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pampa

Maybe Not Rat Bait ?

199 posts in this topic

pampa   

Hi folks :mad

I haven't been around DOL much lately due to feeling pretty shitty...

2 weeks ago, I went downstairs to the underground garage at work to unload a car into our basement and my little pit bull girl who comes to the office with me twice a week, followed as usual...

She rushed off into the garage and came back a minute later licking her chops...

I immediately thought "shit, rat bait" and having read a recent thread on poisons on this forum, considered making her vomit...

I first took a walk around the garage and found no sign of bait. I asked the "concierge" who told me he had not laid rat bait in the garage for about 6 months but that he had put some in private garages, normally closed and locked... After closely expecting her mouth for "remnants" and finding nothing, I decided not to make her vomit.

Anyway, I watched her very closely for 48 hours and she was just fine... I didn't tell my vet, imagining that she'd be OK.

Well, 12 days later, I woke up to find her with black-blue bruises all over her rear end and around her mouth :( Her white skinned tummy showed many red spotches as if a tiny blood vessel had broken, as did her gums. She had a long black bruise under her forearm where she had got tangled in her lead the day before... She often gets "tangled" but NEVER even gets red from it...

Immediate trip to the vet and YES, she is poisoned by rat bait :cry:

Did you all know that rat bait takes 10 to 14 days to react ?... I didn't. I imagined rat bait as being very quick and excrutiatingly painful... I imagined convulsions and screams, and vomiting and all that... Well no, that is NOT the scenario...

That the animal does not suffer (as such) in any way other than immediate bruising at the least knock and of course, internal bleeding that is NOT noticible... The haemoraging leads to anaemia thus lethargy and then eventually to death. Rarely does this cause much pain :rofl:

Anyway, luckily I immediately remembered the episode in the garage and the vet began injecting vitamin K1... I spent the whole day driving from chemist shop to chemist shop trying to find massive doses of the stuff which is not commonly carried at such high dosage. Each time I found a box vit K1 10mg, I had to inject the dog (intra-muscular). 6 injections in all the poor dear, and each injection ended up in a big black bruise :( She was so sweet...

The vet says if she survives the coming week she should be OK.

She has 150mg (tablet form) of vitamin K1 each morning for the next 20 days and a lot of red meat to try and get her red blood cell levels up. I take her temperature twice a day and apart from that, I can only cross my fingers. There is nothing else to do apart from hope.

Outwardly she is "fine" and if she didn't continue to come out in a bruise as soon as she scratches herself or knocks herself on something, you would never know she is deathly ill... She is not allowed to run or play in case she rips something inside her, causing new haemorages :( .

Anyway, I just wanted to let those people who didn't know about the effects of rat bait understand how and what the signs are so as to recognise the symptoms and hopefully get their dog to the vet in time...

I'm begining to hope that my girl only scoffed a small amount of the poison because she is still alive today and no worse than Wednesday when I first noticed the bruises. Her temperature is a bit too low for comfort but she is happy and active and definately not lethargic, hopefully suggesting only minor internal bleeding.

It is needless to say that I regret not making her vomit after the chop-licking episode 2 weeks ago and I feel really shitty that I let her get ill, but unfortunately what is done, is done, and cannot be undone :(

I will keep you updated as time goes on

Edited by pampa

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Lozzie   

I really hope she pulls through for you, she sounds like such a sweet girl. I would have done exactly the same thing, so thanks for sharing that with us.

Keep us posted on how she goes.

Lauren

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ReXy   

omg that is just awfull u poor thing u were not to know u did check her and u found nothing no signs of ill ness so u are not to know.... dogs are so dumb sometime arnt they weill eat the most stupid things,,,,, cross my fingers for her and hope that she will be ok... thinking of you and ur bubba keep us posted on how she goes...

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:rofl: yes..that is one of the problems ..

A dog presents with pale gums,internal bleeding/bruising....and often you can't remember what they ate/did! :mad

I do hope she is ok..every day is a good sign :cry: Poor little girl.

Please people, take care with dogs who catch mice/rats!!These rodents may be dying from eating poison..and the poison could also affect your dog if they eat the rat etc.

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tramissa   

rat bait is such horrible stuff. It should be illegal.

I hope your girl pulls though. She's a tough cookie to get this far. You're doing everything you possibly can - don't let yourself get eaten up by guilt!!

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Erny   

Oh Pampa .... I do hope she'll be ok. I did know about the rat poison being able to take 10-14 days to become symptomatic, but if it makes you feel better, I only found that out about 5 weeks ago.

With all your worry, I'm humbled that you took time out to post in Kal's and my thread - thank you.

Good wishes for a speedy and whole recovery for your girl.

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labsrule   

You poor thing, how terrible for your little girl, you must be pretty worried and stressed. Best wishes for your little girl's recovery. I had no idea that rat bait would take that amount of time to react. :cry: pretty frightening stuff.

I had my own scare with my greedy scavenging black lab in November last year when he ducked down between some rocks at the beach and came up chewing on something and I couldn't get it out of his mouth in time. Anyway within 15-20 mins he started vomitting violently (in the car) and as I was out of my normal area, about an 1½ hours from where I live, I had to find an emergency vet as he continued to vomit, on the footpath, road and in the car again. He was hospitalised on a drip and pumped full of antibiotics and other medications in a life threatening situation as he had some sort of poisioning. Thank god he pulled thru, but took him a couple of weeks to recover and me a lot longer from the stress.:mad

Dont beat yourself up to much as "hindsight" is a wonderful thing. She sounds like a little fighter and is getting the best of treatment. :rofl: Our thoughts are with you and your little girl during this difficult time.

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petmezz   

your por dog and i hop you are doing ok, get out the cotten wool and rap your dog up for a week. hopfully all will be ok sending out good vibes, fingers crossed.

to those that didn't know about the delay in the poisining of animals, please note that in Australia i do beleave we have 2 types of rat bates, their is the fast acting (24 hours) and a slow acting (7 to 14 days) the slow acting ones are more redaly avalable now due to reserch showing rats and mice will not eat the food they can smell on the dead rat/mouse if it has been recently consumed. making the new formular with delayed responce more effective. if any one thinks ther dog has consumed any poisen first call the poisens info line with the product at hand, they will tell you vital info that you and the vet will need to hear, then rush to the vet with the pet and product.

(i lernt this through a scare with 2 different poisens, one rat bate).

hop all goes well for your dog please keep us posted of progress.

my hart goes out to you and your dog

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pampa   

Thank you all for your posts tonight and thanks to everyone for not saying out loud "holy cow, how stupid to let a dog out in a possibly baited area"...

Petmezz, here in France, the rapid action rat bait has almost been abandonned because of the extreme intelligence of rats. You are right, rats have great memories so, if one of the tribe eats something and dies soon after, or if they smell the poison on their dead mate, word spreads very quickly throughout the rat population that "bait = death = don't eat..." It is ineffective almost all over Europe now as the word has spread widely amongst the rodents. I seem to be the only one they forgot to tell, I still believed it was a quick killer and only learned the above at the vets on Wednesdy :rofl:

They now make baits with 12 days "incubation" period whereby the rodents cannot possibly remember which food stuff may have killed their pal....

Apparently the long action rat baits are often coated with a product that induces vomiting in cats and dogs to avoid such poisonings, but the vomit inducing product wears off rather quickly whereby the poison remains indefinately deadly :mad

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morgan   

Rats are cunning little sods - years ago I had an exterminator out due to rats moving in from a demolished poultry farm. He said the older, mature rats will not touch any new food for at least a week - until they can see that none of the youngsters have died from eating it.

So I had to serve up pure mince every night for a week to lull them into a false sense of security, then he put out the baited mince - a very fast acting one, to make it easier to find and destroy the carcasses. Needless to say I moved all the dogs to a friend's place that day!

Hope your girl recovers quickly!

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Did your vet suggest a blood transfusion? Did your vet suggest any dietary suppliments apart from the vit K tablets? Years ago we used to use feramo-d or blud(think thats how it was spelt) these were meant to help with anemia. I know things change in vet medicine and human medicine all the time but it may be worth checking. Hope your pooch gets well soon.

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cactus   

Oh Pampa what a nightmare! I'm sure she will pull through fine with the great care you are taking of her. You are incredibly vigilant, and switched on to have even suspected rat bait when she licked her lips (with mine I would have thought- spider!) and then to put two and two together! Good on you Pampa. :rofl::mad

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This is very timely. On another board, I just read about THREE Border Collies who got into rat bait while visiting someone over the holidays, and this poor person lost ALL THREE. THey ALL died. I cannot fathom, in fact, I can't grasp what she is going through. This is just so horrible.

Julie

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pampa   
This is very timely.  On another board, I just read about THREE Border Collies who got into rat bait while visiting someone over the holidays, and this poor person lost ALL THREE.  THey ALL died.  I cannot fathom, in fact, I can't grasp what she is going through.  This is just so horrible.

Julie

OMG :happydance2: That poor, poor person ! Losing one baby would be dreadful enough but losing all 3 would kill me :happydance: ...

Curlygirl, apart from the massive doses of vitamin K1 (to clog the bleeding) my vet has only suggested a heap of red meat for the red blood cell build-up but not any other type of treatment... He has called me this morning (Sunday) to see how she is and he is obviously relieved and somewhat surprised that she is still alive... He told me however that if she has eaten enough of the vile stuff, the 12 day incubation period means that her whole system is "infected" and there is nothing to be done, no hope...

Despite his words of doom, he did seem to imply her chances were looking good though :champagne:

Thanks again for all of your support...

This morning (it is 11.30am here), she is still "fine"... I can't beleive my luck :cooldance:

Her breath is VERY bad though so I fear that the poison is reacting on her liver. Many of her older bruises have disappeared overnight and her gums, tongue and pallet are still a healthy pink. Her temperature is stable and she is eating like a horse.

The best sign of all is that she wants to play... The trouble is, for her "play" is a really rough form of wrestle where they run around oblivious to everything, banging into walls, stairs, chairs and biting each others throats and hocks unmercifully... So playing is forbidden and I'm keeping busy keeping them occupied with "quite" games...

She still comes out in black-blue bruises as soon as she has the slightest knock though, which is really horrific :cheer:

My vet advised me that even once the initial danger is over, the internal bleeding and resulting odaema can become infected and thus the second "danger" phase kicks in... Operating such an infection is usually impossible due to the blood clotting problem which will last for at least 3 weeks :laugh:

I'm just praying she didn't eat much and that we "caught it" in time...

Edited by pampa

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Erny   
I'm just praying she didn't eat much and that we "caught it" in time...

Pampa - you'll find us all praying with you in one form or another.

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OMG pampa im praying for u to

I had a similar incident with my yellow lab, (he got into snail bait while i was at work one day), i came back from work and went outside to find him and couldn't...... i spent most of the night wandering the street looking for him. I then found him the next morning behind our bush... Dead :happydance2: I then found the empty, chewed and ripped to pieces snail box. it was absoultley terrible.... So i know how you feel and my prayers are with you and your girl. May she make a full recovery and you have many long and happy years with her... i missed out on that with my boy.

Ill keep reading this post and keep track on how shes going.

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