain and used relaxation techniques instead. Another major problem is cage drying this is something I do not agree with under any circumstances. I have seen many horrible things while working with other groomers which is why I work alone and by one on one appoinent. My advise is to anyone is to stay away from big busy salons the noise alone is enough to cause stress and they are often handled by mutie people which is also hard on the dog. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest crickets Posted January 14, 2013 Share Posted January 14, 2013 (edited) Can other groomers explain to me why tethering is necessary at all??? I have never needed to use any form of one in 18 years I put my table in a corner and use my body to block dogs from jumping, I never take a hand off the dog the whole time I'm working on it. I also groom cats and rabbits without a problem. I think a huge majority of groomers severely lack handling skills and because they want to make as much $$$ as possible they don't work slowly and calmly and get to know every individual dogs needs. I also think too many groomers are very quick to use muzzles when there's no need of they just had half a brain and used relaxation techniques instead. Another major problem is cage drying this is something I do not agree with under any circumstances. I have seen many horrible things while working with other groomers which is why I work alone and by one on one appoinent. My advise is to anyone is to stay away from big busy salons the noise alone is enough to cause stress and they are often handled by mutie people which is also hard on the dog. For me I prefer to work around my dogs so I do not like my tables against walls. For example on Saturday I groomed a 15 yrs old dog that has a bit of dementia and has lost all ability to comprehend that it is up high on a table and would just walk off the edge, coupled with the old dog trembles etc. A safe tether on this dog means I don't have to man handle it to keep it safely on the table, or take the risk of it ending up maimed or deceased on the floor if I should somehow fail to block it if it were untethered. Then you get very large or very strong dogs that just try the whole time to exit the table. Why take a chance on them jumping when I can use a safe effective tether to actually make them feel comfortable & stop them struggling, while I do the grooming, not having to block & push the whole time. Again just speaking personally, but I agree with everything else you have written :) I only groom 4-6 a day, one at a time start to finish. I love the fact that my salon is usually quiet and I have plenty of time to treat each dog as an individual. I hate cage drying as much as you! There really isn't any need for it. I have a few very senior dogs that don't cope with the force dryer so I just get as much hair as possible off pre bath & use the stand dryer & gently rub them dry, which they actually love. I work alone for the same reasons as you. Edited January 14, 2013 by crickets Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loving my Oldies Posted January 14, 2013 Share Posted January 14, 2013 (edited) Again just speaking personally, but I agree with everything else you have written :) I only groom 4-6 a day, one at a time start to finish. I love the fact that my salon is usually quiet and I have plenty of time to treat each dog as an individual. I hate cage drying as much as you! There really isn't any need for it. I have a few very senior dogs that don't cope with the force dryer so I just get as much hair as possible off pre bath & use the stand dryer & gently rub them dry, which they actually love. I work alone for the same reasons as you. I wish my salon was like this. I have to leave my dogs there for hours, even though I know they are treated kindly and they are in airconditioning, but ...... I will be asking about cage drying, too. I know they have a large stand up blow dryer, but I've not seen it in action. Dearest Buddy, your tragedy has made many of us ask a lot more questions. Edited January 14, 2013 by Danny's Darling Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simply Grand Posted January 14, 2013 Share Posted January 14, 2013 I'm not sure if groomers in other states will know the answer to this, but the first time I booked to take Saxon to a groomer here in the ACT I arrived in the salon which had a small reception area and then a wall blocking any view of the working area. I asked them if I could stay and watch and they said no, I asked if I could at least see out the back and they said I wasn't allowed back there because their insurance wouldn't cover me. In the end I decided not to leave him there as I just didn't feel comfortable, but I'm wondering whether it could have been true that insurance wouldn't cover non-employees out the back or whether that was an excuse. Any thoughts? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rascalmyshadow Posted January 14, 2013 Share Posted January 14, 2013 (edited) Crickets thanks for your reply it is so nice to hear other groomers that care I have worked with quite a few that don't. I also groom many senile, problematic or terrified dogs mostly due to other bad groomers manhandling them. I was in a vet clinic in a room on my own so it was nice and quiet, I would do usually about 8 dogs a day on my own. Now I work from home I do 4 dogs a day many love coming so much their owners leave them longer so they can play with my own dogs although I only groom a few big guys, I have gone so much out if my way for the dogs my body has suffered. The reason for my post is to let the general public know that some of us groomers do care about the animals we work with and we do our best to keep them comfortable. Simply grand the groomers are correct I know from working at the vet clinic this can be a problem but I still allowed my clients out the back when dropping their dogs and the occasional owner would stay. Also having other people around watching often upsets all the dogs which then creates a lot of extra stress and tension. Edited January 14, 2013 by Rascalmyshadow Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cassie Posted January 14, 2013 Share Posted January 14, 2013 Crickets can you tell me where your salon is please? PM if you prefer :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest crickets Posted January 14, 2013 Share Posted January 14, 2013 Cassie my salon is on Payneham Rd , but sadly if you are enquiring for your bigguns, 25 yrs grooming and a broken neck in the mix, I can't take the big ones any more I pretty much run a closed client base. I wish I could groom them all, but I can't so I just stick to what I can manage, only doing a few dogs a day so that I can concentrate properly, remain fresh and alert, and spend appropriate time with everyone. My salon is set up so that when people come in to reception, they can see where I do all my finish work, as well as the holding area. I have a separate bathing/drying room at the back and the door is usually open with a view into there. If anyone asks to look around, I will assess the safety factor and usually oblige. I may decline if they have small children with them or if I have a dog in the salon at that time who's safety could be compromised or who could compromise the safety of the visitor. At the front of my salon through a door off reception I have a client lounge area with a couch, tv, childrens activity table etc. It is an area that owners are welcome to stay in while I groom their dog, but I do have strict rules about them talking & moving around in the shop while I groom their dog. For the most part it works really well & I am happy for owners to remain in store. I will not let them stay right up with their dog as this usually makes it much more difficult and potentially more dangerous for the dog, and is terribly distracting for the groomer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cassie Posted January 14, 2013 Share Posted January 14, 2013 I was enquiring for my big boys yes. Shame you can't take them anymore but I completely understand - your own health and safety needs to be a priority! :) Your salon sounds great, thanks for sharing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ownedbyapuli Posted January 14, 2013 Share Posted January 14, 2013 Cassie my salon is on Payneham Rd , but sadly if you are enquiring for your bigguns, 25 yrs grooming and a broken neck in the mix, I can't take the big ones any more I pretty much run a closed client base. I wish I could groom them all, but I can't so I just stick to what I can manage, only doing a few dogs a day so that I can concentrate properly, remain fresh and alert, and spend appropriate time with everyone. My salon is set up so that when people come in to reception, they can see where I do all my finish work, as well as the holding area. I have a separate bathing/drying room at the back and the door is usually open with a view into there. If anyone asks to look around, I will assess the safety factor and usually oblige. I may decline if they have small children with them or if I have a dog in the salon at that time who's safety could be compromised or who could compromise the safety of the visitor. At the front of my salon through a door off reception I have a client lounge area with a couch, tv, childrens activity table etc. It is an area that owners are welcome to stay in while I groom their dog, but I do have strict rules about them talking & moving around in the shop while I groom their dog. For the most part it works really well & I am happy for owners to remain in store. I will not let them stay right up with their dog as this usually makes it much more difficult and potentially more dangerous for the dog, and is terribly distracting for the groomer. Thank you so much for your answer. They have a window to the back of the salon where the work is happening so you can see out back. I know Joey is crated with fans when he is drying. Being a Puli, he takes a long time to dry. Payneham Rd is not far from me. I eventually found a brilliant girl that read up and studied how to groom a Puli, after I had some horrendous experiences. Have you groomed a Puli before? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simply Grand Posted January 14, 2013 Share Posted January 14, 2013 Crickets, your salon does sound great! I can definitely understand the distraction of having owners around, watching and intefering :laugh: Being able to at least see the set up is reassuring though. It sounds like you keep a good balance between reassuring your clients and keeping things calm, sensible and safe. The place I ended up taking Saxon had the washing/grooming area off the large shop area, through a barn style door where they left the top half open so I could see I and the bottom closed so dogs couldn't run out. I asked when I booked if I could stay and watch as it was the first time he was being groomed and they said that was fine. I'm sure it was a bit annoying for the groomer having me watch but she was good about it, and she ended up getting me to hold him still while she did his face. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest crickets Posted January 14, 2013 Share Posted January 14, 2013 Ownedbyapuli..... yes I have groomed a couple of Puli over the years but both owners preferred to keep them brushed out & clipped. I have to say that grooming the corded coat is the one & only exception I would make for 'cage drying'!. It's so rarely seen in grooming shops that I overlooked that one when I was saying about cage drying before. It's great that you have a groomer that suits you & your dog. Kudos to them for going the extra mile. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ownedbyapuli Posted January 14, 2013 Share Posted January 14, 2013 Ownedbyapuli..... yes I have groomed a couple of Puli over the years but both owners preferred to keep them brushed out & clipped. I have to say that grooming the corded coat is the one & only exception I would make for 'cage drying'!. It's so rarely seen in grooming shops that I overlooked that one when I was saying about cage drying before. It's great that you have a groomer that suits you & your dog. Kudos to them for going the extra mile. Yeah, I agree a corded coat does need to be cage dried and I dont think Joey minds being left in a crate alone. As it is he shakes when he goes to the groomers. He's been like that ever since we rescued him when he was 18mths old. I go to About Town Dog Studio at Glenunga. When people talk about coats and grooming I just automatically think of a corded coat and all the work we put into his coat. I was devastated when a groomer clipped him back and then brushed him up like a poodle!!!!! He sits next to me and I automatically start working on his cords, checking for cords that need to be seaparted and my fingers are always running through his coat feeling for seeds, always checking between his pads. The grooming is auto pilot now. If anyone wants a puli because of the coat, think not once not twice but 10 times. Its a lot of work and if you dont love the breed and the temperament, get another breed. Thanks for your input Cricket, I really appreciate it :-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dog_fan Posted January 14, 2013 Share Posted January 14, 2013 I am so sorry for your loss. I just cannot believe that the people we entrust our family members to can be so negligent. I have been discussing this with a friend of mine and she said she is a member of the MDBA and told me that they have a screening process before professionals can become members and that they do random checks. She said that all complaints are investigated. Maybe this would be a way to differentiate the good from the bad? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
westiemum Posted January 14, 2013 Share Posted January 14, 2013 I am so so sorry that this has happened to you & your Buddy. I have groomed dogs professionally for over 25 yrs now and still our industry is completely unregulated. ANYONE can put out their shingle & claim to be a dog groomer. There is no excuse for these tragedies. Just none. Why the hell anyone still uses a choker/slip collar on the inside of a grooming shop is beyond me. There are so many better & more professional ways to tether a dog. & of course the number one safety element in grooming is NEVER leave a dog unattended on a table, tethered or not...just NEVER do it. I have so much more to say on this subject which I am incredibly passionate about but for now I just will say again how awfully sorry I am to hear what you have been put through. :mad Do you have a salon here in SA? If a groomer is not supposed to use a choker slip knot what are they supposed to use? This is out of interest cos I have a Puli and he is taken to the groomers and I just want to make sure this does not happen to my fur son. Maybe I just wont take him anymore and learn to do it myself. I am absolutely terrified now. I'll leave it for crickets to answer your questions but I just wanted to say that I know her and she grooms my boy and I trust her completely. :) Crickets doesn't do my westies but that's only because I met her years after I started going to the Spoilt Dog, who have been fabulous too. Crickets has an excellent reputation and I would certainly trust her with my westies without a second thought. :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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