Simply Grand

My goodness

Gotta agree with this. Quinn's done plenty of destructo damage to my stuff in the name of curiosity and entertainment, she's perfectly happy and I've learnt that I have to be careful what she has access to if I don't want stuff wrecked

Those that have experienced young pups actually attacking people, did they also display pretty "normal" behaviour the rest of the time? Nek, do you mean being harassed by other dogs (litter mates) or by people? In my OP situation the puppy would have had pretty controlled human interactions and not been treated inappropriately at all, but the litter would have spent time on their own with and without mum without people watching them so she may have been bullied a bit I suppose. I can certainly see it being learned behaviour in some situations, I gave my 11 week old foster puppy her first little rawhide chew yesterday after she has been here three weeks being told to get lost by my dogs if she got too close when they had a treasure , and she growled when I touched her so I think she has learned that that's what you do (I'll be working on object exchange etc with her to make sure she doesn't become an actual resource guarder - I started yesterday but she completely lost interest in the rawhide and only wanted the treats I had to trade her so it didn't really work!) Btw, the OP isn't about her at all, she hasn't shown me any signs to be worried about.

Thank you guys, keep the comments coming :) Hypothetical puppy would definitely be thoroughly vet checked. ETA - I'm interested from a behavioural point of view and hoping I can learn from the experience of others.

I'm interested in people's knowledge of and experience with aggression towards humans in young puppies. Do you think it exists? What signs would you be worried about? If there are signs are they a reliable indicator of whether the dog will show aggression when older and is it something that can be changed if dealt with correctly? As an example, what would you think in this situation: 8/9 week old puppy who on several occasions over a week has growled quite seriously at humans. On the first occasion puppy is on a lap being patted, suddenly stills, makes and holds eye contact with the person then growls. Recovers and goes back to normal. Second occasion (different person) puppy has been playing and being patted, is then held upright under the "arms" with feet on the floor, growls, not sure about eye contact in this instance. Immediately following this puppy was taken by an experienced person (who did not see first instance but was aware of it), held in same position (under the arms) and growled again. Puppy was then briefly pushed a little (as in not released, held in a couple of different positions) to try and determine the seriousness of the growling - the growling escalated and puppy stilled and gave hard eye contact while still growling. This appears to be deliberate behaviour, not playful puppy growling and not a puppy finding its "voice" and making funny noises. No food or toys present so unlikely to be resource guarding. Possibly the puppy is sick or injured and in pain, if so is this an appropriate response for a puppy this young? Any thoughts much appreciated :)

All these stories are so beautiful! Saxon (now 4 1/2) is my first ever dog, we never had them growing up, always cats and I never thought I was a dog person. Then my psychologist actually suggested that getting a dog might be good to help me with depression, as in having him around as well as getting me out walking and socialising with other people who have dogs. Not knowing a lot about dogs, I decided on a poodle x maltese (as I knew one I really liked ), found a (backyard) breeder who had a newborn litter of apricot "moodles" and the rest is history. Getting Saxon has changed my life, not only giving me a great love of dogs and leading to second and third (pedigree, purebred) dogs within the following 2 years, who together pulled me through the toughest period of my life, but also inspiring me to give up being miserable doing jobs I thought I should do and find a job (working with shelter dogs)and area of study (dog behaviour) that I actually enjoy doing!

"Chase cars together" :laugh:

That was my first thought seeing the pics, def looks DDB x to me! Fantastic work everyone :)

a loud YES from me here . if this boy has life threatening health issues - the professionals can train a dog to assist/work in the best way possible for him and his family. I would think they will also pick a robust and patient dog to cope with the loudness and erratic behaviour .... I feel a trained dog here could be a very useful extra pair of ears, and a nose & eyes could pick up health crises earlier ...plus being a comfort to the little one , and a calming influence on the family ... Absolutely agree with this too. I would almost be inclined to suggest a suitable temperamented and trained Aussie Shepherd... however there is lots of hair around and they wouldn't be under 15kgs.

Wow. That escalated quickly. Why would you be suggesting putting her down so quickly? A young small dog who doesn't like being left alone isn't an instant death sentence is it? Even thinking about rehoming (assuming the owners arent capable of anything further, which is still a big assumption) there are situations that may suit. My grandma lives in a block of units and where she couldn't take her dog, which was rare, next door would take him for the day and spoil him rotten. Or someone who can take him to work/daycare etc. Obviously yes a behaviourist needs to be consulted but why would you suggest talking to the owner about putting her to sleep already? Not sure why thats the first answer suggested to be honest. Understand in some cases its the kindest thing, but hard to assume this is definitely one. I think Terri was saying talk to them about the comment THEY had made about putting her down, as in saying try to show them there are other options, not suggesting the she (Terri) thought it was a good option...

APDT is the Association of Pet Dog Trainers, not breeders (if that's what you were referring to Jed).

They're awesome :D

This.

Hi HW (or anyone else who knows), I understand Tuggeranong dog club is running showing classes, have you heard anything about how they are? Also, do you know if any of the other clubs or anyone else is running them? I'm interested for me but also a colleague has mentioned that someone with a puppy in her puppy class is interested in showing but doesn't know of any classes and their breeder is in Sydney so can't really assist. Thanks :)

Big hugs to you Kirislin and as much chicken as she wants to beautiful Kibah

When you say a marker I am assuming you mean a word, what would you suggest? I do behave like a crazy person when she does something right I am sure done people think I am a crazy old lady with a little dog. "Yes" is a word people often use, including me, although I find a clicker quicker and more effective. Try and keep it short, sharp and upbeat when you say it and keep your tone consistent. To start with you need to "charge" the marker, or make the association with the really yummy treat (I often use cheese in tiny pieces to teach a new behaviour), you just say the word, shove a treat in their mouth, repeat repeat repeat. After lots of reps say the word when she isn't looking at your face but is still there in front of you, watch for her to look at you expecting the treat then give it to her. Once she's doing that she's made the association so you can start to use the marker to teach her things :)

It sounds like you aren't actually rewarding her for walking nicely, you stop her, ask her to do something else like sit or heel THEN reward her. In her mind she's being rewarded for sitting or moving into heel when you ask her and has no idea you actually want her to be not pulling while she's walking along. Get yourself a clicker or condition a REALLY strong marker word and mark and reward her every time the lead happens to be loose. It's important to use a marker rather than just treats with this otherwise she has to stop, come over to you then get the treat so she has no idea that it was actually the loose lead that earned her the reward :) As well as marking and rewarding every time she happens to have a loose lead while you're moving, use stopping without saying or doing anything when she is pulling, just stand still until she moves herself into a position where the lead slackens then, still without saying anything, start walking. If she keeps the lead loose for another split second after you've started moving then mark and reward. If she immediately puts tension on the lead again stop without saying anything and repeat. A good way to teach her to pay attention to where you are going (and therefore want her to go) is to do lots of sudden direction changes using a super excited voice to encourage her over to where you are now. As she changes direction and moves to catch up to you the lead will automatically be loose and you have an opportunity to mark and reward her. The key to this part is being super exciting (even if you do sound like a crazy person :D )

Sorry Perse, a fight obviously isn't funny but.... I can picture you looking around desperately, seeing the watermelon and chucking it into the melee. The girls were probably too surprised to keep going!

May I just say some RSPCA branches do work hard to match their dogs to the right homes, do offer ongoing support with advice and training at no extra charge and do take their dogs back if at any time if necessary.

What a beautiful post. And gorgeous dogs too :)

Hahaha, poor hubby... "I really did walk 8kms!" "yes dear, of course you did" :laugh: 8kms walking would be fine for a fit Sheltie I'd think, and as you say you'd already built up her fitness. As long as she didn't collapse afterwards I'd probably encourage it.

The instructor of Saxon and Riley's puppy preschool was a vet nurse at the time and she had excellent behaviour and training knowledge, she ran the classes beautifully. She now works as a behaviourist and trainer. The trouble is it's hard for owners who are not that experienced to know whether their Instructor has the knowledge and is telling them the right things or not. I think it's important for owners to remember that it is still their dog and of they or their puppy is not comfortable with something they have every right to move out of the situation or do something else. It takes a little bit of time and experience to realise this and be comfortable doing it, now that I'm teaching classes I've told them this and I can see its taken the pressure off some people whose puppies wouldn't always do what they were asked or were "misbehaving". I also tell them that they always need to be watching their puppy to make sure it is not getting uncomfortable, can move away if worried etc, and we do controlled meetings between puppies and talk about body language. Sometimes people don't yet understand their dog's body language so they don't realise their puppy is scared/frustrated/tired/being inappropriate to others etc etc and that is where I definitely think it is the instructor's job to,step in and tell whoever's involved to move this pup, that pup or all of them away because of XXX. 1.5 hours is definitely going to make it difficult, puppies just cannot concentrate that long! Our classes are 1 hour and by the end most pups have lost it, I try to do easy/fun things towards the end of class like calming/handling, playing on mini agility equipment (to experience new things without it being scary) and saying brief on lead hellos between suited pups.

This sort of indulgence really annoys me, too. I have a tiny little dog (3.5kg) who is very reactive and whenever I see dogs coming towards us when we are out walking, I will shorten her lead and distract her with treats. If that doesn't work and she "goes off her rocker", people always laugh their heads off. A couple of times over the years, I've said: you wouldn't be laughing if she was a Rottweiler or similar. They just don't get it. That said, a trainer should get it and should be instructing the owners of the little dogs (and children) accordingly. People do it with Riley too (7kg Sheltie), he can be reactive with younger dogs no matter what size they are and people always thinks its funny that he's going off at their large puppy

I lol'd too at how you told the story :) It does sound like chaos! Agree with all of the above.

I like it. I imagine they'll feature their "less desirable"/longer term residents who don't necessarily appeal to people looking online or walking the shelter but who actually have nice 'personalities' and are very loveable when you meet them. They've said you can't adopt on the day and it doesn't sound like they're taking names, just giving the dogs' info out and people have to follow up by going to the shelter if they are serious. As long as they select dogs who,wont be stressed by the experience and manage things carefully I think it's a good innovation.