Feeding Raw Horse Meat

[Red Fox]

I'm not sure where I stand on it as an ethical issue..

But if horse meat was available in the supermarkets and fit for human consumption then yes I would buy it occasionally if it was out on special, just as I do with beef, lamb, pork and chicken. However I would not feed it as a main meat. I prefer roo which is free range, lean and unaffected by bad farming practices, drugs, poor quality (unnatural) feed. It's unlikely that I'd buy horse meat if it contained preservatives either.

[stormie]

But cows and goats can all bond with people and be pets, so could just as easily be a companion animal

Out of curiosity and by no means having a go at anyone, but those who don't like the idea of feeding horse meat because of the conditions they are travelled in and how its suggested some are slaughtered, do you have the same attitude towards feeding say beef or chicken?

Some of the stories I've heard about their slaughtering are pretty unpleasant too

[Mas1981]

But cows and goats can all bond with people and be pets, so could just as easily be a companion animal

Out of curiosity and by no means having a go at anyone, but those who don't like the idea of feeding horse meat because of the conditions they are travelled in and how its suggested some are slaughtered, do you have the same attitude towards feeding say beef or chicken?

Some of the stories I've heard about their slaughtering are pretty unpleasant too

You are 100% right Stormie, I feel terrible about the way animals are slaughtered and transported etc but at the end of the day my dog has to eat and I cannot afford to feed him human grade meat ( he is just too big and eats way too much). We are back on roo and sweet potato because of a reaction to chicken, we will be trying out other proteins soon and if it turns out that beef, chicken and lamb all make his allergies react then I will feed roo, goat and maybe some horse.

[stormie]

But cows and goats can all bond with people and be pets, so could just as easily be a companion animal

Out of curiosity and by no means having a go at anyone, but those who don't like the idea of feeding horse meat because of the conditions they are travelled in and how its suggested some are slaughtered, do you have the same attitude towards feeding say beef or chicken?

Some of the stories I've heard about their slaughtering are pretty unpleasant too

You are 100% right Stormie, I feel terrible about the way animals are slaughtered and transported etc but at the end of the day my dog has to eat and I cannot afford to feed him human grade meat ( he is just too big and eats way too much). We are back on roo and sweet potato because of a reaction to chicken, we will be trying out other proteins soon and if it turns out that beef, chicken and lamb all make his allergies react then I will feed roo, goat and maybe some horse.

I'm the same as you - I can't afford to feed human grade either. But even human grade stuff isn't necessarily killed in a nice way. My boss still gets a bit upset when he talks about his field pracs to the abattoir and another vet I worked with turned Vego purely from her experience there. And this is for the human food.

[WoofnHoof]

I just finished having this argument on a horse forum but my view is that horses in Australia aren't bred and raised as meat animals and therefore are less suitable to endure the slaughter process, TBs in particular have extremely high flight responses far higher than any steer or sheep and so stick them all on a truck together and see what happens. I know sheep and cattle suffer welfare issues as well and accidents but I know horses and I don't believe the slaughter process as it currently stands in Australia is condusive to a humane death.

The issue with the camel meat in WA was due to contamination from a toxic native plant that the camels were eating up north. The camels were unaffected but the toxin remains in the dog and builds up if they are fed it continuously. You might be interested to know that the chemical residue limits for animal meat are actually lower than they are for human grade because people don't tend to eat the same thing day after day so toxins don't have a chance to buiild up to dangerous levels. I was told this by a residue chemist so I'm pretty sure he knew what he was talking about

[Mas1981]

But cows and goats can all bond with people and be pets, so could just as easily be a companion animal

Out of curiosity and by no means having a go at anyone, but those who don't like the idea of feeding horse meat because of the conditions they are travelled in and how its suggested some are slaughtered, do you have the same attitude towards feeding say beef or chicken?

Some of the stories I've heard about their slaughtering are pretty unpleasant too

You are 100% right Stormie, I feel terrible about the way animals are slaughtered and transported etc but at the end of the day my dog has to eat and I cannot afford to feed him human grade meat ( he is just too big and eats way too much). We are back on roo and sweet potato because of a reaction to chicken, we will be trying out other proteins soon and if it turns out that beef, chicken and lamb all make his allergies react then I will feed roo, goat and maybe some horse.

I'm the same as you - I can't afford to feed human grade either. But even human grade stuff isn't necessarily killed in a nice way. My boss still gets a bit upset when he talks about his field pracs to the abattoir and another vet I worked with turned Vego purely from her experience there. And this is for the human food.

I can just imagine how horrible the abbatoirs are, I myself dont eat much red meat but I am not veggo, I try not to think about how the animals are transported and killed....

[stormie]

Cattle can become quite flighty also, when they see the carcass of the one killed before it. I believe it's not meant to happen and the previous is meant to be taken away before the live one is bought it, but unfortunately it doesn't always happen like that and the cattle become VERY distressed.

[Amerigo]

As a horse breeder and trainer who knows the industry well, i will just warn you that most of the horses that go for dog meat have been fed pain killers/anti inflammatories etc before death as they are mostly ex pacers and racehorses.

be careful!

[peigirl]

Yes I would. Only as a novel protein though for a dog with diet issues.

[shmoo]

I just see it as not being wasteful. The horses have ended up at the abattoir for whatever reason, I like to think mostly due to injury/age etc, but to have their lives ended. If their meat can be used to not be wasted, then so be it.

Exactly. My local abattoir sells horse meat and they source their horses from unwanted homes (old, injured, purely unwanted etc)

[Crisovar]

I know of a pet meat abattoir that takes horses and handles them with dignity, always an option if a horse has to be put down due to injury or old age etc. All it takes is a phone call to arrange a time and the horse is humanely destroyed on arrival. I know from discussions with other horse owners that there are many "doggers" that do the job humanely and with dignity. I have no hesitation using meat from these sources.

My understanding of the situation with the WA horse meat for human consumption business is that the horses are treated as the valuable commodity that they are.

[Gallomph]

I'd be concerned about drug residues (bute, antibiotics etc).

Edited July 28, 2010 by Gallomph

[sas]

I used Horse Meat as a novel protein for my allergic dog.

I used to ride horses when I was younger but was able to overcome the moral issues because I had the moral issue of helping my allergic dog.

HOWEVER - I found Horse meat disgusting in smell and texture.

As a side note, I was speaking to an Italian the other week who told me they eat Horse meat.

What makes a Horse a moral issue over another animal that is equally as intelligent and works to help humans? i.e. sheep, cattle etc.

[Esky the husky]

So if it was free range horse farmed for eating purposes, would you guys feed it?

I would

[WoofnHoof]

Horses in this country aren't bred for meat, many of the horses that go for meat have been bred to run fast and have lightning quick reflexes, these traits are not consistent with the requirements of untethered group transport and current slaughter practices. While you do get problems with cattle and sheep occasionally they simply aren't bred for those traits and therefore are generally easier to handle in facilities designed for those species. IMO the welfare is compromised in the slaughter situation for these animals as opposed to animals which have been bred for docility. The situation isn't that great for other species either but I think the combination of very high flight responses and facilities which are generally not designed for horses are especially detrimental for these animals.

[stormie]

I'm not disagreeing with you WnH, what you're saying makes perfect sense. The story I mentioned previously was about the cattle industry - when my vet friend was on prac, she saw a steer get led in to be killed and it saw the dead body of the one killed before it. She said it went absolutely mental trying to get out of there and took many people to wrangle it. She never ate meat from that day because she was so distressed by the action of that animal, knowing it had the same fate as the one before it..

Same with chickens - they're hung upside down on a moving rack which sees their heads lowered into electrified water. The chickens see the one in front of it die. There is a person whose job it is to use a stick to push their heads under, because many then try to hold their heads up out of the water.

My local abattoir isn't huge and doesn't seem to have a lot of OTT horses - mostly just paddock neddies that are old/injured/unwanted. I actually asked them once about their horses and surprisingly they told me most of the horses surrendered to them are completely sound and sometimes Hacks, but the owners for whatever reason, cannot have them anymore and would rather they were killed than be rehomed so they know their outcome.

I also just called my local and they said they are not allowed to use any animal for meat that has been euthanised , drugged etc. I know there are no regulations but she was very adamant that this was the case and is followed strictly. Also, unless they are in a bad way, they are wormed then turned out in the paddock until after the withholding period.

[casowner]

I agree with you WnH horses are very reactionary and the travelling, handling and smells of the abbatoirs would set off a lot of horses. Many hacks would never have even seen or heard sheep/cattle before and this could distress them further and I can pretty much imagine the people slaughtering them wouldn't have the horses state of mind as their priority. This is why my large animals are euthed and buried on the property, unfortunately many people don't have that option which is why I if I was in that situation I would get the zoo to come out and put them down on my property and then take the body back for processing.

[GeorgieB]

I have fed horse to the Painted African Dogs at the Adelaide zoo (thrown large chunks of horse meat with fur still on it over the enclosure fence to the Dogs)

I have no problem with this type of meat as the zoo is very careful on how they go about obtaining it. Usually old horses from trusted sources.

[rubiton]

Apparently the zoo no longer takes unwanted horses they get their meat supplied by a contractor (from someone who looked into it more recently from a horse forum). Many years ago when they had I think it was a Condor there was a big rib cage in there and it looked like it was from a horse (right shape & size for horse wrong for cattle). The zoo also use to end up with the old police horses that had soundness issues (this was from a former police person who said they asked for the lower legs & hooves back to see why a horse had had so much trouble and inside they were in a shocking state).

WOuld wonder though why unwanted horses would be treated with bute and antibiotics before being sent to the knackery (as mentioned in various posts above) - would have thought like the ones in SA that go to Peterborough from various sales that they are held somewhere for a required time. You cannot send a horse that has been put down with drugs to the knackery for their use (though have heard some will dispose of the body for a fee in one of the eastern states)

[Starkehre]

I have always (up until only a few years ago) been a passionate horse breeder, lover, trainer and rider.

I have no problems feeding my dogs horse meat.

I am also aware that many pet meat suppliers sell horse meat as their beef... I can usually tell. The texture, color of the fat and smell is different, but it does not bother me at all.

Edited July 29, 2010 by dyzney