Head Of The Piaa Caught In The Act.

[Nekhbet]

It's SO not about the fact that the cat is dead. It's got nothing to do with hunting magazines. This is about the president of PIAA.

And what he's holding in his hand is not a pet - its a feral animal that is destroying our environment. I think he's smart enough to know the difference between the two. And more people bashing him should be too. The two things are totally separate and different and you can't compare him helping eradicate destructive feral animals with management of pets.

I hunt rabbits but I have a pet one that gets spoiled rotten despite his miserable nature.

Edited March 9, 2012 by Nekhbet

[gillbear]

My take on the photo is that it shows his pride in the skill of the dog and the program he has built, and quite rightly so. The only people who should be hanging their heads in shame are those contributing to the feral cat problem.

[yellowgirl]

My take on the photo is that it shows his pride in the skill of the dog and the program he has built, and quite rightly so. The only people who should be hanging their heads in shame are those contributing to the feral cat problem.

and one of those contributors would be an association that promotes the sale and impulse buying of undesexed kittens in petshops ...

[casowner]

Some of those members are promoting rescue groups and rescue animals so tarring them all with the same brush can have negative consequences on rescue animals. Generalising about an Industry is not productive perhaps aiming negativity at those that are physically adding to the issue may be more beneficial.

I have emailed the PIAA about the negative publicity and the impact it may have on their members (of which I am no longer a part of for my own reasons)and they are supportive of their President. I know Steve and I know how passionate he is about training dogs and the protection of the environment and native animals and this is a very unfortunate picture of him. However going into the freezer of a shelter and seeing sulo bins full of euthanased animals - strays, hand overs and owners requests is a far more upsetting image to me. The outrage that Steve's photo has caused has ignited a huge emotive response maybe people should be made more aware of what happens to the animals once they run out of options in a shelter and evoke the same emotion to help reduce the tragedy.

Many of the feral cats that they are trying to eradicate have probably been bred from farm cats not pet shops as there aren't too many rural pet shops that would sell/give away kittens.

Edited March 9, 2012 by millbrooksprings

[~Anne~]

I find the photo offensive and the lack of judgement shown by the pigs in the photo astounding. It could be a rabbit for all I care and I would still feel the same revulsion. The fact that it is a cat and that one person has been identified as the President of the PIAA just adds another angle to the issue.

There are no surprises however in the kind of people defending the offense the photo has caused. In fact, I expected nothing less from some.

[Greytmate]

My take on the photo is that it shows his pride in the skill of the dog and the program he has built, and quite rightly so. The only people who should be hanging their heads in shame are those contributing to the feral cat problem.

and one of those contributors would be an association that promotes the sale and impulse buying of undesexed kittens in petshops ...

Exactly.

There is a feral cat problem.

It is caused by undesexed cats.

PIAA members sell a lot of undesexed cats. They sell them on impulse, and therefore do nothing to ensure that cat will be looked after properly. The cats get pregnant and have kittens, and there are people that think that the way to get rid of an unwanted cat is to take it out to the bush where it can look after itself. They wouldn't even consider taking it to a shelter.

Best agricultural practice now is not to keep farm cats and many farmers got rid of them years ago. The feral problem is partly caused by uncommitted cat owners that didn't think when buying the cat and don't want to spend money having the cat desexed.

If PIAA started tackling the feral cat problem with a prevention strategy, it wouldn't be so offensive seeing them enjoying the sporty-fun side of feral cat eradication.

[casowner]

I find the photo offensive and the lack of judgement shown by the pigs in the photo astounding. It could be a rabbit for all I care and I would still feel the same revulsion. The fact that it is a cat and that one person has been identified as the President of the PIAA just adds another angle to the issue.

There are no surprises however in the kind of people defending the offense the photo has caused. In fact, I expected nothing less from some.

I am curious what "kind" of people are these?

[dasha]

That photo isn't about promoting the PIAA or anything.

It could have been Steve Irwin holding up the dead cat because its about the conservation of native wildlife not a promotional exercise for PIAA. The fuss is made purely because certain people want to make political statements and try to influence the general population that the subject is in the wrong............... Its a lot like our politicians, in order to make them seem better is to find fault with someone else.

Conservation has an ugly part - controlling/eradicating populations is sometimes involved. Not pretty but someone has to do it.

This image with the cat substituted for a cane toad or fox or rabbit would have been brushed off as common practice and a necessary job. Things become emotional once people can make a link between the species being killed and one that lives with them.

The photos was taken in the context of a training exercise where Steve has been employed BY THE GOVERNMENT to train dogs to assist in the care of the feral cat population IN THE KIMBERLY'S. This is not happening in the local park where Fluffy from the petshop jumped the back fence and caught a pigeon and had a litter of kittens because it was sold undesexed. This is multigeneration FERAL cats that have probably never seen humans for decades and are creating havoc with their excellent hunting adaptations in killing the native animals. These are not a result of pet shops selling kittens to people in the cities.

Good on him for not being too scared to let people see what he does. He also sources dogs from pounds and rescue shelters to train for jobs and the ones he takes are more than likely the ones that would have been too hard to rehome so really, there is no perfect world and good on him for trying to do something with his dog training skills, resources and experience that can hopefully help our country in more ways than one.

[Cheyd]

That photo isn't about promoting the PIAA or anything.

It could have been Steve Irwin holding up the dead cat because its about the conservation of native wildlife not a promotional exercise for PIAA. The fuss is made purely because certain people want to make political statements and try to influence the general population that the subject is in the wrong............... Its a lot like our politicians, in order to make them seem better is to find fault with someone else.

Conservation has an ugly part - controlling/eradicating populations is sometimes involved. Not pretty but someone has to do it.

This image with the cat substituted for a cane toad or fox or rabbit would have been brushed off as common practice and a necessary job. Things become emotional once people can make a link between the species being killed and one that lives with them.

The photos was taken in the context of a training exercise where Steve has been employed BY THE GOVERNMENT to train dogs to assist in the care of the feral cat population IN THE KIMBERLY'S. This is not happening in the local park where Fluffy from the petshop jumped the back fence and caught a pigeon and had a litter of kittens because it was sold undesexed. This is multigeneration FERAL cats that have probably never seen humans for decades and are creating havoc with their excellent hunting adaptations in killing the native animals. These are not a result of pet shops selling kittens to people in the cities.

Good on him for not being too scared to let people see what he does. He also sources dogs from pounds and rescue shelters to train for jobs and the ones he takes are more than likely the ones that would have been too hard to rehome so really, there is no perfect world and good on him for trying to do something with his dog training skills, resources and experience that can hopefully help our country in more ways than one.

Like!!

Said so much betterer than I could

[A-B-C]

Have discovered this thread too late and haven't read the whole lot. Please forgive me

indigirl pretty much sums it up for me.

I have to wonder if the OP has ever encountered a feral cat in real life, they are not sweet cuddly creatures at all. I have 6 indoor cats myself and I love them, but they are so different to feral cats they seem Ike a different species.

Hunting is a sport, I've hunted in years gone by for roos, feral goats and rabbits. Loved it. I still love seeing experienced hunting dogs working together to bring down an animal much bigger than they are and quite capable of killing them.

I live out west where feral animals are a huge problem. I have NO issue with ppl hunting them, or with them hunting other animals for food for themselves or their dogs. I mean is the OP against fishing as well?

I have to say tho i think it's much easier to be anti hunting when you live in the city and don't ever actually encounter feral animals or witness the destruction they've caused.

I don't have an issue with the pic myself. Hunters are allowed to enjoy the success of their hunt.

[Sheridan]

Really? I've seen him in person as well as on the news, and he seems like a really good dog trainer to me, as well as a pleasant person to be around. Nothing wrong with the way he trains dogs, and he trains dogs for conservation work all over the world. I don't really see how anyone could have a negative opinion of him.

I don't enjoy looking at that photo, but I don't find it "sick" (and I love cats, we have 7). If you kill pests for a living of course you can take pride in your work. That doesn't mean you're not a nice person or that you don't love animals. I know people who work for the RSPCA who euthanise animals every day, and they love animals and are really nice people. It's just a necessary evil.

I think it's the irony, as someone else noted, that he's the head of an organisation that sells undesexed cats yet he's out hunting down the feral ones. Nevermind the photo, the hypocrisy is not a good look.

[Her Majesty Dogmad]

Really? I've seen him in person as well as on the news, and he seems like a really good dog trainer to me, as well as a pleasant person to be around. Nothing wrong with the way he trains dogs, and he trains dogs for conservation work all over the world. I don't really see how anyone could have a negative opinion of him.

I don't enjoy looking at that photo, but I don't find it "sick" (and I love cats, we have 7). If you kill pests for a living of course you can take pride in your work. That doesn't mean you're not a nice person or that you don't love animals. I know people who work for the RSPCA who euthanise animals every day, and they love animals and are really nice people. It's just a necessary evil.

I think it's the irony, as someone else noted, that he's the head of an organisation that sells undesexed cats yet he's out hunting down the feral ones. Nevermind the photo, the hypocrisy is not a good look.

Spot on Sheridan. He may be a good dog trainer but as the head of a major organisation based on the pet industry (and therefore a major contributor to the need for a rescue industry), he really should get his head out of the sand and go visting some of the pounds on a weekly basis or talk to the rescue groups that regularly take surrenders of petshop puppies, bought on a whim. I've had one recently ... bought from a Chatswood petshop but oops - owner found that job overseas just after buying the puppy. The thought that the dog would actually live for about another 16 yrs never entered their head.

Edited March 10, 2012 by dogmad

[Kavik]

You know he does source some of his working scent detection dogs from the pound, so he is aware of the problem.

[Her Majesty Dogmad]

You know he does source some of his working scent detection dogs from the pound, so he is aware of the problem.

But he denies that petshops are an issue.

[dog_fan]

You know he does source some of his working scent detection dogs from the pound, so he is aware of the problem.

But he denies that petshops are an issue.

Does he? or does he deny PIAA pet shops are the issue?

[dog_fan]

here is what it says on the PIAA site:

PIAA pet stores stamp out puppy farms and guarantee dogs for life

Posted: Tuesday, 6 March 2012 | By: SiteAdmin

The PIAA policy, effective in NSW from 1 October 2012, guarantees that:

Dogs purchased from PIAA member retail stores are sourced from PIAA approved breeders who meet animal welfare standards and whose operations are subject to independent audit by a veterinarian each year.

Any dog purchased from a PIAA member that is subsequently abandoned by its owner will be re-homed and saved from euthanasia. The first state to implement PIAA re-homing is NSW, where PIAA has partnered with RSPCA NSW.

here is the full article http://piaa.net.au/news/piaa-pet-stores-stamp-out-puppy-farms-and-guarante/

I suppose this isn't talking about cats though

Edited March 10, 2012 by dog_fan

[Sheridan]

You know he does source some of his working scent detection dogs from the pound, so he is aware of the problem.

But he denies that petshops are an issue.

Does he? or does he deny PIAA pet shops are the issue?

Well, given this is about cats, I wonder what his stance is on PIAA breeder approved pet shop cats? Presumably, they don't wander even if they have stupid owners and therefore don't have kittens or sire litters?

[percyk]

\

ferals are a problem no doubt and something has to be done about them...no doubt

but

anyone who is taking photos of dead feral cat trophies >>>??

i dont understand how u can love dogs but not other animals

you may not like them

you might find them pests

but to actually be grinning triumphantly over a catch....whether it was meant for the public eye or not...this is disturbing

no animal chooses to be feral

no animal chooses to do anything but what nature intended it to do: hunt and survive

if youre going to kill an animal because it is a pest or a danger...then do so quickly and without the flourish

surely the police dont take photos of each other holding up the carcass of a dog theyve had to shoot?

what would the public think?

surely they too take a pride in their job...but do they take joy in actually taking an animals life no matter the circumstances? maybe there are individuals who do...but if there was any photographic evidence then how would we all feel?

what a shame

i have heard this man speak at a dog event once

he wont have my support now

Edited March 10, 2012 by percyk

[mita]

Any dog purchased from a PIAA member that is subsequently abandoned by its owner will be re-homed and saved from euthanasia. The first state to implement PIAA re-homing is NSW, where PIAA has partnered with RSPCA NSW.

here is the full article http://piaa.net.au/news/piaa-pet-stores-stamp-out-puppy-farms-and-guarante/

I suppose this isn't talking about cats though

I earlier said my piece on this topic. Poor taste behaviour in that photo, irrespective of the necessity.

So I also went looking to see what happens in another setting... the selling of cats in PIAA-endorsed pet stores..

But I, too, only found references to dogs, not cats, in the PIAA's policy .

OT, but re dogs, it totally misses the point that what happens before & at point of sale affects what happens for dogs afterwards. Bit late when they're in a pound.

There may be other information re cats, somewhere on the PIAA website, but I haven't found it yet.

Best guidelines I've seen about the responsibilites of buying and keeping a cat, are on the website of a Q'ld feline association.

Edited March 11, 2012 by mita

[BJean]

There is a problem with feral animals & it has to be considered what are the most humane methods to cull.

But I agree with PS & Bartok, I find a photo of someone so relishing their 'kill' distasteful & disturbing.

Relishing?????? That is your interpretation of people or a person in photo where you have not idea what was going on in their minds so it is unlikely you have guessed correctly that they are "relishing" their kill.

Oh to be that psychic.

lol @ DF

:laugh: