dogbesotted Posted June 25, 2015 Share Posted June 25, 2015 http://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2015/jun/25/dogs-crating-pet-abuse#comment-54459849 h Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taliecat Posted June 26, 2015 Share Posted June 26, 2015 Wow, I knew there was a bit of controversy over crates, but not that much! Dozer loved being in his crate while it was in the lounge and now drags me to his crate at bedtime. During the week I popped him in his crate while I had a dog free shower and gave him the choice after I'd finished my shower if he wanted to go outside or stay in his crate, he looked at me, looked at the open door to the patio and put his paws back in the crate! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steph M Posted June 26, 2015 Share Posted June 26, 2015 16 hours a day in a crate!?! Sheesh. I can see why that is too much. I also shudder at the mention dogs are left in them unattended while owners work. But with the help of the crate, Dizzy was housetrained in just three months. Three months is a while, we managed without locking Gus in a crate all day in a few weeks. This is a crap article, IMO. It uses poor examples of crate training and doesn't actually present much from either side. Also quoting PETA as a source is minus another 20 points. Haha. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
megan_ Posted June 26, 2015 Share Posted June 26, 2015 It seems to be popular in some areas of the Staes- lock the dogs up for 22 hours, then play with them supervised, then back in the crate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steph M Posted June 26, 2015 Share Posted June 26, 2015 The idea makes me feel a little queasy to be honest. A whole day in a confined space with no company would drive me coco bananas. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YippeeGirl Posted June 26, 2015 Share Posted June 26, 2015 (edited) Circumstances can force it. I live with two bitches that will fight and cause injury to themselves if left together. One also tends to bark quite a bit if left out in the backyard unattended, so she is usually in the crate at night, and if no one is home. Yes, I would rather that the crate was not necessary, and didn't have to be used for extended periods of time, but not everyone has a rural property with dog safe fences and no close neighbours, where their dogs can be outside in pens or yards rather than inside in a crate. Edited to add, no one is locked in the crate for probably anything more than 8 hours. Edited June 26, 2015 by YippeeGirl Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steph M Posted June 26, 2015 Share Posted June 26, 2015 Edited to add, no one is locked in the crate for probably anything more than 8 hours. Totally understand! Your circumstances are a little different, as would be if one was ill or injured. 8 hours is still a lot different to 16+! :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tdierikx Posted June 26, 2015 Share Posted June 26, 2015 I have to play switchy-swapsies with a couple of dogs here that don't get on too... and they love their crates... gives them time to snooze unmolested... lol! T. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YippeeGirl Posted June 26, 2015 Share Posted June 26, 2015 Yes, I certainly don't agree with just locking the dog in a crate all day because you don't have time for it. I always see crates as a tool. They can be a great tool when used properly, but when misused I personally think they do start to cross the line into what I would personally consider neglect/abuse. It's the same as how I hate seeing dogs that are never exercised, socialised, or interacted with in any way, moldering away in someone's backyard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mrs Rusty Bucket Posted June 26, 2015 Share Posted June 26, 2015 So I wonder what all these people who are anti crate think happens to a dog when it goes to the vet? Ie needs to have surgery or observation etc. Wouldn't it be better if it was used to that kind of environment. And pretty sure there is somewhere on the PETA website that says no humans should have pets at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dame Aussie Posted June 26, 2015 Share Posted June 26, 2015 (edited) 16 hours in a crate is quite simply f***ed up. I don't support it at all. Both my dogs were toilet trained within about 3 weeks without using crates. They are also fine at the vets. Edited June 26, 2015 by Dame Aussie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steph M Posted June 26, 2015 Share Posted June 26, 2015 (edited) So I wonder what all these people who are anti crate think happens to a dog when it goes to the vet? Ie needs to have surgery or observation etc. Wouldn't it be better if it was used to that kind of environment. And pretty sure there is somewhere on the PETA website that says no humans should have pets at all. I am not anti-crate as such, but it isn't the way we have chosen to manage out dogs so I can have a go at answering that if you like? Gus was crated at the vet during the day before and after he was desexed, apparently he was quite calm albeit barked to try and snaffle more treats and gave the resident clinic cat a really good grooming through the bars, he has never been crated before or since but if he were really struggling and did not cope I would ask the vet if there were benefits to sedation to take the edge off or if there were other ways to manage him for the duration of his stay. I know a few dogs who are crate trained but will still chew out an IV or bark up a storm, I trust my vets are equipped to handle him if this were the case. The reasons for us not crating are basically that we don't want a crate each dog as a permanent part of our decor, which I will admit is totally selfish on our part! But I will also say that had we had issues that needed addressing I would have looked into it, as it stands the gumnut twins basically have their own couch, come inside, curl up and go to sleep while we do our thing and make dinner etc, so the need has never really arisen. They ride well in the car, we never had toilet training dramas or any real need to be honest! Perhaps we will do things differently next time, perhaps not. No idea! :) I can certainly say I didn't NOT crate because it is cruel when used correctly. It just didn't work for us in our particular circumstances. Edited June 26, 2015 by Steph M Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dame Aussie Posted June 26, 2015 Share Posted June 26, 2015 Same here. Never had the need Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stressmagnet Posted June 26, 2015 Share Posted June 26, 2015 Ernie still sleeps in s locked crate at night. He's still quite destructive and with my recent shoulder surgery, I don't need the big doofus jumping on me to wake me up in the morning. As soon as my shoulder is 100%, I intend to go back to transitioning him to an open door crate at night. That said, he has another crate in the lounge room, where he goes when we are eating. He's taken to going in there voluntarily in the attempt to hurry my dinner prep along as he knows first we eat, then him. Poor deluded baby. The interesting thing he's started up doing is to put himself in there if we've left him alone in the lounge room for some reason. I'm not sure what's with that, but it's pretty sweet of him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pjrt Posted June 26, 2015 Share Posted June 26, 2015 Gruf travels in his crate and sleeps in it the couple of nights a week we are away from home. He didn't really need training as such, he took to it no problem at all. I don't have a crate at home because I don't feel I need it. If it was there I might be tempted to use it, when I actually don't really need to. I really want to add a second dog. I will be doing that with exacting commitment to finding him a companion that he gets along with negating the need for shuffling. I have had the experience of living with dogs that needed to be managed apart. It is nonsense to me and is not what owning dogs should be about. The stress on the dogs was enough for me. The stress on me was more than enough for me and one was rehoused. I honestly would not have a dog if it had to spend the majority of its days locked in the house in a crate. Crates do have their place especially in transitional environments, but I really think they have become a quite abused tool of convenience in this day and age. Unfortunately I can only see this continuing. When I started working with pet dogs 30 yrs ago the only crate trained dogs I knew were show dogs, and definitely not the average pet. Now I talk to more and more pet owners who think it is a quite normal way of managing a dog in a living environment that perhaps should have thought better about having a dog. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dame Aussie Posted June 26, 2015 Share Posted June 26, 2015 I agree. If I had dogs that had to be kept in crates due to fighting or the like, I'd rehome one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dragonwoman Posted June 26, 2015 Share Posted June 26, 2015 Gruf travels in his crate and sleeps in it the couple of nights a week we are away from home. He didn't really need training as such, he took to it no problem at all. I don't have a crate at home because I don't feel I need it. If it was there I might be tempted to use it, when I actually don't really need to. I really want to add a second dog. I will be doing that with exacting commitment to finding him a companion that he gets along with negating the need for shuffling. I have had the experience of living with dogs that needed to be managed apart. It is nonsense to me and is not what owning dogs should be about. The stress on the dogs was enough for me. The stress on me was more than enough for me and one was rehoused. I honestly would not have a dog if it had to spend the majority of its days locked in the house in a crate. Crates do have their place especially in transitional environments, but I really think they have become a quite abused tool of convenience in this day and age. Unfortunately I can only see this continuing. When I started working with pet dogs 30 yrs ago the only crate trained dogs I knew were show dogs, and definitely not the average pet. Now I talk to more and more pet owners who think it is a quite normal way of managing a dog in a living environment that perhaps should have thought better about having a dog. Unfortunately it is the standard system of "management" for some show people and breeders, that's how their dogs "exist" - my two youngest are crated at night, they put themselves to bed when they think it is time, they all love their crates in the car and love holidays in the dog trailer when we go away Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Spotted Devil Posted June 26, 2015 Share Posted June 26, 2015 (edited) It can definitely be abused but used properly they are fantastic. I use crates as part of training (drive and impulse control), as a rotation system when I'm training multiple dogs (although I'm teaching self control with open crates at the moment), as a way of separating pup and adults or bitch in season or when I can't directly supervise (eg baby puppy or kids visiting). If I can put a dog outside or in another part of the house I will and pup would only get put in there for sleeping, travelling or fun games. Maximum 4 hours during the day and pup would be ready for a big sleep after training/exercise. Longer than that and they'd be in a big pen as well. Love being able to crate a youngster next to my bed at night as they always sleep soundly with very little fuss. I don't put my pups in tiny crates either - they have lots of room to move around. Edited June 26, 2015 by The Spotted Devil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Posted June 26, 2015 Share Posted June 26, 2015 16 hours in a crate is quite simply f***ed up. I don't support it at all. Both my dogs were toilet trained within about 3 weeks without using crates. They are also fine at the vets. Yep I agree. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mita Posted June 26, 2015 Share Posted June 26, 2015 I learned a trick from another owner of 2 small dogs. She has roomy crates, with soft bedding & toys set up all the time ... mainly with door open. Her little dogs treat it as their 'own places', day bed etc. They take themselves in, when they like. She always gives any treats inside the crates, so it's seen as a 'good 'place'. No drama to the dogs, then, when she wants them closed up in their crates ... like when tradesman working in the house etc. It's just the same to the dogs. But she isn't in circumstances where they'd regularly have to stay in the crates for hours. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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