De Barking Dogs

[Inevitablue]

So you can't show debarked dogs? Learn something new every day!

Who would have thunk it huh.

I'm only new to showing (woohoo, first BOB last night :D ) but I've seen numerous dogs around the rings debarked. Not easy to hide if the dog was a barker, now making minimal noise with the distinctive sound.

Is it one of those things that isn't really enforced? If they sign the stat dec are they covered?

[espinay2]

If barking is natural and shouldn't be restricted, then debarking is actually better for the dog than taking other measures to stop the dog barking, as a debarked dog can still bark as much as it wants. I have seen some very happy debarked dogs who during previous attempts to curb barking using other (supposedly 'more humane' methods) became incredibly stressed by not being allowed to bark. Once debarked and barking when they wanted they were happy dogs again.

Edited November 18, 2011 by espinay2

[Fordogs]

I have a debarked dog. I tried everything possible. She is just such a very happy, ulta energetic happy, dog but she had to tell the world how happy she was all the time, barking accompanied all of the good thing in life I was growing to really dislike her. Finally at 5 years old I thought that I could no longer live with her so I set of to find a vet who would debark her.

Yeah Yeah Should have done it long ago, she still barks all the time BUT atleast I can tolerate it now that she is MUTED(not quite).

[jr_inoz]

So you can't show debarked dogs? Learn something new every day!

Who would have thunk it huh.

I'm only new to showing (woohoo, first BOB last night :D ) but I've seen numerous dogs around the rings debarked. Not easy to hide if the dog was a barker, now making minimal noise with the distinctive sound.

Is it one of those things that isn't really enforced? If they sign the stat dec are they covered?

You're in NSW - I suspect it is like SA where debarking is not an issue. (Although there are quite a few vets who wont do it)

Debarked dogs allowed to do everything here (show, agility, obedience, go to the park - whatever)

[Flaves]

You cant take your dog that is debarked out in public in vic that is how stupid the law is :mad

I am all for it, if everything else has been tried.

[Sooky]

I'm just back from dog training and was coming on to start a thread about debarking as I had never heard of it before and I just found out this morning that one of the dogs in the class has been debarked (she sounds like a seal when she barks now very odd), the owner was saying loads of show people do it!! My initial thought was it seemed quite cruel but after reading through this thread I can see why it may be necessary in extreme circumstances!

[Dame Aussie]

You cant take your dog that is debarked out in public in vic that is how stupid the law is :mad

I am all for it, if everything else has been tried.

I know, what a ridiculous, redundant law

[LizT]

You cant take your dog that is debarked out in public in vic that is how stupid the law is :mad

I am all for it, if everything else has been tried.

I know, what a ridiculous, redundant law

Just one of many in this State. Also it may be redundant but it's a NEW law!

Edited November 19, 2011 by LizT

[LizT]

I'm just back from dog training and was coming on to start a thread about debarking as I had never heard of it before and I just found out this morning that one of the dogs in the class has been debarked (she sounds like a seal when she barks now very odd), the owner was saying loads of show people do it!! My initial thought was it seemed quite cruel but after reading through this thread I can see why it may be necessary in extreme circumstances!

Also of interest is that there are various levels of de-barking AND that it isn't always permanent.

Some dogs have their voice altered to a lower range, something that leaves them with a husky/raspy voice. Some are left with no voice at all.

I have heard of cases where after time the altered voice has returned to full pitch.

[Christina]

As long as the dog is operated on by a vet & given good pain relief & after care it is better than the alternatives like dumped in pound, put to sleep etc.

I wouldn't do it merely because the dog got on my nerves, animal & dog noises don't bother me much, but if it was a problem for others & it got threatening then what other choices are there if training won't work ?

It is nasty sounding & a horrid thought but maybe not so bad really as the last resort.

[Crysti_Lei]

You cant take your dog that is debarked out in public in vic that is how stupid the law is :mad

I am all for it, if everything else has been tried.

if you recall the threads on here then that case was happening, the Law educated DOlers stated time and time again that while the actual laws said something about "Displaying De-barked dogs", in legal jargon it was actually quite clear that it mean showing. They kept saying it, and every one kept ignoring it.

You can take you debarked dog out in public, but you cannot show them unless they were debarked by Victorian law where all the alternatives have been tried. In the case mentioned this wasn't done, the dogs were debarked in NSW, perfectly legally there, but not for Victoria. it was an absolute money/time/energy wasting witchhunt.

[WreckitWhippet]

I have no problems with it and wish some owners would make it their first resort, rather than their last. If the dogs exercise and companionship needs are being met, then I have no issues with it at all.

It's not cruel, it's a simple op, Owners are more than happy to desex to prevent unwanted puppies and no mess, so why not debark to prevent unwanted noise.

[Miss B]

Also of interest is that there are various levels of de-barking AND that it isn't always permanent.

Some dogs have their voice altered to a lower range, something that leaves them with a husky/raspy voice. Some are left with no voice at all.

The procedure is exactly the same, it just depends on the recovery and the individual dog as to what sort of result is achieved. I had my boy done, and stayed with him throughout the entire procedure - it's very simple. Two small pieces of tissue are removed and it is far less invasive than a spay or even a castrate. I kept my boy isolated and sedated during the 10-day recovery period and the result was excellent - no voice whatsoever. Dogs who are allowed to bark throughout recovery will often be left with a raspy, husky sounding bark.

[yarracully]

Wasn't there a case where a breeder was prosecuted for debarking dogs? I thought it was illegal unless all other avenues had been proven to have failed. It may be different in each State perhaps?

different in each state. Not an issue in SA

You will get in trouble in Vic if you send your dog to SA and get it de-barked there.

I am not sure what happens if you purchase an already de-barked dog and then take it to Vic.

No issue providing the dog is debarked in accordance with the law of the state it came from and the dog has never lived in Vic prior to procedure. If however its a dog that has lived in Vic and moved to another state then debarked and moved back then there is a problem. Becomes a concern for those that move around the country due to work transfers etc.

[yarracully]

So you can't show debarked dogs? Learn something new every day!

You can in every other state except Victoria. Legally that is. Also you can take a debarked dog from NSW or any other state into Vic to show it. again providing the dog has never been resident in Victoria

Edited November 20, 2011 by yarracully

[Trisven13]

We have owned many, many dogs over the course of our lives and currently have 6 dogs. Never thought I would de-bark a dog but we de-barked my husband's Deerhound as he barked all the time and LOUDLY. We had tried many, many things beforehand without success - the bastard has since taught himself to bark differently and still barks but it is not as loud AND we no longer live in suburbia. I've since spoken with deerhound breeders who have told me that there are a small number of deerhounds who are really bad barkers and we just got unlucky enough to get one. He recovered from the debarking quicker than the desexing.

[Souff]

Also of interest is that there are various levels of de-barking AND that it isn't always permanent.

Some dogs have their voice altered to a lower range, something that leaves them with a husky/raspy voice. Some are left with no voice at all.

The procedure is exactly the same, it just depends on the recovery and the individual dog as to what sort of result is achieved. I had my boy done, and stayed with him throughout the entire procedure - it's very simple. Two small pieces of tissue are removed and it is far less invasive than a spay or even a castrate. I kept my boy isolated and sedated during the 10-day recovery period and the result was excellent - no voice whatsoever. Dogs who are allowed to bark throughout recovery will often be left with a raspy, husky sounding bark.

Thank you Miss B. You have answered a question that I have been asking myself for years: "Why are some dogs totally silent after de-barking and yet others sound like Neville Wran?"

All the debarked dogs I have met are quite happy and you are right, it is a very minor procedure.

Hence it is staggering that it is treated as a criminal act in the regressive southern states.

Souff

[Chris the Rebel Wolf]

I have mixed feelings... I admit my kneejerk reaction was 'No way, barking is natural and shouldn't be restricted in that way' but after reading on I am a bit conflicted. Indeed there seem to be some circumstances where it has been used to good effect. I couldn't do it to a dog I owned, but I do see the sense in debarking if other measures fail and there are chances of rehoming, baiting, or being PTS. Overall I will reserve judgement until I have learned more.

Yeah, but so is reproduction.

We quite happily desex our pets using much more invasive surgery to debarking. I have a desexed bitch here. The reason she was desexed was, ultimately, to make my life easier

I have no problems with someone debarking their dogs. It can ultimately make the owner's, the neighbours' and the council's lives easier.

You could probably make the argument that desexing also benefits the dog as well but of course that is debatable topic with lots of pros and cons in itself. But for that same reason I would remain wary until I knew more about the procedure myself. There was a time when everybody desexed and said it was a routine operation and few people had ever found problems with it. Now there seems to be a lot more info available, after it's been common practice for how long.

It's very interesting to read people's experiences though and I still think that while I wouldn't do it I understand why some people have.

[Guest lavendergirl]

Have there been any studies done on whether dogs are aware that they are not generating any noise when barking after undergoing this procedure?

[Rysup]

Vast majority of my dogs are debarked - none are silent. I would not like a silent dog, we had one stay with us once, and if she got into trouble you never knew, because you could not hear her.

The dogs know no differently, they still bark, and live normal lives. I do not see the issue? It keeps my neighbours happy, it keeps my OH happy. Win win really.

I now have a few dogs who are not debarked, and life is going to get very difficult now we cannot do it without a council order. And THAT I try to avoid at all costs, I do not want council & the RSPCA noising around in my business!!!!!!!

Edited November 20, 2011 by Rysup