This Is A Bit Scary

[~Anne~]

I can only see the benefits in the merger.

PetBarn are not a tacky little pet shop operation selling animals in a mall. Combining the care and maintenance - health and retail - can only reap benefits in my view. Instead of buying high priced goods in a veterinary clinic, the range and price would be expanded and the choice far better. This means you get a variety of prices, it opens up the market on price.

Why would you keep health care and medical care separate? Both are so intertwined. The health care industry for humans is also linked very heavily to medical care. It's logical.

Everything I've heard about Greencross has been posisitve so far.

Edited December 17, 2013 by ~Anne~

[~Anne~]

There was a British documentary made a couple of years ago about a chain of vets - think it was Greencross. They had evidence that they had been performing unnecessary procedures etc etc, none of it was good ...

I doubt it was Greencross. They originated in QLD. They're an Australian company and I doubt they're in the UK.

In fact here's a tip - the Australian Financial Review predicts share prices in Greencross will continue to rise. They've had something like a 100% increase over the past 12 months and the merger with PetBarn is apparently going to see more increases. I'd be out buying shares if I had the money.

Edited December 17, 2013 by ~Anne~

[tdierikx]

At what stage will the ACCC step in and say they have too many clinics/outlets? Coles/Woolies are only allowed a maximum 36% of total grocery stores for example - to allow for competetive practices to keep prices affordable - will we see the same for vet clinic conglomerates, or will they be allowed to eventually hold a majority share of the market?

T.

[~Anne~]

You don't think you're being a little alarmist?

According to the BoS there were more than 2300 clinics and that was over 13 years ago. I assume there has been an increase since then. Let's say for arguments sake there has been no increase in vet clinics though.

Greencross would have to own more than 800 clinics to get to 36% 'if' that was the capped amount. If you actually look at how many they have, there are less than 100 practices.

Edited December 18, 2013 by ~Anne~

[Loving my Oldies]

I certainly don't think that Greencross vets have a monopoly on potentially over servicing

Of course they don't, but when a practice manager/vet has signed a contract guaranteeing certain KPI and whose remuneration is subject to the rise and fall of share prices, then the potential for over-servicing becomes so much the greater

..... and many good things come from being able to have cost sharing as they can buy supplies etc in larger quantities and spread through out the net work.

It's called "Economies of Scale" and I reckon it is one of the greatest furphies perpetrated on the consumer and society in general. It means fewer jobs, less regulation, less choice, etc etc. Yes, it works for a while, but reach a certain size and all the good things that are supposed to happen are cancelled out.

[~Anne~]

Greencross are not the only ones who have a network of clinics and, in fact, they're not the only ones who have pet supplies and vet clinics. There is another I believe with PetVet and PetStock combining.

There is even a specialised service group called Veterinary Buyers Group who buy clinics.

You might also want to look at The Vet Group and Vet Share.

There is another quickly growing group as well but I can't recall what their name is. I've seen them advertising practice management positions and similar.

[_PL_]

edit re the pitfalls of buying power. Sorry Anne, missed your post above.

Like PP. The franchisees could only buy from the one company, this company with it's promised buying power was also owned by their franchisor.

He held their contracts, told them the rules and got his profit at both ends.

Then it all fell over.

Edited December 18, 2013 by Powerlegs

[Kavik]

VetFriends also has lots of clinics

[~Anne~]

Greencross isn't a franchise.

In Sydney, we also have VetFriends.

(Edit: snap Kavic)

In fact, I'm not sure that any of the groups are franchises.

Edited December 18, 2013 by ~Anne~

[Steve]

http://www.greencrossvet.com.au/Corporate/Succession-Planning.aspx

[tdierikx]

Kind of reminds me of the way some of the human medical centres sprang up in the 80's and made some people obscenely rich - but the care actually given in those places felt like a processing centre more than a doctor's surgery/practice... and still does today...

T.

[~Anne~]

Yes, there are some lessons to be learnt from history, but you're talking lessons of 30 years ago. :laugh: We forget how long ago it actually was sometimes!

Besides, that was a very different business case to what we are discussing here.

I don't think we have anything to fear in all honesty.

[tdierikx]

The thing is though Anne... when do we start to worry? When they get upwards of 200 clinics on board? 300? 400? More? When they start undercutting smaller clinics in order to put them out of business, so that they then have the monopoly in certain areas?

It all starts innocently enough - a slick business model, and lots of dosh floating around for those willing to do pretty much anything to get their hands on it...

T.

[kelpiecuddles]

It all starts innocently enough - a slick business model, and lots of dosh floating around for those willing to do pretty much anything to get their hands on it...

...and then bam, they're Coles Myer!

[~Anne~]

Why does there have to be a time to worry at all? I cant fathom this fear of new and different approaches.

You talk like they're devil spawn. :laugh: You surely can't be serious.

[tdierikx]

Woolies are worse... they could have decimated Coles a few years ago, bt the ACCC wouldn't let them buy more stores...

T.

[Loving my Oldies]

Yes, there are some lessons to be learnt from history, but you're talking lessons of 30 years ago. :laugh: We forget how long ago it actually was sometimes!

Besides, that was a very different business case to what we are discussing here.

I don't think we have anything to fear in all honesty.

Well 30 years on and it is even easier for a business to swallow up others. The profit motive is stronger, the regulations are useless, communication is instantanious, the people who are supposed to guarding against aggressive and inappropriate marketing are part of the problem.

Perhaps you can explain to we simpletons the difference. The last time I looked, a business case was a business case whether you were selling bananas, property, uranium, or veterinary services.

Is there a profit in it? How can we maximise that profit? How can we get around any strictures imposed by the regulators without drawing attention to it? Etc etc etc.

Edited December 18, 2013 by Danny's Darling

[Little Gifts]

There are a few Anvets here in Brissie but I don't know how they are linked other than they use similar signage. Peiradise (SPRQ) uses one and the vets seem to make their own decisions on what they charge and what services they provide. The clinic is not all blinged up and providing an array of goodies to buy. It looks nothing like my local Anvet. Can't comment on their services as I don't use it but I have been in there once with someone else. Plus it is all glass windows and glossy surfaces so you can see it from the street.

[Guest Ams]

There are a few Anvets here in Brissie but I don't know how they are linked other than they use similar signage. Peiradise (SPRQ) uses one and the vets seem to make their own decisions on what they charge and what services they provide. The clinic is not all blinged up and providing an array of goodies to buy. It looks nothing like my local Anvet. Can't comment on their services as I don't use it but I have been in there once with someone else. Plus it is all glass windows and glossy surfaces so you can see it from the street.

The guy who created Greencross used to be part of the Anvet set (or so I believe). When I first arrived in Brisbane I was seeing a vet an Anvet practice in Bracken Ridge and when I moved south side I changed to Anvet Moorooka which is where the team who created Greencross started.

eta: There are some very good vets within Greencross but it is like comparing a small medical clinic to an 24/7 medical facility. In one you can always expect to see the same professional, in the other its a bit of a gamble if the person is actually qualified for the job at all. I will still refer clients to Greencross but if they don't want to travel to our preferred vet but I am very specific about which vets they should see.

There is also a small collection of vet clinics in the Ipswich area owned by one vet and he has left me waiting outside the clinic after hours with a puppy with a temp of over 41deg because it was just a rescue puppy. When I finally got allowed into the clinic he was very blase about getting a drip into the pup for meds and to help bring temp down. He started to panic after about 40 mins when he realised I was right and finding veins on a sick shar pei puppy is not easy and no you can't use the neck cause you can't find the bloody thing through the wrinkles. We did finally find a vein and a drip was set and puppy had to be admitted. He then refused to believe there was such an illness as Shar Pei Fever, refused to hand the puppy over to me the following morning even though I was transfering him to my own preferred vet who did actually believe I knew what I was talking about. I was not impressed. 24 hours later with the puppy getting sicker because they had taken the drip out and then couldn't put another one back in. He rang and apologised and admitted there was such a disease. I lost my sh*t and drove straight there, removed the pup and have never been back, nor will I.

Edited December 18, 2013 by Ams

[~Anne~]

That's terrible Ams.

I'm lucky in that I've never really had a 'bad' vet. I've had some poor experiences with vets but none like that. I think those in larger cities are better off with the choice they have, in small towns and regional areas you have to go with the vet you have. In this way, I think networked groups may help.