Dog Crates Are Cruel And Dogs Hate Them

[*kirty*]

I work at a vet clinic, and its always a pleasure to have crate trained dogs in hospital! Dogs who are not used to being crated often get very distressed while in the cages before and after surgery. Some are so bad and get so stressed that the nurses have to hold them on their laps or keep them on a lead all day! The ones who have been crated usually just go to sleep in the cages.

[Guest donatella]

I would find it strange to lock a dog in a crate while I was at work - for up to 8 hours or so. What if there was a fire - the poor dog wouldn't stand a chance. But I wonder for those who don't crate train at all how do these dogs get on when they have to be crated at the vets or groomers?

I never crate trained Lucy and this is something that pops into my mind. The groomer thing I have sorted as my groomers don't crate the dogs and I only ever book her in when I can pick her up immediately when she's done anyway.

The vet thing could be a concern however she's only been crated once at the vets to be speyed and she was grogged out of her mind and it didn't bother her. I presume if she ever has to be crated at the vets she will be very unwell and wont be in any state to be arguing about it.

I think she'd take to a crate actually as her favourite hidey hole is under my bed.

Its not so much at the vets, but if she needs to be crated following an operation or injury. Lots of little dogs have patella problems and I believe the post op recovery is something like 6 weeks crate rest

If I thought she would get distressed or be unable to cope with a crate I would more then likely introduce to ensure if any of the above happened we would be set.

I do however believe she would cope though. When she was going through a chewing phase she was babygated from half the house and never made a peep. I know thats nothing like a crate but she's not one to make a noise about having her limits cut off. She also spends a lot of her time sleeping under my bed. If she were injured I do believe a crate covered up nice and dark would actually be quite inviting to her.

I live in a townhouse at the moment and don't have the room to set up a crate, nor the inclination and whilst people love their crates I don't like people pushing them either. Yes they work, and that is great, does not mean that every dog owner should feel peer pressured into using them if they have their own system that works for them :D

ETA: I'm looking to a new pup in the next sort of 6 months (if I can hold off that long) and crating is definitely something I'll look into. Might try the 2 birds with 1 stone approach :laugh:

Edited July 21, 2012 by donatella

[Guest donatella]

I work at a vet clinic, and its always a pleasure to have crate trained dogs in hospital! Dogs who are not used to being crated often get very distressed while in the cages before and after surgery. Some are so bad and get so stressed that the nurses have to hold them on their laps or keep them on a lead all day! The ones who have been crated usually just go to sleep in the cages.

A crate trained dog MIGHT get stressed at the vets if it has separation anxiety, is confused etc. Just because its crate trained doesn't mean its going to behave like a perfect angel (but i'm sure it helps!).

[twodoggies2001]

I think crates are wonderful. To me it's a godsend. When we brought our new puppy home at 8 weeks the breeder commented that he had never been in a crate before, so I dreaded the first night. At bed time I put him in at around 11pm. and didn't hear from him until 7.30 the following morning. He happily goes into the crate each night and when we have to go out during the day for a couple of hours or so. I wouldn't trust him in the house unrestrained when I'm not there to supervise. At least I know where he is.

[OSoSwift]

At the moment I have one who is crated from TPLO surgery, don't hear a peep from her, I am very glad she is crate trained. We still have some time to go! The otehr one is crate trained but I still he would still find it difficult if he had to be crated at the vets by himself. I have always told them they have him they get her as well or they would hate me :)

His issue is not the crating as he was crate trained from a young age, his issue was he had never been without human or canine company until I got him at 8 months of age and started training him to crate by himself and be in the dog run (next to another dog) by himself. We went through some moments and he has slightly damaged some teeth biting at wire and trying to get out, but I can leave him in the dog run totally by himself now without an issue - thankgoodness.

I never leave my dogs inside when I go out as I have a house fire phobia and as we live rurally they are safer int heri dog runs, green grass yard than in the hosue should a fire go through.

[mita]

I would find it strange to lock a dog in a crate while I was at work - for up to 8 hours or so. What if there was a fire - the poor dog wouldn't stand a chance. But I wonder for those who don't crate train at all how do these dogs get on when they have to be crated at the vets or groomers?

I never crate trained Lucy and this is something that pops into my mind. The groomer thing I have sorted as my groomers don't crate the dogs and I only ever book her in when I can pick her up immediately when she's done anyway.

I'd look for some alternative to having my dog in a crate for 8 hours straight per day. We're lucky to have neighbours who also have a tibbie and we have a mutual arrangement that we give each others dogs a break out in the garden after every 3 hours....if owners are out.

But, having said that, our dogs have a large crate that they can share (with their best mate, the cat) when it's necessary to keep them safe when work's been done and tradespeople going in and out. As ex-show dogs, they were made accustomed to that.

I think that's the trick....training dogs to use crates so they become positive places to be. The RSPCA Qld dog behaviour unit sent me some excellent guidelines on how to do this. This kind of material should be circulated among pet owners because it explains how to 'crate' responsibly and happily (for the dog). And avoid any misuse.

Re the fire angle.....I have one of those external notices that alert emergency services about the pets & where they are.

My groomers have a great set-up, with a secure little courtyard behind the grooming room, for those littlies who like to socialise & play.

My tibbie girl always bounces up out of the courtyard as soon as she hears my voice!

[keetamouse]

I have all my fosters in crates at night, I can have anything up to 3 in one crate, don't hear a word all night, from memory I think out of 450 dogs I have had come through my place in 11 years only a hand full have taken a couple of nights to get used to it.

They all get fed in the crates (one at a time of course :laugh: ) so they associate the crate with getting fed.

I also lend a crate to the new owners so that the dog is settled for the first week or so, 90% of new owners go and buy one themselves.

I also separate my dogs when I go out during the day, which is only for a couple of hours, I do worry about the fire thing though.

Maree

CPR

[Andisa]

I hate crates too when I know they are being miss used - like anything, great when used correctly and harmful when abused.

There is only one jumbo crate set up full time in my home, my dogs "hate" the crate so much that I often find 2 Rottweilers trying to fit in one jumbo crate and the other laying outside of it - so I suppose it must be really awful. The only time I close the door is if they are eating or when there is a bitch in season.

[Pheebs]

Maggie just adores her crate. Knowing what I do of her background I think she's just stoked that she still gets the chance to be inside amongst the family.

Lucy's not the hugest fan but she will still go in willingly. It's saved my sanity in terms of being able to feed them all together (when we had the three) whilst still keeping them separated.

[Sares]

I work at a vet clinic, and its always a pleasure to have crate trained dogs in hospital! Dogs who are not used to being crated often get very distressed while in the cages before and after surgery. Some are so bad and get so stressed that the nurses have to hold them on their laps or keep them on a lead all day! The ones who have been crated usually just go to sleep in the cages.

thats part the reason I decided to crate train my dog. She was spayed a few weeks ago and the vet said she was so good after her surgery.

Also if anything were to happen to her and she needed strict rest, there is not way I could keep her quiet and calm without the crate. So I wanted her to be used to it just in case I ever had to put her on crate rest.

Another good thing we found out it was handy is she was being puppy-sat by friends for a few nights and they found it handy to have the crate so that the older dogs that she was staying with could get some rest as she is still a puppy and was always harrassing the older dogs to play with her.

My dog is hardly ever locked in her crate, it sits in our loungeroom with the door open for her to lie in it whenever she wants. We only close the door on the odd occasion for her saftey (eg- workmen working on parts of the house).

I think crates are great, when used for the right reasons and not being over-used.

[Maddy]

We try to crate train all our fosters. When you're feeding 4+ large dogs in the smallish area, crates can make it a lot less stressful for everyone (and a lot safer). I wouldn't push a dog to accept a crate though, some adult dogs just don't feel comfortable with the confined space so if that's the case, we leave it at that.

When it works though.. :p We had one dog that would rush to the crate if I walked too close to it and pose himself in front of the door, waiting to be let in- he was just trained with marrow bones and excluding him from it when there was nothing valuable (in terms of food) to go in there with him.

We're currently crate training a greyhound puppy and so far, the only issue we've really had is getting him to come back out when we ask him to. I think the issue there may have been that we made the crate too appealing- it's a soft crate with a memory foam crate mat, a layer of vetbed and then a large cushion bed up the back- so for a greyhound, not much incentive to get up. We also don't shut the door unless we have to go out briefly (and can't take him) or when he needs some quiet time.

The cruelty issue really depends on how you crate and why you crate. I'm sure there are people who misuse the tool but then, same goes for check chains, head halters and plenty of other training tools. If the dog is happy, I see no problem with it.

PETA seem to be against it just because it involves a cage, of sorts, and a restriction of "freedom". Of course, coming from people who kill dogs to "free" them from oppression.. meh, even if they were making good points, they lost me at "PETA".

[ruthjones]

Geez, I must be terribly cruel then, my dogs do get crated.

In the car

Vet trips etc

Heck, I must be inhumane, I am crate training my litter of pups! By that I mean that they have a small crate (pp20) in their pen, it's door is stuck full open at the moment (intentionally)

W move on to actually having them in with a shut door for a few minutes each this week and gradually increasing it to a usable time.

Even more horrific, all puppies that leave must go in a crate for the journey home and aren't allowed to travel loose!

Anyway, I better go back to my dastardly deeds!

Ruth

[JulesP]

I have 2 dog beds and the crate in the kitchen. There is always one dog in the crate. It appears to be the prized sleeping place.

[Jetson]

Jetson was never crate trained but he will choose to sleep in Rockets crate.

[Tassie]

LOL - a lot of cruel owners and badly treated dogs at an agility trial yesterday - although since most of them were sound asleep, they probably didn't notice :laugh: . I didn't know about crates for my first dogs I had as an adult - but love them now. The dogs clearly love the concept too - the safe den - or why would my goofy BC boy squeeze himself into his cavvy friend's (fortunately unoccupied) crate at an ob trial, when he could have just relaxed on the mat beside my chair.

One of the things I find fascinating is that dogs, who supposedly don't generalise very well, have no trouble in generalising the concept of crate as den. To me that suggests that they see a high value in the den-ness of crates - they can generalise hard crate/soft crate/show trolley with no apparent problems.

[RubyBlue]

I was so annoyed with the poster that PETA were circulating, and the ignorant comments that followed, I wrote an article on our Rescue website: here.

Well written!

I had to buy a second crate for my adult dog after I kept finding her curled up in the puppy s crate. To me that speaks volumes about the dogs attitude towards her "cage"!

[knitmehappy]

I can see the advantages of using a crate in various circumstances. I spend a lot of time on a forum with a lot of US users and they seem to use crates quite differently to the way I would envisage to be healthy for the dog. They seem to be used to contain the dog while the owners work full time and if the dog displays behaviour such as chewing, soiling etc. In my very limited dog experience crating the dog for 8-10 hours every day will do nothing to teach it acceptable behaviour or enrich its environment. I can see how using it for periods when the dog needs timeout or cannot be supervised would be great.

My Buddy recently had a stay in hospital and the crate simply wasn't an issue, even though I don't think he's ever seen one before. We just put him in the crate, he was sick and miserable and went in and stayed without any dramas. Stopping him from gnawing on the IV line was another matter. Of course, any other dog may have found it stressful.

Pretty much anything can be used punitively. I bet there are bad people out there treating their dogs badly while on leash. Most dog owners use a leash for its intended purpose, to walk the dog in a controlled fashion and to keep it safe. Yes, in a perfect world the dog would walk at heel without the need for anyone to use a lead, no dog would ever chase anything or run into the road, or poo in other peoples yards....but that doesn't mean that the rest of us defective dog owners are being mean using a lead because we haven't managed to train the dog into perfection.......where am I going with this? Leash- when used properly,good. bad when used to strangle or beat dog.

Crate= good when used correctly, bad when used as doggy jail.

The piece of equipment isn't really the issue, but the use to which it is put.

[Wobbly]

The piece of equipment isn't really the issue, but the use to which it is put.

Yep so true, my dog sleeps in her crate, she's not locked in, the door is always open, she just likes to sleep in it. I encourage it because if I'm ever in a situation where she needs to be crated, taking her to live overseas or something (it's an airline crate), the move will be less traumatic because she feels secure and comfortable in the crate.

[minimax]

Someone on my FB posted a pic of a human squashed into a dog crate, with the dog looking on saying "not much fun, is it?" and I'm resisting the urge to comment on all the things wrong with that picture so as not to create drama, but seriously.

Actually, it wasn't even a friend, it was a company I "like"! Hey Pup - Pet Linen & Bedding. Odd thing for a pet bed companny to put up!

[tdierikx]

I used to think crates were cruel... until I had occasion to need to use one...

My dogs love theirs, and all my fosters are crate trained too. I wouldn't ever be without a few in different sizes now.

T.