Dog Attack Ashcroft Today

[Rocketeer]

Its saying the owner says they are Amstaffs, look more like bulldog mix to me, and they will be pts today or tommorrow.

Why can't they hold them till they can do some research into why it happened, then pts, it makes no sense to me to just keep killing dogs without finding out why it happens.

Amstaff seems to be the new "unidentified bull type breed", especially in Victoria.

Seems like the case. Look at all the so called "Amstaffs" on gumtree. Majority of these so called Amstaffs are also from the shitty areas of town.

[Loving my Oldies]

I would like to ask "how many of the above posters have ever received an intentional-bite from a large breed dog??".

The reason I ask is that until you have, you would have no idea of the damage that can be inflicted with just one bite, let alone a sustained attack.

I brought this up in another one of these threads where most people seem to forget about the victim and go all out at the media and the public for calling "every" dog who attacks a pitbull or type.

Reaction? Zero.

I wasn't nearly as badly hurt as you were, but still needed seven stitches and taping of several puncture wounds. And the dog: a little maltese cross type. The poor little thing was mentally damaged and was euthanised, but if a little dog can do that, when I see some of these dogs who attack and maul people, frankly, the people must be basket cases if not forever, at least for a long long time.

[korbin13]

Breed aside. What makes dogs do this? Would they have shown aggression towards people before this?

[mac'ella]

Breed aside. What makes dogs do this? Would they have shown aggression towards people before this?

yes they had,but only as far as charging the fence at people walking past,but enough to make some people walk the long way round to avoid them,the dogs came from Harrison street and the attack occurred on the corner of Day street which runs between Maxwells Ave and Harrison,ironically Day street is where my mothers 3mth old Gordon Setter was attacked by a large Mastiff cross years ago while she was walking past,it was on lead but the owner didn't have a firm grip and wasnt paying attention to the dog while talking to friends,this is accross the road from the entrance to a primary school so probably fortunate in some ways that it happenned on a week end

[inez]

When I was a kid there were times when packs of dogs could be so big they interfered with traffic.

Usually happend when a bitch on heat was left loose.

Loose dogs is not a new problem.

The mix of breeds around now certainly is.

The breeds clogging our streets in 1960 were border collies, kelpies, german shepherds dalmation and toy and terrier breeds.

Today we have so many huge protection and dog fighthing breeds now here that never were here before to add to the mix fully capable of killing a full grown man let alone a child.

Anyone who has bred dogs knows how merciless a pack attack is. Its just not talked about.

They are just as merciless to another dog.

http://news.ninemsn.com.au/national/2013/05/27/16/03/dog-attack-victim-s-injuries-worst-ever-seen

Viewing that footage, that dog is a ringer in appearance to the photo that proud owner of his APB puppy he brought to me to be microchipped.

SO that is one person who had a photo of a pair of dogs that looked like the dogs in this news release who was told by its breeder it was a pure APB .

This chap admitted the reason he had to replace his previous dogs was because the police had made him have them put down because they had killed a dog that ran at his dogs while on leash and he was unable to stop them killing it the second it ran within reach of them.

Frankly I dont care what breed it is if it will kill even while the owner is holding the leash, I wish it wasnt in this country.

As others have said its tragic

[kima]

That is just horrific.

I think euthanising the dogs immediately was the right call.

Personally I'd support a change in the legislation so owners of dogs who caused serious injury or death when on public property were charged with manslaughter or similar level charges. A maximum of 2 years in jail in this case doesn't cut it.

I agree 100%.

culpable driving carries much higher penalties. The sort of negligence and lack of regard for public safety associated with dog attacks should be treated no differently, 2 years is nothing when you have destroyed lives.

Even though this man was fortunate enough to live, I cannot imagine the impact such a traumatic event will have on him for the rest of his life.

[Her Majesty Dogmad]

I have lived in this suburb for 12 years and have not been fearful of walking around until the last 12 months.

Now I'm hedged in by people with bull breeds who don't keep them in. What to do? I have little dogs and often like to walk them together. A neighbour came around to wonder why they hadn't seen me walking for some weeks.

True, I have been unwell over the last few months but it isn't that, it's become so very risky for me and I don't wish to have my dogs mauled or killed.

It simply shouldn't be that way.

[Loving my Oldies]

Even though this man was fortunate enough to live, I cannot imagine the impact such a traumatic event will have on him for the rest of his life.

The human body is a wonderful thing and its ability to heal amazing. This man was probably very fit, but from the tv pix of him, there doesn't seem to be much of him. His fitness will probably stand him in good stead, but the fact that his heart was exposed, and his injuries so horrific, I expect he will be subject to recurring medical problems from now on.

The smallest dog bite can take a long long time to heal and the chance of infection is very real also for a long time.

He also would be in the most awful pain at the moment as well despite the super painkillers available today.

And I would hate to be in his head when he goes to sleep.

I hope he has a caring circle of friends and family to support him through this dreadful event.

[korbin13]

Breed aside. What makes dogs do this? Would they have shown aggression towards people before this?

yes they had,but only as far as charging the fence at people walking past,but enough to make some people walk the long way round to avoid them,the dogs came from Harrison street and the attack occurred on the corner of Day street which runs between Maxwells Ave and Harrison,ironically Day street is where my mothers 3mth old Gordon Setter was attacked by a large Mastiff cross years ago while she was walking past,it was on lead but the owner didn't have a firm grip and wasnt paying attention to the dog while talking to friends,this is accross the road from the entrance to a primary school so probably fortunate in some ways that it happenned on a week end

Plenty of dogs charge at fences, it doesn't make them aggressive to humans.

I'm interested to know if these dogs would have shown any sign that they were capable of attacking someone? What makes dogs do this?

[redangel]

In light of these attacks & the rising amount of severe injuries...likely with ongoing problems for earnings etc...in the case of a human I foresee it wont be long until dog registrations are raised to include mandatory insurance, yes it wont help those who don't register, ( a penalty to those who work hard to make their dogs good companion animals) but none the less Im sure it will become a reality one day.

[kima]

Even though this man was fortunate enough to live, I cannot imagine the impact such a traumatic event will have on him for the rest of his life.

The human body is a wonderful thing and its ability to heal amazing. This man was probably very fit, but from the tv pix of him, there doesn't seem to be much of him. His fitness will probably stand him in good stead, but the fact that his heart was exposed, and his injuries so horrific, I expect he will be subject to recurring medical problems from now on.

The smallest dog bite can take a long long time to heal and the chance of infection is very real also for a long time.

He also would be in the most awful pain at the moment as well despite the super painkillers available today.

And I would hate to be in his head when he goes to sleep.

I hope he has a caring circle of friends and family to support him through this dreadful event.

With any luck he will physically make a good recovery, however it was more the emotional trauma I was referring to.

To be just going about your business and be attacked in such a way would be so hard to reconcile with. In the paper it said he attack lasted for about 5 minutes, to endure that amount of pain and fear for such an extended period of time is bound to have a lasting impact. I can't even begin to imagine what that must have been like.

I agree with you though, loving and supportive friends and family can make a world of difference.

[BlackJaq]

Surely finding out why it happens would make no difference to whether these dogs would be put to sleep.

That is not being said. A couple of posters have suggested that experts be brought in to examine the dogs, where they lived, what sort of environment (physical and emotional) that they lived in, and then do autopsies on the dogs.

Experts might be involved. I certainly know that one at least was involved in the Ayen Chol case. Don't think it was reported on the TV but I work with her hubby.

Have you read the Coroner's report on that incident? Because I have. Go ahead and read what the "expert" found, it will make you laugh and cry all at the same time.... There were indicators suggesting the dog was kept chained on concrete and it had large ulcerated pressure sores. There was no fence or gate mentioned between where the dog was kept and the garage door, which necessarily has to open to admit the car..... They very specifically refused to do any further investigation into the dog's health, they did a visual inspection of the carcass only. No temp test.

The whole thing was a farce and the cause of the attack was determined to be the breed, which was "pitbull"........... Would be funny if the topic was not so serious. If I were a parent of that child I would publically blast this incompetent coroner for that incompetent report and the lack of answers it brought! What a waste of money and time.

Edited May 27, 2013 by BlackJaq

[nawnim]

Breed aside. What makes dogs do this? Would they have shown aggression towards people before this?

yes they had,but only as far as charging the fence at people walking past,but enough to make some people walk the long way round to avoid them,the dogs came from Harrison street and the attack occurred on the corner of Day street which runs between Maxwells Ave and Harrison,ironically Day street is where my mothers 3mth old Gordon Setter was attacked by a large Mastiff cross years ago while she was walking past,it was on lead but the owner didn't have a firm grip and wasnt paying attention to the dog while talking to friends,this is accross the road from the entrance to a primary school so probably fortunate in some ways that it happenned on a week end

Plenty of dogs charge at fences, it doesn't make them aggressive to humans.

I'm interested to know if these dogs would have shown any sign that they were capable of attacking someone? What makes dogs do this?

Charging at fences is aggressive behaviour and something should be done about it before it escalates.

[nawnim]

I have lived in this suburb for 12 years and have not been fearful of walking around until the last 12 months.

Now I'm hedged in by people with bull breeds who don't keep them in. What to do? I have little dogs and often like to walk them together. A neighbour came around to wonder why they hadn't seen me walking for some weeks.

True, I have been unwell over the last few months but it isn't that, it's become so very risky for me and I don't wish to have my dogs mauled or killed.

It simply shouldn't be that way.

I agree totally. It simply shouldn't be that way.

[minimax]

Heard on the radio this morning that the dogs have been PTS.

http://www.smh.com.au/nsw/dog-owner-fined-four-months-before-jogger-attacked-20130527-2n6p8.html

Edited May 27, 2013 by minimax

[GeckoTree]

In light of these attacks & the rising amount of severe injuries...likely with ongoing problems for earnings etc...in the case of a human I foresee it wont be long until dog registrations are raised to include mandatory insurance, yes it wont help those who don't register, ( a penalty to those who work hard to make their dogs good companion animals) but none the less Im sure it will become a reality one day.

Petplans liability insurance cover is up to 5 million but it's cover for those with the money to cover.

People have the ability to take out insurance on themselves for injury and disability if they so want.

[nawnim]

In light of these attacks & the rising amount of severe injuries...likely with ongoing problems for earnings etc...in the case of a human I foresee it wont be long until dog registrations are raised to include mandatory insurance, yes it wont help those who don't register, ( a penalty to those who work hard to make their dogs good companion animals) but none the less Im sure it will become a reality one day.

Petplans liability insurance cover is up to 5 million but it's cover for those with the money to cover.

People have the ability to take out insurance on themselves for injury and disability if they so want.

Pet liability insurance is just shutting the door after the horse has bolted, and it just gives insurance companies another source of income. Lower income people will no longer be able to afford a dog and will miss out on the wonderful companionship dogs provide. Also innocent people will still get mauled and even killed.

[Loving my Oldies]

Pet liability insurance is just shutting the door after the horse has bolted, and it just gives insurance companies another source of income. Lower income people will no longer be able to afford a dog and will miss out on the wonderful companionship dogs provide. Also innocent people will still get mauled and even killed.

I agree with you in cases such as this one. But unforeseen events do occur .... which is why we have insurance :).

[Wobbly]

In the heat of the moment, many people couldn't differentiate between a Nissan Patrol or a Toyota Land cruiser in a hit and run. Funnily enough if people can't identify them the media doesn't report that all 4WDs are Land cruisers, just because it's a large vehicle fitting that description and that's why I hate the term pitbull being applied to a particular appearance. Not all people that drive 4WDs own Land cruisers, not all people that own bull breeds have a 'pitbull'. Not all people that own one of both of these things are irresponsible.

Large cars like that do more damage in an accident, even though the road laws are the same owning a big car comes with added responsibility.

Owning a big dog, especially a bull breed comes with added responsibility.

True fighting pitulls aren't really a dog with one definite look about them, they range in size, conformation, colour. Unless you know the dog's origins even someone from the dog community would have difficulty positively identifying one.

I worry when people start calling them nanny dogs and getting all defensive about how their pitbull is gentle, reliable and great with kids. Because not every individual one will be great with kids and it's not necessarily how all about how you raise them. You may raise them spot on to be a family pet, but they still may not be great around kids. It's about knowing your dog and knowing it's limitations and only putting it in situations where it will never be a risk. Some people that defend pitbulls are doing them no favors by making inaccurate generalizations.

I have a staffordshire bull terrier that is not dog park material, she gets on fine with our other dogs, cats and small animals is even doing off lead exercises at training. But the dog park excites her way too much to keep her under effective control. You put any random breed in a situation that excites or frightens it you are setting yourself up for failure.

Who do you think you are, being so sensible and clear minded! :laugh:

In a pack... all bets are off. Even a really great sheepdog, who has spent it's life working sheep, if it goes off in a pack of other dogs, can and will kill sheep if that's what the pack is doing. This was a pack of dogs, not really surprising they went on a rampage, not much else for them to do if they're at large in suburbia really, the only target they have when they're in a pack and on the warpath is people. Given inadequate socialisation, people can look like a pretty attractive target to a pack of big dogs, especially running people.

I own this kind of dog. Every time I hear of an attack featuring very serious injuries, my heart sinks because I just know a bully breed is going to be held responsible. It pretty much always is, simply because they're the most common (in Australia) of the breeds that are powerful enough to inflict this kind of damage. Other breeds attack with the same frequency, but can't do near the same amount of damage, so no hospitalisations or media frenzies with them. Bullys aren't more inclined to attack than other dogs, but they can do a hell of a lot more damage if they do. It is a lot more responsibility to own one.

I have changed my mind recently on this issue - breed is absolutely relevant to dog attacks IMO - it determines how powerful the dog is and how much damage it can do.

We do need better laws. BSL as it stands is daft, it makes even the most responsible owners of lie to avoid the regulations. My dog's microchip is a lie, it makes me sad it has to be so. It should say, in all honesty "x breed, pit bull type".

Doing away with BSL and making all owners of dogs larger than 25kg attend a management seminar (with their dogs) as part of registration might help as a first step. Encourage owners of powerful breeds to comply with management standards through carrot (education), not stick (breed bans). Make the required seminar something that would appeal to people, it's easy to make education appealing, even the most bogan of bogans will attend a defensive driving course of their own volition, people like to gain more proficiency in their fascinations, so even official govt. channels education courses can appeal if correctly structured and marketed. The responsible owners will attend the required seminar, and in attending, won't be penalised for their breed type. They can also be informed about adequate socialisation, management and containment, and learn to identify the behaviours that indicate potential aggressive behaviour, and the different types of aggression.

The really irresponsible owners who won't attend a day's registration seminar with their dogs, won't have their dogs registered, that lack of registration can give some indication to rangers and councils the dogs and owners who really do bear watching. Massive fines for those avoiding registration. Perhaps mandatory temperament assessment of dogs found to be unregistered (why have they avoided registration? can they not manage their dogs in a seminar environment?) before the owner can go through the registration process and reclaim their dog.

Expensive for councils? Yes. But less expensive than the current crop of BSL court cases.

It is a lot more responsibility to own a powerful breed, and owners of bully breeds, and any other similarly high drive, powerful breeds should be required to demonstrate they can adhere to the level of responsibility required for basic safety before they are extended the privilege of ownership of these dogs. Requiring attendence at a seminar for registration demonstrates some capacity for responsibility. We don't let just anyone drive a road train, prospective drivers must undergo education about safety and management before they are licensed. This approach works, people who want to drive a road train can, provided they complete the educational (licensing) requirements. Same approach would work for people who want to own large powerful dogs, allow it on proviso that they have demonstrate basic competence and responsibility.

[twodoggies2001]

Just watching the video clip showing the young woman tells us the type of people the owners are. These dogs were lethal weapons in their hands. Unregistered, had warnings regarding the dogs and it still didn't make a difference and most likely it won't in the future. Even though these these dogs have lost their right to exist, it probably wasn't entirely their fault that this tragedy happened. I've said it before,and I'll say it again, it's the owners that need to be licenced, not the animal in question.