Jed Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 Hi Annie99 you are obviously interested in this subject. If you don't approve of ANKC breeders selling to pet shops, write to each state CC and tell them. The addresses are on the website. Australian National Kennel Council. If you want to buy a pup, go to an MDBA breeder. If you buy from a petshop, you encourage the sale of puppy farm pups. Write to your local MP, complain to him about (a) puppy farms (b) ANKC regulations © pet shops. And write to the minister for primary production in your state. You can write to the newspapers as well. Don't tell us, we know already. Educate those who don't know. You never know, another voice may have an impact. Thanks Jed. I have done much of what you suggest and more, I can assure you. Lots of letters to pollies and to councils. Plenty to Pet's Paradise as well. None to ANKC. Good Idea. I will start on those. I hope they have email addresses, as 99% of my letters are via email. Well done! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Annie99 Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 We will not be judging dogs on their breed standard.We are not having shows the way shows have been traditionally and when we have shows/events it will be for the same reason the ANKC have their traditional shows to test or exhibit the dogs against others of their kind but it wont be by having them handled by a judge and running around a ring. So what exactly will these 'shows' entail? I've read that all dogs will have to be examined by a veterinary surgeon prior to 'exhibition' (very time consuming) and that the general public will be much more involved than they are at ANKC shows, but other than that everything appears to be very vague. Other than testing for working ability (possible, but will be difficult and once again extremely time consuming at an all breeds show) and ensuring that every dog can do the job for which it was originally bred (even more difficult as some of those jobs no longer exist) I cannot begin to imagine how one of your 'shows' is going to be conducted or what is going to be required of the exhibits. Ok off topic but how can every dog be examined by a vet? Now most shows have hundreds of entries, you would quite a few vets on hand and what time would the exhibitors be expected to arrive at the show so they have plenty of time to have their dog/s checked.. I have not had experience showing dogs, but when I showed my cat around 10 years ago, we had to be at shows very early for the vet check (I think it was around 7am). Not sure what the current rules/practices are with cats or dogs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jed Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 We will not be judging dogs on their breed standard.We are not having shows the way shows have been traditionally and when we have shows/events it will be for the same reason the ANKC have their traditional shows to test or exhibit the dogs against others of their kind but it wont be by having them handled by a judge and running around a ring. So what exactly will these 'shows' entail? I've read that all dogs will have to be examined by a veterinary surgeon prior to 'exhibition' (very time consuming) and that the general public will be much more involved than they are at ANKC shows, but other than that everything appears to be very vague. Other than testing for working ability (possible, but will be difficult and once again extremely time consuming at an all breeds show) and ensuring that every dog can do the job for which it was originally bred (even more difficult as some of those jobs no longer exist) I cannot begin to imagine how one of your 'shows' is going to be conducted or what is going to be required of the exhibits. Ok off topic but how can every dog be examined by a vet? Now most shows have hundreds of entries, you would quite a few vets on hand and what time would the exhibitors be expected to arrive at the show so they have plenty of time to have their dog/s checked.. When I was a gel (well, babe in arms) all exhibits were vet checked prior to the commencement of the show. There weren't as many entries then either,but it did take some time, so we all arrived early. In season bitches were not allowed to be exhibited, incidentally. The system was abandoned because it too so long to vet check all the entries. Perhaps if the mdba exhibitions don't have many entries, it will be feasible? Particularly if it begins at 7am or something. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MissMolly Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 My point is that most people don't care, as much as we wish they would stop and think about where that pup has come from they don't..I am all for pet shops not selling pets, and I understand that the ANKC can not legally stop its members from selling to pet shops, so it has done what it could and make it that it has to be a PIAA pet shop, now I am not satying that this is ok, but its hands are tied legally.. So the only other way we can stop this is by stopping pet shops from selling pets.. Annie I think there is a lot of websites out there that are easy to find and tell the public about puppy farms, but again it comes down to wether that member of the public wants to know.. The puppy farmers are only going to give them glossy websites, not photos to the realities of puppy farms. Ok maybe i worded it wrong, I meant that there is a lot of websites out there telling the public about the evils of puppy farms, and information that the public can use when looking for a pup so they don't end up with a puppy farm pup.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Annie99 Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 My point is that most people don't care, as much as we wish they would stop and think about where that pup has come from they don't..I am all for pet shops not selling pets, and I understand that the ANKC can not legally stop its members from selling to pet shops, so it has done what it could and make it that it has to be a PIAA pet shop, now I am not satying that this is ok, but its hands are tied legally.. So the only other way we can stop this is by stopping pet shops from selling pets.. Annie I think there is a lot of websites out there that are easy to find and tell the public about puppy farms, but again it comes down to wether that member of the public wants to know.. The puppy farmers are only going to give them glossy websites, not photos to the realities of puppy farms. Ok maybe i worded it wrong, I meant that there is a lot of websites out there telling the public about the evils of puppy farms, and information that the public can use when looking for a pup so they don't end up with a puppy farm pup.. There are far, far, far more with no mention of puppy farms. I have told many, many people about puppy farms who own dogs and did not know they existed. Also if someone goes to a pound, rspca or rescue they will get a mixed breed dog and not necessarily learn all about puppy farms there either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rebanne Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 Perhaps if the mdba exhibitions don't have many entries, it will be feasible? Particularly if it begins at 7am or something. logic says the early exhibtions won't have many entires so very doable, what happens when entries get into the 100's, the 1000's? MDBA might decide then to go the same route as the ANKC and stop the vetting, or they may not. Entries might be limited to whatever number the vet/s can handle comfortably. Also depends on what form these exhibtions will take, will have to wait and see. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danois Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 I still don't have my PM from Annie. So I will repeat the question openly again - you have held out that you have a legal background so surely you are familiar with the TPA and the sections there re restricting people from dealing in a competitive market etc? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rebanne Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 My point is that most people don't care, as much as we wish they would stop and think about where that pup has come from they don't..I am all for pet shops not selling pets, and I understand that the ANKC can not legally stop its members from selling to pet shops, so it has done what it could and make it that it has to be a PIAA pet shop, now I am not satying that this is ok, but its hands are tied legally.. So the only other way we can stop this is by stopping pet shops from selling pets.. Annie I think there is a lot of websites out there that are easy to find and tell the public about puppy farms, but again it comes down to wether that member of the public wants to know.. The puppy farmers are only going to give them glossy websites, not photos to the realities of puppy farms. Ok maybe i worded it wrong, I meant that there is a lot of websites out there telling the public about the evils of puppy farms, and information that the public can use when looking for a pup so they don't end up with a puppy farm pup.. I don't think you worded it poorly Miss Molly, I'd sugest most people reading this knew what you meant. There is plenty of info out there if the general public cared to know, or wanted to know, many don't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rebanne Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 :p I still don't have my PM from Annie.So I will repeat the question openly again - you have held out that you have a legal background so surely you are familiar with the TPA and the sections there re restricting people from dealing in a competitive market etc? don't be sad Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MissMolly Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 We will not be judging dogs on their breed standard.We are not having shows the way shows have been traditionally and when we have shows/events it will be for the same reason the ANKC have their traditional shows to test or exhibit the dogs against others of their kind but it wont be by having them handled by a judge and running around a ring. So what exactly will these 'shows' entail? I've read that all dogs will have to be examined by a veterinary surgeon prior to 'exhibition' (very time consuming) and that the general public will be much more involved than they are at ANKC shows, but other than that everything appears to be very vague. Other than testing for working ability (possible, but will be difficult and once again extremely time consuming at an all breeds show) and ensuring that every dog can do the job for which it was originally bred (even more difficult as some of those jobs no longer exist) I cannot begin to imagine how one of your 'shows' is going to be conducted or what is going to be required of the exhibits. Ok off topic but how can every dog be examined by a vet? Now most shows have hundreds of entries, you would quite a few vets on hand and what time would the exhibitors be expected to arrive at the show so they have plenty of time to have their dog/s checked.. When I was a gel (well, babe in arms) all exhibits were vet checked prior to the commencement of the show. There weren't as many entries then either,but it did take some time, so we all arrived early. In season bitches were not allowed to be exhibited, incidentally. The system was abandoned because it too so long to vet check all the entries. Perhaps if the mdba exhibitions don't have many entries, it will be feasible? Particularly if it begins at 7am or something. Still OT, I must walk around with blinders on at dog shows as I don't recall seeing sick and injured dogs begin shown... I know a few people that have absentee their dog/bitch because she or he seems a bit off colour.. Just last weekend a exhibitor absentee her dog because the dog seemed to have a sore back.. Others have left dogs at home because they have been unwell, so how many sick dogs are really been shown?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Annie99 Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 I still don't have my PM from Annie.So I will repeat the question openly again - you have held out that you have a legal background so surely you are familiar with the TPA and the sections there re restricting people from dealing in a competitive market etc? You have your PM Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
raz Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 Also if someone goes to a pound, rspca or rescue they will get a mixed breed dog and not necessarily learn all about puppy farms there either. So what? A member of my family gets dogs from the pound. should I smash her over the head about puppy farms? Your point is irrelevant Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Annie99 Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 Also if someone goes to a pound, rspca or rescue they will get a mixed breed dog and not necessarily learn all about puppy farms there either. So what? A member of my family gets dogs from the pound. should I smash her over the head about puppy farms? Your point is irrelevant Not irrelevant at all. Some people when getting a dog are tossing up b/t a purebred or rescue. My point is there is a whole lot more info out there about dogs available than there is about puppy farms. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
raz Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 Not irrelevant at all. Some people when getting a dog are tossing up b/t a purebred or rescue. My point is there is a whole lot more info out there about dogs available than there is about puppy farms. Am I in the wrong thread? I thought this one was about registered breeders. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rebanne Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 Not irrelevant at all. Some people when getting a dog are tossing up b/t a purebred or rescue. My point is there is a whole lot more info out there about dogs available than there is about puppy farms. Am I in the wrong thread? I thought this one was about registered breeders. nah, it's whatever Annie99 wants it to be about Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MissMolly Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 My point is that most people don't care, as much as we wish they would stop and think about where that pup has come from they don't..I am all for pet shops not selling pets, and I understand that the ANKC can not legally stop its members from selling to pet shops, so it has done what it could and make it that it has to be a PIAA pet shop, now I am not satying that this is ok, but its hands are tied legally.. So the only other way we can stop this is by stopping pet shops from selling pets.. Annie I think there is a lot of websites out there that are easy to find and tell the public about puppy farms, but again it comes down to wether that member of the public wants to know.. The puppy farmers are only going to give them glossy websites, not photos to the realities of puppy farms. Ok maybe i worded it wrong, I meant that there is a lot of websites out there telling the public about the evils of puppy farms, and information that the public can use when looking for a pup so they don't end up with a puppy farm pup.. I don't think you worded it poorly Miss Molly, I'd sugest most people reading this knew what you meant. There is plenty of info out there if the general public cared to know, or wanted to know, many don't. I don't think many people want to know.. I recently did a animal companion course with a class of around 30 people, one of the students did a presentation on puppy farms, (mind you now i call them puppy factories as farms makes most people think of rolling hills etc), most of the class didn't know about puppy factories and sadly most did not want to know, some would say oh will never buy a pet from a pet shop, but they would still shop in that pet shop for other things, one reason was the pet shop was just down the road and the nearest one that didn't sell pets was further away.. A girl I knew brought a pup from a pet shop, I told her all about puppy factories etc, sadly her pup was killed and guess what she went and brought two more pups from a pet shop. Even though she knew i attended dog shows, knew how to find her a great breeder etc she wanted them then and now, people like that you can't teach.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaxx'sBuddy Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 We will not be judging dogs on their breed standard.We are not having shows the way shows have been traditionally and when we have shows/events it will be for the same reason the ANKC have their traditional shows to test or exhibit the dogs against others of their kind but it wont be by having them handled by a judge and running around a ring. So what exactly will these 'shows' entail? I've read that all dogs will have to be examined by a veterinary surgeon prior to 'exhibition' (very time consuming) and that the general public will be much more involved than they are at ANKC shows, but other than that everything appears to be very vague. Other than testing for working ability (possible, but will be difficult and once again extremely time consuming at an all breeds show) and ensuring that every dog can do the job for which it was originally bred (even more difficult as some of those jobs no longer exist) I cannot begin to imagine how one of your 'shows' is going to be conducted or what is going to be required of the exhibits. Ok off topic but how can every dog be examined by a vet? Now most shows have hundreds of entries, you would quite a few vets on hand and what time would the exhibitors be expected to arrive at the show so they have plenty of time to have their dog/s checked.. When I was a gel (well, babe in arms) all exhibits were vet checked prior to the commencement of the show. There weren't as many entries then either,but it did take some time, so we all arrived early. In season bitches were not allowed to be exhibited, incidentally. The system was abandoned because it too so long to vet check all the entries. Perhaps if the mdba exhibitions don't have many entries, it will be feasible? Particularly if it begins at 7am or something. Still OT, I must walk around with blinders on at dog shows as I don't recall seeing sick and injured dogs begin shown... I know a few people that have absentee their dog/bitch because she or he seems a bit off colour.. Just last weekend a exhibitor absentee her dog because the dog seemed to have a sore back.. Others have left dogs at home because they have been unwell, so how many sick dogs are really been shown?? i think there was a thread a while ago about parvo being at a show???? there have also been other threads about ill and sick dogs being shown so i assumed it happened enough for people to be concerned enough to post here about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Annie99 Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 A girl I knew brought a pup from a pet shop, I told her all about puppy factories etc, sadly her pup was killed and guess what she went and brought two more pups from a pet shop. Even though she knew i attended dog shows, knew how to find her a great breeder etc she wanted them then and now, people like that you can't teach.. That is very sad, and you can only imagine how they treat their own pups/dogs, if they know full well that the mother of the pup could be a breeding machine at a puppy farm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danois Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 Ah well guys - I would not waste your breath. Annie is not interested in anything people here have to say. Also - got to love the ole DOL grapevine - pity its not accurate when spreading personal information about members Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stormie Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 AHHAHA I have plenty of enemies because I speak my mind, and stand by it! This is what I was referring to before. So you could be doing the right thing, have the best ethics, breeding practices etc. But if you have enemies, they're not going to steer people your way if people ask them are you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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