GeckoTree Posted June 27, 2012 Share Posted June 27, 2012 (edited) With so many 'experts' and no doubt many are in days of yore, then the acolytes of them copying each other on dog training, management, behaviour, nutrition, husbandry, etc etc all seeming at odds with each other, where does the truth lie, the middle ground? What is that called when one system say promotion of an alpha roll ( which I personally think is brain dead and archaic )is competing with a positive reinforcement clicker training. When one system calls the other bullshit and defunct they themselves will soon be replaced by the next big thing. Edited June 27, 2012 by GeckoTree Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kavik Posted June 27, 2012 Share Posted June 27, 2012 There is no "truth" in dog training. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kiesha09 Posted June 27, 2012 Share Posted June 27, 2012 There is a truth to me.... doesn't mean to say everyone has to agree with it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LizT Posted June 27, 2012 Share Posted June 27, 2012 As with everything in life you soon learn to separate the wheat from the straw. Glean what you can, and most importantly use what works for you. :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jed Posted June 27, 2012 Share Posted June 27, 2012 The truth is in realising that each dog is an individual, and methods which work on one dog will not work on another, and being knowledgable and humble enough to know which is which, imho. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeckoTree Posted June 27, 2012 Author Share Posted June 27, 2012 (edited) *Likes* Jed. Oh and LizT sorry missed your post. J. Edited June 27, 2012 by GeckoTree Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Diva Posted June 27, 2012 Share Posted June 27, 2012 (edited) In many unregulated professions people will seek to differentiate themselves and their product to attract business. Some is difference in method, some is just clever (or sometimes stoopid)marketing imo. Edited June 27, 2012 by Diva Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tdierikx Posted June 27, 2012 Share Posted June 27, 2012 Jed has the right of it - any decent trainer will realise that not all methods work on all dogs and owners, and will adjust methods to suit the dog and owner best. Funnily enough, a lot of dog training is actually training the owner... *grin* T. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dogsfevr Posted June 27, 2012 Share Posted June 27, 2012 The truth is in realising that each dog is an individual, and methods which work on one dog will not work on another, and being knowledgable and humble enough to know which is which, imho. Totally agree with this . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oakway Posted June 27, 2012 Share Posted June 27, 2012 We do not have dog problems we have people problems. All roads lead to Rome. All training methods are acceptable and are appropriate for the dog being handled. And and I do mean acceptable appropriate legit able methods. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LizT Posted June 27, 2012 Share Posted June 27, 2012 In many unregulated professions people will seek to differentiate themselves and their product to attract business. Some is difference in method, some is just clever (or sometimes stoopid)marketing imo. Very true....and sometimes "What is old is new again"! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kajtek Posted June 27, 2012 Share Posted June 27, 2012 The truth is in realising that each dog is an individual, and methods which work on one dog will not work on another, and being knowledgable and humble enough to know which is which, imho. Wise post/advice as always :). Thank you Jed. I have 3 doglets. They are the same 'breed' but have different needs re training, food, activity level, etc. It takes time, patience and a whole lot of commitment to understand what suits your dog. BTW, I would not have it any other way! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kajtek Posted June 27, 2012 Share Posted June 27, 2012 Funnily enough, a lot of dog training is actually training the owner... *grin* So true T! I think I am almost trained - basic level of course :laugh: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LizT Posted June 27, 2012 Share Posted June 27, 2012 The truth is in realising that each dog is an individual, and methods which work on one dog will not work on another, and being knowledgable and humble enough to know which is which, imho. Wise post/advice as always :). Thank you Jed. I have 3 doglets. They are the same 'breed' but have different needs re training, food, activity level, etc. It takes time, patience and a whole lot of commitment to understand what suits your dog. BTW, I would not have it any other way! Ahhh variety is the spice of life. And don't forget my old friend "trial and error"! :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
m-sass Posted June 27, 2012 Share Posted June 27, 2012 The truth is in realising that each dog is an individual, and methods which work on one dog will not work on another, and being knowledgable and humble enough to know which is which, imho. Yes I agree which should also be the concepts of a good trainer. What annoys me generally marketed by positive type trainers is a statement about how they don't use "shock" collars for instance followed by a spiel about how bad "shock" collars are.......their marketing is all about what they don't use and what they don't like instead of marketing what they can do and what they have achieved. I don't think any one method fits all and all methods and tools from clickers to Ecollars have their place on the dogs who respond to those methods and tools the best. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SkySoaringMagpie Posted June 27, 2012 Share Posted June 27, 2012 In many unregulated professions people will seek to differentiate themselves and their product to attract business. Some is difference in method, some is just clever (or sometimes stoopid)marketing imo. Agree very much with Diva here, and this applies not just to the people trying to make a buck out of it but in ordinary everyday pissing contests at dog clubs, dog events, and worst of all, online. OTOH, I also I think there is an earnest phase that many of us go through (and not just about training). The part of us that is upset by behavioural issues and where they can lead wants desperately to believe that there is some perfect method that if we could only sort it, would magically solve all the ills of dog world. And if we think we've found it, we can get a bit evangelical for the right reasons but with the wrong effect, until we inevitably come up against the dog that doesn't fit. When I run into novice evangelicals now I try to be patient with it, because that was me once. Don't claim I succeed tho', sometimes I still want to bang their heads together. :laugh: Someone said early on to me to deal with the dog in front of you. I think that's a variation on what Jed's posted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Little Gifts Posted June 27, 2012 Share Posted June 27, 2012 It's not just what suits the dog - if the owner doesn't understand the training tool or technique then the dog has no hope long term. When I was a kid you rubbed your dogs nose into its piddle and you hit it with a rolled newspaper if it did something wrong (the newspaper was more for the noise than to hurt them). As a kid though I also remember being told that if the family dog hurt me and made me cry I should do the same back and I did once bite our dogs ear (I was a toddler) after he stole my vegemite toast breakfast. Apparently we were both wailing. It's the same technique we were all taught to get back if our siblings hurt us as well. Dog eat dog! And Puppy School didn't exist. Since becoming an adult I've taken numerous dogs to formal training classes with different trainers over the years (including Puppy School!). Some were with clicker and others not. I will admit to being unco with the clicker so while I understand the concept and think it is great I seem physically incapable of being good at it myself so did not continue using it. I basically click too slow and have not improved (despite my own training!). Not the trainer or the dog's fault but mine. We also had a behaviourist in here who did amichien bonding with us and while some others have poo-pooed it that training concept has made so much sense to us AND to our dogs that we continue to use it and from time to time read back up on it to see if we can do better or refine our approach. For our dogs it seemed like we had started speaking their language. It made a huge difference and it was just so easy to implement. What I like about it the most is I can still spoil the dogs but it just happens to be on my terms and not theirs. Funny thing is that despite the training they (and I) underwent all my dogs have ended up with basically the same skills. And I consider their weaknesses to really be my own. So I would have to say that one size will never fit all so having a variety of training options out there just means there are more resources available to meet the individual needs of dogs and their owners. That can't be a bad thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HugL Posted June 30, 2012 Share Posted June 30, 2012 I look for trainers who are open to ideas and not anti anything. They should have a wealth of knowledge but aren't afraid to admit they need to seek advise themselves if they don't know an answer. I don't care how many courses they've done, I get more by watching how they treat their own dog. I don't like chiefs - they like to be in charge while the indians actually get the job done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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